A little more harsh

[WhiteRanger]

You know what really chaps me more than a burgandy leather thong worn backwards in the salt flats? Seeing people ride out into fierce sand storms, and I dont mean a little stinging sand, I mean fierce and terrible biting sand that (if you watched DUNE?) could rip the flesh from your bones supposedly. Maybe Im wrong but I thought the sandstorms of Zalanthas were supposed to be horrendous? So I had an idea. How about when the more terrible storms hit, if you do decide to go out into it instead of hunkering down in some shelter, (Atleast getting down wind from it on the other side of your kank, or laying down and pulling your cloak over your body and face) then you should lose HP for every square that you travel in it. I dont mean like three squares and you are dead, but 3 or 4, maybe even 5 hp per square depending on how bad the storm is. I think this would definantly add to the realism of the game and actually make it more fun, a bit more of the man vs nature theme.

[Cuusardo]

IMHO, people should be seeking shelter rather than going out and trying to travel or hunt during those storms.  I mean, when it says "Terrible, biting sand swirls around you" (or whatever the actual message says) it would be kind of cool to lose a few hps because of how hard you're getting hit by the sand.  You'd lose less if you're wearing heavier armor or a cloak or facewrap...  Something to help protect you.

[WhiteRanger]

Yea, I just thought about that right after I posted. Perhaps all of these cloaks and such that are written up to shelter you more from the elements could actually start to shelter you more from the elements, and not just by giving you more stamina either. I would also think that Rangers would get a bit of a bonus in regards to this, but the reason could be argueable, perhaps they are hardier in regards to standing up to the elements because they are facing them so often, or maybe being more knowledgable in regards to the environment has taught them how best to shield themselves from the storms. But thats an entirely different topic of discussion.

[Delirium]

Terrible, biting sand whips around you.

Sometimes you have no choice but to brave it, and some characters do take the time and effort to equip themselves properly against the storm, but no matter how well equipped, I imagine it would still be unpleasant, yes.. and if given a choice, the vast majority of people would certainly choose to hunker down and avoid the storm. If it whips up while you're in the middle of it though, you have two choices - sit there and try to brave it out.. or try to ride out of it. Guess which option someone already low on water and food will choose. Proper veils, cloaks, clothing, wraps, gloves, etc, etc.. as long as you're not walking around with your hood down and nothing but a loincloth, and taking the effort to prepare yourself against the storm, I don't see it as totally unrealistic.

That said, seeing people just waltz around in storms without paying any attention to the fact that there is horrible, blowing, driving sand surrounding them, annoys the hell out of me, too.

[Anonymous]

I think that if people have their eyes, face and extremities covered that they aren't doing anything unreasonable.

When I think of sandstorms on Arm I always think of ST2: Wrath of Khan when they went to Seti Alpha 5 or wherever and it was a constant sandstorm.  And it didn't strike me as unrealistic that Khan and his people were walking around in it with just cloth and some masks on.

[WhiteRanger]

Yes, I see your point. But the fact is most people do not equip themselves properly in such storms and so many of them are playing unrealistic. And if you have no choice but to brave it, wouldnt it be more interesting to actually have something to brave? The risk of death due to the storm instead of, "Oh no my water is low" w w w w w w w w w w w w w. Ta da the gates? And when I think of the storms I think about more of a Frank Herbert's Dune storm. Rip the flesh right from your bones.

Of course maybe I take this whole harsh planet thing way to seriously, after all, I also want to see the amount of available resources halfed and the price on water tripled.

[Ghost]

My response is a big, fat "No."

I agree harsh storms would tear the very flesh from your skin, but no harsh storm lasts 4+ days.  Whereas it is common to see almost everlasting storms in arm. My outsider has seen a Four-RL-day-straight-blinding-biting storm, and I just had to sit on my ass in the taverns.  Adding a damage to the storms will make it a hell, not harsh.  So if the duration of the storms reduced to 1-2 IC hours, then I agree.  Make it a damaging one, not only you, but also your clothing, armor etc..
But if the duration of the storms are still this long, than it is harsh enough.

[The7DeadlyVenomz]

A big fat "YES."

[WhiteRanger]

God forbid anyone have to sit in a tavern and wait out a sandstorm on a desert planet. But the solution would be, if the bordom gets to much for you, ride against the wind until you come out of the storm, or die trying. On the other hand I would like to see some characters get antsy in a tavern after about three days, start brawling or the like, after all a bunch of strangers cant spend to long together in the same room before they start to rub someone the wrong way. :twisted:

[Agent_137]

God forbid anyone have to sit in a tavern and wait out a sandstorm on a desert planet.

playability vs realism.

Except, storms that tear the skin from your bones aren't necessarily real . . .

[The7DeadlyVenomz]

I don't understand this phrase completely: Playability vs. Realism.

In that case:

We should never have to worry about a dark night, where we can't see.

Torshs should last forever.

Eatting is annoying.

I should be able to log out where ever I want to.

Why are the cities so far apart?

Nothing should be able to kill me.

I should be able to carry anything I want.

We should have more metal.

I should never starve to death, get poisoned to death, nor dehydrate.

Somebody should not be able to shoot me with a bow and arrow from any distance whatsoever.

I should be able to be a gith.

I should be able to be the Dragon.

I want free housing, and a lock-pick proof lock.

I need 10k sid when I start this game.

Animals should drop sid when they die, and maybe a magick boot or something.

Ginka should live in my basement. Hand it over, S.

Ok, do I need to go further? I really support WhiteRanger on this topic, and feel that it will add to the realism and playability of this game.

[Bug]

Both thumbs up.

Equpping should help, but the idea is great. I was wondering myself why the sand is so harmless. I've lived in a desert and I tell you what, even in the middle of a big city you dont want to be outside when even a minor storm comes.

edit: typo

[creeper386]

The weather system would have to be revamped to allow this to be even slightly playable.

Myself, I think the enviroment itself needs more work before we worry about 'realistic' weather. A more working ecosystem. Something that is between having tons of critters at reboot that just mob people to having a few at the end of the week that are all uber.

When you have storms that are uber severe for RL weeks straight ... The mud wouldn't be playable. You'd have people not able to go anywhere in the cities and find people dead in the city because they tried to go someplace.

Even if not ... If it's that harsh, there is NO way people would survive outside of the cities. No way people would make money outside the city. It wouldn't happen.

Creeper

[The7DeadlyVenomz]

Sure they would.

[wizturbo]

I think that rarely (keyword RARELY) some sandstorms should reach the "Vicious" level where they actually dish out damage for every movement square you take.  The storms shouldn't be coded to last very long, but there should be a potential danger of Terrible sandstorms abruptly changing into vicious ones, to act as a deteriant for travelling under Terrible conditions.

[Armaddict]

I'd like to see storms have -some- sort of affect.  But moreso outside the gates.

I don't think you should see a desert-elf who's unprepared for the storm.  It's part of the reason desert-elves are hardcore.  They live in that stuff all the time, and most people can't tolerate it.

I've no objections to making it harsher.

[Callisto]

No.

[Galdun]

Awesome Idea.  How few people EVER use shelters, or fires or any of those neat wilderness survival items.  I'm all for it.  I'd even like to see really cold nights where you lose HP every tick that you're not beside a fire or in shelter.  Sandstorms that smuther or tear at the flesh would just be incredibly cool.

[sjanimal]

That was hyperbole, Venomz, which is ironic because hyperbole is not generally admissable in debates, and you claim that debate is the key to mental agility.

[Anonymous]

I don't understand this phrase completely: Playability vs. Realism.

I always say Playability > Realism.  Simple as that.  When questioning whether or not something is good for the game realism has to take a back seat to playability.  This doesn't mean realism isn't important, just not more important than playability.

Otherwise healing should take IC months, exhaustion should set in well before going 20 outdoor rooms, the crim code should be greatly relaxed and Allanak and Tuluk should be buried in sand.

Realism is cool, realism is the basis for the challenges that this game presents but you have to keep in mind that it is still a game.

[Armaddict]

Right.  But just how -un-playable does making storms do -something- negative make it?

I mean, right now, people just spam directions through it, because all it does is make it so you can't see the room.  You can still walk right through it.  Hell, why not just hold a parasol and take a lively gander through the storm?

I don't think this takes away too much playability.  I think it will enrich the environment of Zalanthas, and put some actual role-play into how people react to the weather.

[Agent_137]

playability vs realism was the issue, i wasn't making a comment on if storms should hurt you or not.

[Armaddict]

...Uhm, my post was asking how playability came over realism in this situation.  Changing storms to have a negative affect does -not- make things unplayable in the least.

[Forest Junkie]

...Uhm, my post was asking how playability came over realism in this situation.  Changing storms to have a negative affect does -not- make things unplayable in the least.

As one whom has played desert elves in the past, I think this would be a welcome addition. Harsh? Yes. Kickass to play in? Oh yeah.

[Mr.Camel]

I'd love to see this, when a vicious storm doesn't last four RL days. I'm all for harsh storms, but harsh storms aren't infinite.