What is considered bad RP?

[SMuz]

OK, gotta help me and the other newbies out here, because some of us aren't sure which are acceptable and which aren't.

Spam-mining, cutting trees? Without emoting.

Sleeping in the middle of the road, after an exhausting day outside? In a sandstorm?

Going against clan rules (not doing duty) when you know that the senior ranking clan members aren't around? What if you're in a small unit and your bosses just died or got transferred to another city?

Peeking/stealing from NPCs, but not from PCs? Vice versa?

Spam kicking/disarm in a battle to the death?

Cooking things without starting an actual fire? Or are all those pieces of bread really just uncooked dough?

Stealing the pants off someone who's asleep?

Haggling right up to the point where merchants get pissed, before accepting?

Disconnecting as soon as the RP gets boring.. if you're selling things and the stores won't buy more.. in the weekends/night if your clan is training.. if you're hunting and the animals haven't "respawned"..

[Yam]

OK, gotta help me and the other newbies out here, because some of us aren't sure which are acceptable and which aren't.

Spam-mining, cutting trees? Without emoting.

Mostly.

Sleeping in the middle of the road, after an exhausting day outside? In a sandstorm?

Yeah.

Going against clan rules (not doing duty) when you know that the senior ranking clan members aren't around? What if you're in a small unit and your bosses just died or got transferred to another city?

No.

Peeking/stealing from NPCs, but not from PCs? Vice versa?

Maybe.

Spam kicking/disarm in a battle to the death?

No.

Cooking things without starting an actual fire? Or are all those pieces of bread really just uncooked dough?

No.

Stealing the pants off someone who's asleep?

Most definitely not. This is pretty much the pinnacle of Byn roleplay.

Haggling right up to the point where merchants get pissed, before accepting?

Nope.

Disconnecting as soon as the RP gets boring.. if you're selling things and the stores won't buy more.. in the weekends/night if your clan is training.. if you're hunting and the animals haven't "respawned"..

No.

[Cutthroat]

Also,

In the real world, we hardly ever see people going around mindlessly killing things, acquiring wealth, and never stopping to sleep, eat, drink, or socialise ... and if we do, they soon end up either dead or in a prison or mental institution. The same applies for Zalanthas (except that death is a far more prevalent treatment for such deluded behaviour).

Role-playing does not mean that all you are allowed to do is have your character sit around and talk to other characters all day. But it does mean that the staff expect you to try to play realistically. Thus, you should spend a fair amount of time playing out your character's occupation, but also spend time talking to people, walking around town, dining, scavenging, sleeping, and so on (whatever is appropriate for your character). Although it is just a game, try to imagine yourself as your character, and act as your character while in the game.

Think: would your character, for example, lie down and fall asleep in the middle of the road outside in stinging sand, where it's possible to get run over by the next carru/tarantula/argosy? Probably not... anyway, apply this same thinking to any other action you do and you should be fine. Hope that helps 

[Jingo]

A lot of these are circumstancial.

There's nothing wrong with shirking duties even if you boss is not online just so long as you don't only do it when your boss is online.

As far as cooking goes, there is nothing wrong with emoting up your own virtual fire, rather than a coded one. Hell, there's nothing wrong with emoting tossing your meat onto a rock and letting it cook in the sun.

It would be difficult to pull of in real life. But I wouldn't even have a problem if you stole my pants in my sleep, so long as you emote your actions outloud so they can echo in my sleep. That way I can choose to wake up and catch you in midsteal or stay in my drunken slumber.

Spamming skills in combat can be a death sentence, just so you know. If you really want to do it, I won't mind if you put out a thoughtful emote for every action you try to perform. I think I've met an npc or two that wouldn't even do that.

And finally, nobody expects you to play if you're bored. There's no shame in logging off if there's nothing happening, so long as you don't just log in for skill-training sessions and nothing else.

I didn't cover everything, but yeah. That's the way I see it. In general, remember to interact with the world through emotes, thinks and feels rather than just intereract with the game code.

[Cerelum]

OK, gotta help me and the other newbies out here, because some of us aren't sure which are acceptable and which aren't.

Spam-mining, cutting trees? Without emoting.

I have always felt that emotes are for the outside audience, so if you're by yourself spamming away, providing it's not for 8 hours in a row, then I think it's fine.  If someone else is with you, you should be emoting at least a bit.

Sleeping in the middle of the road, after an exhausting day outside? In a sandstorm?

I wouldn't consider this bad rp, but I would consider this extremely dangerous and would probably type wake dude, tell dude (gesturing around himself) Are you fuckin crazy man?

Going against clan rules (not doing duty) when you know that the senior ranking clan members aren't around? What if you're in a small unit and your bosses just died or got transferred to another city?

No, some of the best rp is when you're disobeying rules.

Peeking/stealing from NPCs, but not from PCs? Vice versa?

From NPCS yes, because there has to be an active staffer to get the appropriate reaction from the npc half the time, but if you're doing this from players, and surviving, kudos to you.

Spam kicking/disarm in a battle to the death?

Not in a battle to the death, but if you're sparring with your bynner clanmate, yep.

Cooking things without starting an actual fire? Or are all those pieces of bread really just uncooked dough?

No, but you should goto a cooking area and emote using a fire if it's something you would actually cook, if it's peeling a fruit into sections that's cool anywhere.  But if you're making a scrab steak in the middle of the road, there is an issue.

Stealing the pants off someone who's asleep?

No, that actually sounds like something fun to do.

Haggling right up to the point where merchants get pissed, before accepting?

No, that's the best way TO haggle.

Disconnecting as soon as the RP gets boring.. if you're selling things and the stores won't buy more.. in the weekends/night if your clan is training.. if you're hunting and the animals haven't "respawned"..

Rp getting boring, nope.  Selling things and stores won't buy, yep, if you're not looking for rp before you jump ship.  Hunting and the animals haven't respawned is sorta twinkish to log and come back just to find more, but eh, I am of the feeling about hunting should be able to be done as much as you want, I'm not on the whole "don't overhunt" party.

[Synthesis]

Emoting != RP.

If I'm out digging for rocks and nobody is (apparently) around, I don't emote.

Why?  After ten years of emoting about looking for rocks...it gets reeeeeal old.

I'll save the dramatic digging and fumbling around for when other PCs are nearby.

[mansa]

Emoting != RP.

If I'm out digging for rocks and nobody is (apparently) around, I don't emote.

Why?  After ten years of emoting about looking for rocks...it gets reeeeeal old.

I'll save the dramatic digging and fumbling around for when other PCs are nearby.

Use scripts like everybody else, man.

[Shiroi Tsuki]

I emote when I'm by myself all the time. 

In the first place, you never know when someone is watching, whether it's someone sneaking in the room with you, an Immortal, some sort of unnatural, or.. well, you just never know.  In the second, my emotes help keep me focused and in character.  Half of the time I emote it it's intended just as much to keep me in the mood as it is for anyone else around to get an idea of what my character's doing.

[Rairen]

I emote when I'm by myself all the time. 

In the first place, you never know when someone is watching, whether it's someone sneaking in the room with you, an Immortal, some sort of unnatural, or.. well, you just never know.  In the second, my emotes help keep me focused and in character.  Half of the time I emote it it's intended just as much to keep me in the mood as it is for anyone else around to get an idea of what my character's doing.

I've played long stretches of solo-RP roles, and it's jaded me a bit to the experience.  I rather wish that, if someone's watching for entertainment value, they could give some sort of subtle nod that they're there.  It'd motivate me, rather than trying to fill four hours constantly for several weeks, and I'm a fairly responsible player who rather enjoys having her characters knocked around and wouldn't abuse the knowledge.   (I'm a fast typer and usually go into a solo scene knowing what I want to do.  Can get it all out in fifteen to thirty minutes.  Anymore, I have to emote, go check the GDB, check the news, emote, read through the news again... just to keep the scene drawing out so that I don't run out of things to do.  I'd cut that stuff out if someone was there who cared.)

[Jingo]

It's something I'm trying to work on myself, I tend to fall into the trap of just spamming commands in my solo scenes.

But in the context of this thread, it's better to emote than not to. Especially if you're worried you're spamming, or if it's a bit twinkish.

[spicemustflow]

I never got the purpose of solo rp before, but forced myself to try it, and found that it's a great tool for motivating and amusing yourself. It makes me feel like I'm really there. But if I even think that somebody might be watching, I panic and get the urge to lose link.

[UnderSeven]

I disagree on the collpasing in the middle of the road one.  That could be very good rp.  If you have 20 move points (as s gross example) and drag yourself back to the compound, I mean does that really express your chars fatigue?  Maybe collpasing in the road (despite the dangers) if played out properly would be the better rp option here.

[Reiloth]

Bad RP is doing something IG due to OOC motivations, concerns, information, or reactions.

-Not killing a PC because it is your RL friend's PC
-Logging in to save your RL friend's PC
-Wishing up on behalf of another player
-Transmitting IC knowledge OOCly

In other words, if you are trying to play the character, I have no qualms with how you do it.

If you are trying to powergame, or play the 'game', then that is not really good RP at all.

[Clearsighted]

Bad RP is doing something IG due to OOC motivations, concerns, information, or reactions.

-Not killing a PC because it is your RL friend's PC
-Logging in to save your RL friend's PC
-Wishing up on behalf of another player
-Transmitting IC knowledge OOCly

In other words, if you are trying to play the character, I have no qualms with how you do it.

If you are trying to powergame, or play the 'game', then that is not really good RP at all.

What do you mean by wishing up on behalf of another player?

I've wished up to try and get people to be 'force quit' in an quit safe area after going link dead outside the walls.

Though, I've never actually had any response.

[musashi]

I would say that so long as your PC is behaving like a person IRL would under similiar circumstances, then you're in the gold.

To me it feels like saying anything more precise than that leaves you open to the "what if this circumstnace happened" type response.

[Xagon]

What if your character couldn't react, because they were a paraplegic? Huh? What then?

Erhm.. I think bad RP is when you act on -your- behalf, as opposed to your characters behalf. This general term seems to fit well, both here and in a D&D group I play in.

If you use "metagame" knowledge to do something with your character, that's bad RP.
If you play your character a certain way, then change due to OOC circumstances, that's bad RP.

If you know someone killed your last character, and build up your current one to take revenge..
If you find that sacred metal vein somewhere with one character, then "assault" it with your next who -should- know nothing about it..
If you spam-kill without an IC reason, cease when eyes are on you, and resume once they're off...

[Reiloth]

Bad RP is doing something IG due to OOC motivations, concerns, information, or reactions.

-Not killing a PC because it is your RL friend's PC
-Logging in to save your RL friend's PC
-Wishing up on behalf of another player
-Transmitting IC knowledge OOCly

In other words, if you are trying to play the character, I have no qualms with how you do it.

If you are trying to powergame, or play the 'game', then that is not really good RP at all.

What do you mean by wishing up on behalf of another player?

I've wished up to try and get people to be 'force quit' in an quit safe area after going link dead outside the walls.

Though, I've never actually had any response.

I mean to say something like:

"Hey, my friend just died, can he get a rez? He's dead so he can't wish up, but he sent an email, so I just wanted to let you guys know and maybe you could move his body."

Something that I have done, many years ago, in my newbdom!

Maintaining a barrier between RL and IG is the best way to go.

[SMuz]

A few of that doesn't really seem to apply to "if your character was there" principles. Especially the spam disarm/kick part. I wouldn't take the time to do a flashy disarm or kick in the middle of a tense battle, spamming it seems to be the only way to go.

So is stealing from unalert guards. And haggling to that point where you know the merchants will tolerate (or is that haggling skill?)

[Tisiphone]

So is stealing from unalert guards. And haggling to that point where you know the merchants will tolerate (or is that haggling skill?)

Regarding the haggling skill: I find no shame in squeezing every last coin from a merchant by 'gaming the code'; it seems that many of the proponents of the reverse have never in fact been to an Egyptian marketplace.

[musashi]

So is stealing from unalert guards. And haggling to that point where you know the merchants will tolerate (or is that haggling skill?)

Regarding the haggling skill: I find no shame in squeezing every last coin from a merchant by 'gaming the code'; it seems that many of the proponents of the reverse have never in fact been to an Egyptian marketplace.

Or Thailand, or the Phillipines, or Camboia and Louse ... and any other country where haggling is still the medium for exchange in most cases.

[SMuz]

Heh, I guess so. Here in Malaysia, some merchants actually overinflate their prices, to satisfy compulsive hagglers. Some actually give you a significant discount just for not haggling. I guess it's a Third World thing.. should even be a culture in Zalanthas. I should emote haggling, though, just for the fun of it

Ok, here's another one - "spam running". Honestly, I don't see anything wrong with running as far and as fast as you can, but people on the board talk as if it's unfair play.

[musashi]

I think the main concern is that typing n;e;n;e;n;e;n;e;n;e means you're gone like white lightning since it's only possible to scan in a cardinal direction.

Still, I don't think spam-running is that big of a deal. Running makes you lose stamina at a pretty abhorrant rate and someone with the tracking skill will just keep plodding along behind you like Pippy le Pue. A past character of mine tracked a delf down from one side of the known world to the other once ... so I don't find it to be too terribly abusive, as there are ways to overcome it.

[Clearsighted]

If people were meant to pause ten seconds before moving, all mounts and all PCs would have the same speeds. Sometimes swiftness is a life or death matter.

[LoD]

OK, gotta help me and the other newbies out here, because some of us aren't sure which are acceptable and which aren't.

Your list implies that an activity, action, or choice is either good or bad RP.  However, role-playing is much more complicated because of the circumstances surrounding the event.  Is it appropriate for you to strip naked?  In private, yes.  In public, not always.  The conditions of the event play a large role into whether or not a given action is deemed "good" or "bad".

Bear in mind that if you try your best to play the character rather than the game, you will probably avoid repeating behavior that many would label as "Bad RP".

Spam-mining, cutting trees? Without emoting.

Rather than respond to every element in the list, I'd like to comment on this one.  Emoting is not the same as RP, but it can greatly enhance it and help tell your story.  As others have mentioned, you never know when people are watching you and you should also use emote to help entertain yourself by describing your character's action, feelings, and motivations.

Here are two examples of the same actions, with and without emotes/says.

Code Select Expand

Sandy Desert [NEWS]
A large obsidian deposit is here, half buried in the sand.

The burly, large-nosed man has arrived from the west.

The burly, large-nosed man wields a glass hacker.

The burly, large-nosed man swings a glass hacker at a large obsidian deposit.

The burly, large-nosed man swings a glass hacker at a large obsidian deposit.

The burly, large-nosed man swings a glass hacker at a large obsidian deposit.
A small chunk of obsidian falls away.

The burly, large-nosed man swings a glass hacker at a large obsidian deposit.

The burly, large-nosed man swings a glass hacker at a large obsidian deposit.

The burly, large-nosed man swings a glass hacker at a large obsidian deposit.
A large chunk of obsidian falls away.

The burly, large-nosed man picks up a small chunk of obsidian.
The burly, large-nosed man picks up a large chunk of obsidian.

The burly, large-nosed man walks east.

The actions here describe what the man is doing, and fulfill the minimum in way of output.  However, knowing that the command doesn't have any lag could mean that this scene was conducted in the span of 5 seconds, or the span of 5 minutes.  Be wary of assuming that something is appropriate because "the code allows for it to happen".  The code allows me to type "emote lifts a finger, causing the tavern to tremble violently before speeding off into outer space." -- but that doesn't make it acceptable RP.

Now, for a second look at the same system of actions.

Code Select Expand

Sandy Desert [NEWS]
A large obsidian deposit is here, half buried in the sand.

Looking over his shoulder, the burly, large-nosed man has arrived from the west.

Appearing nervous, the burly, large-nosed man wields a glass hacker.

The burly, large-nosed man takes a few steps toward a large obsidian deposit, taking care to face toward the northeast as he squints toward the horizon and folds his hands about a glass hacker.

The burly, large-nosed man swings a glass hacker at a large obsidian deposit.

Tiny chips of dark obsidian fall to the sand as the burly, large-nosed man's glass hacker strikes the surface of the deposit.

The burly, large-nosed man swings a glass hacker at a large obsidian deposit.

Muttering to himself and gazing to the northeast again, the burly, large-nosed man says, in sirihish:
    "...fekkers better not try anythin' this time..."

Returning to his work, the burly, large-nosed man readies a glass hacker and brings it down sharply upon the deposit.

The burly, large-nosed man swings a glass hacker at a large obsidian deposit.
A small chunk of obsidian falls away.

Reaching down toward the small piece of obsidian, the burly, large-nosed man suddenly crouches down and presses his back flat against the deposit.

Breathing raggedly, his features layered in sweat, the burly, large-nosed man says, in sirihish:
   "...fek...fek...fek...why did they have ta come this way..."

Easing up from his crouched position, the burly, large-nosed man peers over the edge of the deposit with a nervous squint, his dark tongue probing the ridges of his cracked lips.

Thrusting himself up suddenly and readying a glass hacker, the burly, large-nosed man says, in sirihish:
   "A'right -- time ta knock dis out an' get the krath back inta town."

The burly, large-nosed man swings a glass hacker at a large obsidian deposit.

The burly, large-nosed man swings a glass hacker at a large obsidian deposit.

Grimacing, the burly, large-nosed man slams his glass hacker against the deposit quickly, his cheeks quivering slightly with the sharp impact of his tool to the stone.

The burly, large-nosed man swings a glass hacker at a large obsidian deposit.
A large chunk of obsidian falls away.

Breathing a quick sigh of relief, the burly, large-nosed man says, in sirihish:
   "Krath smile on me, that'll keep ole' Jak off mah back fer at least a week."

The burly, large-nosed man picks up a small chunk of obsidian.
The burly, large-nosed man picks up a large chunk of obsidian.

Casting one last glance toward the northeast, the burly, large-nosed man walks east.

Even though the execution of the code is exactly the same in each scenario, the use of emotes, says, and even perhaps thinks and feels can greatly enhance a given scene and potentially explain to observers (either seen or unseen) not only what your character is doing, but how they are doing it and perhaps why.  It's not that one of these scenes is the right way to RP, but an example of what else is possible and the type of atmosphere and story one can tell with your actions.

You're given so many tools as a player to create a vivid and living character, and I think it can be unfortunate if some players resign themselves to a more code-heavy style of play and demonstrate the many qualities of their characters only when they believe other characters are present.  There will be times when the quick and concise execution of code is not only desirable, but mandatory.  However, there's a nice balance to be struck between when the code can properly convey the actions of your character and when the player needs to use the tools available to them to enhance a scene and tell a story.

-LoD

[AJM]

Well said.... I had a big elaborate thing to say, but that pretty much got it.