The Allanak Problem

[Aruven]

Don't close off oash please. It works fine roleplayed.

[Nao]

Don't close off oash please. It works fine roleplayed.

It absolutely does not, when it comes to the gemmed.

The majority of the gemmed population ends up working for them, but there is nowhere near enough stuff for them to do to keep six or seven players busy. They are completely dependent on the noble to do anything other than what a generic unclanned PC could be doing. I guess they can socialize and apartment spar. Meanwhile, anyone gemmed that are unhireable by Oash get to play solo in an empty temple and magicker's quarter, but unreasonably popular with templars, since they can really only fuck with you and boss you around if you're not working for Oash.

[Aruven]

Don't close off oash please. It works fine roleplayed.

It absolutely does not, when it comes to the gemmed.

The majority of the gemmed population ends up working for them, but there is nowhere near enough stuff for them to do to keep six or seven players busy. They are completely dependent on the noble to do anything other than what a generic unclanned PC could be doing. I guess they can socialize and apartment spar. Meanwhile, anyone gemmed that are unhireable by Oash get to play solo in an empty temple and magicker's quarter, but unreasonably popular with templars, since they can really only fuck with you and boss you around if you're not working for Oash.

We disagree, and that's alright. Give it another shot under different leadership. It works when the clan leaders (noble and non noble) know how to play it, in my opinion. I feel like the various times I've been through Oash the other players were generally happy and put in a lot of time together.

[rinthrat]

nothing to see here

[wizturbo]

Okay, I've returned to the game for three days and the sentiment from players in this thread that Allanak is dead seems false to me.  If you aren't finding fun, that's a different problem than the fun doesn't exist. 

With that said, the player count does seem diminished from where it should be, given the obvious environmental bonuses that we should getting given the whole COVID situation.  My general thoughts go back to let's try and solve that problem, help people find the fun, rather than fixate on what we perceive to be missing. 

Out of game job postings seems like a great addition, giving lapsed players immediate concepts and a built in first objective should they get into the game.   Something as simple as "Templar seeking aide, preferred playtimes x-y" or "Indie merchant company needs a hunter, all playtimes welcome", could go a long way in helping players find the fun without relying on staff or family role calls to do so.  The postings shouldn't be in lieu of in-game recruitment but merely a tool to get the word out and let people build a PC that could potentially find fun faster.

I propose an experiment, open a new section on these forums for job postings with guidelines stickied to the top.  Let the forum exist for a few weeks or months, and see if it's a net positive for the game or if it causes more trouble than its worth.  Staff can be the arbiter in whether it's a good thing or bad thing.  Seems like something that could be easily implemented though, and could only do limited damage if there's unintended consequences.

[wizturbo]

Even the recent complaints in this thread about lack of things for Gemmed to do are misguided - there's more than Oash that hires them now, but there's been no outward communication in that so how would anyone know?

[Lizzie]

re: Wizturbo's suggestion:

I wouldn't want this to be created by players. I'd rather see it posted by staff. Something like:

There are currently two active noble houses in Allanak needing employees. One employee would be the city-based type, one is a "field aide" type, and there are two other openings as well.

The Tzai-Byn is still filling out at least one of their crews.

The Militia needs some love, mid-to-late-peak time right now.

At least one templar is seeking a personal employee, off-peak between 2AM server time as late as 10AM server time.

The labyrinth currently has things happening.

For names, details, applications to hire or participate, find out IC.

This way people would know that yes - someone is hiring and yes - at least one position is available when I am. And yes, at least one of those positions fits the general concept of my character.

And you can figure out the rest through roleplay.

[HeeBeeGB]

I feel like adding more for Staff to do sucks. I'd rather see it player created and Staff Vetted. I guess that's still something for Staff to do.

In general I feel a Great Bonus would be updating the chronology page with more frequency. When there are RL years with nothing posted to the Chronology page, it reinforces that the actions of the players have little weight on the progress (or lack of progress) or change in the world.

I also really miss the ease behind Original Submissions. The new website sort of made it much harder to submit things like artwork, logs, and stories. I feel like the last great surge of those we saw was in like 2007 or so. It makes the game feel exciting and the community passionate, and provides great examples of 'Things Happening' as well as examples of varied Role-play. Otherwise we just have to take everyone's word for it. There IS an Original Submission request you can file, but I don't see it advertised anywhere. I feel like it should be on the main page, with a blurb like:

"We have an incredibly passionate community that over the years has submitted original artwork, logs of previous RP and encounters, fictional narrative written in ArmageddonMUD's universe, original songs, and more. If you have something in these categories you would like to submit, click here." It would prompt you to login to your account, and automatically pull up the 'Original Submission' request.

SIMILARLY...It would be cool if players could submit chronology suggestions. There could be guidelines (Don't make it just about your PC, only world shaping events that would be known by large populations of the Known World). It'd be a nice Staff Call similar to the crafting echoes and Byn Accolades on the GDB. Staff ultimately would choose what's accepted and what's not, but even dating further back, it'd be cool to fill out some of the world-spanning events that occurred. Some of the events listed on there don't even seem really that relevant or 'wow' for World History. So yeah. I dunno.

[Nao]

Even the recent complaints in this thread about lack of things for Gemmed to do are misguided - there's more than Oash that hires them now, but there's been no outward communication in that so how would anyone know?

You misunderstand the complaint, it's not about gemmed in general having nothing to do. It's solely about Oash, as a clan, and how they end up hiring the majority of gemmed PCs, and just don't have all that much to for them to do (unless all the stars align and they just happen to have a good, highly active leadership PC - the sort that can make everything fun).

[wizturbo]

Gotcha.  What I'm saying is there is now at least one alternative clan that can hire, so more choices available now.  Not something I knew until I happened upon it in-game.

[Spiderman]

Just an observation but:

The stronger that GMH presence is in Allanak, the more plots tend to be moved in the city.  Nobles use them to collude against one another, Templars get bribed and moved around because of their impact on local economy, hunters bring them goods, Byn support them, brand new pcs start out there in the hopes of signing on with them, Guild extorts them and works with them...

I've been playing a ton in Allanak, and I really think that the "social" game in Allanak and the oomph behind the city's roleplay comes only when you've got leadership in the GMH who are able to focus on the largest economy (or should be) in the game.

I think (my opinion only) a strong push to have 2 GMH leaders for each of the three pc clans, with one of those focused entirely and only on Allanak, becomes a spark and lightning rod for making all the other clans surge forward.

Luir's and the action going on there, and the worldplot and all the indies, that's great, and I applaud the effort going in there, but I feel pretty confident that the lack of GMH action in Allanak does have a pretty major impact to the nature, strength and intensity of the playerbase there.

Two 'sid.

[Lotion]

Gotcha.  What I'm saying is there is now at least one alternative clan that can hire, so more choices available now.  Not something I knew until I happened upon it in-game.

What clan?

[Brokkr]

Find out IC.  It isn't published because it isn't supposed to be well known IC'ly.

[triste]

There are tons of niches for gicks, if anything it's hard not getting involved in plots and organizations as a gick.

But I do agree with Nao that Oash operations being somewhat mutually exclusive from templarate operations restricts RP a little. Ironically I've seen more meaningful "upward mobility" for gemmed who avoid Oash and opt to work for the Templarate as pseudo-aides. So I agree with Nao that some thought can go into the Oash-gemmed-Templarate configuration.

[wizturbo]

My main point isn't to talk about gemmed or magickers, but the fact that A LOT HAS CHANGED and no one realizes it.  Many of the problems I saw in the game before I took a break a few years ago are solved now, or at least greatly improved, but I had no idea.  Reading the GDB doesn't convey this.  The secrecy this game has on certain things is doing it a disservice when it comes to winning back players, trying to get a discussion going on what we can comfortably due to improve this without breaking important parts of the find out IC culture we have.

[triste]

My main point isn't to talk about gemmed or magickers, but the fact that A LOT HAS CHANGED and no one realizes it.  Many of the problems I saw in the game before I took a break a few years ago are solved now, or at least greatly improved, but I had no idea.  Reading the GDB doesn't convey this.

Yes, I too have observed this and chuckle when people who left the game years ago continue to bitterly comment about flaws that have been fixed. I am glad you are now playing again and have up to date information. When you enter a debate, it is important to have up to date information.

The secrecy this game has on certain things is doing it a disservice when it comes to winning back players, trying to get a discussion going on what we can comfortably due to improve this without breaking important parts of the find out IC culture we have.

Yes. The rules at hand do put us in a bind here. This is why Lizzie is on the right track about job postings needing to be removed from the players to a degree, and overseen by staff just to make sure posts do not leak too much IC info. Criticism of her idea that it takes too much staff work is also correct, which is why I prototyped an anonymized self-service rollcall tool for another MUD [with barely any players]. Anonymization + minimal moderation can allow us to publicize roles, plots, and fun-to-do-things while still adhering to IC rules.

[And remember, as the rules stand, you can always get a family rolecall / other coordinated rolecall approved and post about it on the GDB if you want]

[Aruven]

Nevermind. This is pretty much American politics today. Im just some old veteran that played a different game. Change it up. I hope it works and makes everyone happy.

[SpyGuy]

There's a lot of cool stuff going on in the game right now.  It's smaller scale than some of the big magick plots in the past afaik but still interesting.  It can, of course, take a PC RL days played (often 10+ in my experience) to really get to experience some of it.  That's just the nature of the game and gaining connections/trust/competency.  I try to gossip a lot on many characters because sharing that sort of information is fun. 

I'm really a strong supporter of sharing more publicly on the website.  The current history page is terrible and just makes it look stagnant even when it isn't.  I'm even supportive of changing the rule from a RL year to say 6 months of talking about IC things that aren't super sensitive.  I hope that we're all mature enough to separate out what's IC gained info from the OOC. 

[Lotion]

My main point isn't to talk about gemmed or magickers, but the fact that A LOT HAS CHANGED and no one realizes it.

Find out IC.  It isn't published because it isn't supposed to be well known IC'ly.

[Spiceoflife]

Funny when I had my circle in Oash they constantly had tasks, they explored the grey forest for a plot, they hunted Rogue mages, they hunted defilers and searched the known for artifacts and went out as a group and did a TON. I'm sorry none of you guys played with someone willing to push and drive those sorts of things. Oash works great but the nobles have to actually care more about doing things than just building projects and inner city politics.

[Decameron]

Oash is fine.

Close Borsail.

Thanks,
- Some Old Oashi player. 

[Spider]

Bring back the Oashi Guard! (and other noble House commoner positions)

On board with some sentiments in this thread to put a little more of the onus, as far as criticism, on players to bring life to the world in the way that is most fun for them.  However, staff run plots are a blast to play through as well, and always welcome.  I returned to playing this game after a long break back in April, and still manage to have a good time in game in Allanak as well as anywhere else.

[Fredd]

Bring back the Oashi Guard! (and other noble House commoner positions)

On board with some sentiments in this thread to put a little more of the onus, as far as criticism, on players to bring life to the world in the way that is most fun for them.  However, staff run plots are a blast to play through as well, and always welcome.  I returned to playing this game after a long break back in April, and still manage to have a good time in game in Allanak as well as anywhere else.

I miss the Elites. Warriors pairs with mages to go...I dunno. Guard a nobles poop bucket.

I joke, but they were fun to play. I've apped more then a handful of Oashi over the years, with a goal of starting them back up.

[Saiseiki]

Funny when I had my circle in Oash they constantly had tasks, they explored the grey forest for a plot, they hunted Rogue mages, they hunted defilers and searched the known for artifacts and went out as a group and did a TON. I'm sorry none of you guys played with someone willing to push and drive those sorts of things. Oash works great but the nobles have to actually care more about doing things than just building projects and inner city politics.

Wow.  You just motivated me (I don't play in Oash).  Thank you!  Gonna see what I can do IC now.  =)

[AdamBlue]

Gonna be real with you. Wanted to do something unique in Allanak. The absolute lack of players and the absolute lack of interest killed it entirely for me to the point where I haven't played for months besides maybe fifteen minute log ins.

It's a shame, because I was so excited, and then it was just dead, immediately. Doneso, especially after some shitty IC Allanak-related drama like has been touted in the thread that didn't make anything cool at all, it just made it fucking dumb and frustrating and didn't make me even want to play anymore.
Maybe I'm just tired of Armageddon, I don't know.