Assess -v

[FantasyWriter]

PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE MAKE ASSESS -V NOT AUTOMATICALLY TELL PEOPLE OOC THAT SOMEONE IS A BREED!!!!

[Eloran]

No way around it I think, boyo.

Half-elves are coded as a different race, so an assess -v will return them as being "of their race".

It's a way for people to cheat, sure, but what can you do?

Report someone if you think they were being a jerk.

[Synthesis]

If you want to play a human, play a human.

If you want to play a breed who looks SO MUCH like a human that he can REASONABLY pass as a human, just roll human race and be a breed in your imagination.

Otherwise, you're just trying to get half-elf agility and other bonuses without having to suffer the IC consequences.

[Eloran]

Otherwise, you're just trying to get half-elf agility and other bonuses without having to suffer the IC consequences.

This is sort of how I perceive it sometimes.

[Winterless]

If you want to play a human, play a human.

If you want to play a breed who looks SO MUCH like a human that he can REASONABLY pass as a human, just roll human race and be a breed in your imagination.

Otherwise, you're just trying to get half-elf agility and other bonuses without having to suffer the IC consequences.

Well said.

/golfclap

[BlackMagic0]

Otherwise, you're just trying to get half-elf agility and other bonuses without having to suffer the IC consequences.

This is sort of how I perceive it sometimes.

Gotta remember. Some half-elves look -far- more like elves, some far more like humans. Depends on which traits they gain from their parents the most.
Also a person could most likely hide they are a half-elf if they really wanted to look human-ish, and did look more human.

And ass -v does not mean you can instantly notice "oh your a breed hiding it!".

From the help file:

Born of mixed elven and human parentage, half-elves share many of the traits of both races. Tall, roughly between 70 to 82 inches in height, and possessed of deeply etched features, half-elves can resemble their elven parents strongly. On the other hand, half-elves are bulkier and somewhat more hardy than elves, and so can resemble their human parents. Regardless of these attributes, however, half-elves can virtually always pass for either humans or elves, and share the skin tones and hair-and-eye colors of both parents.

[FantasyWriter]

Or set it up to where if you see someone of your own race you still see their age relative to their race and not you.

It is an OOC way to gain IC information.  No less than Sally telling Jane on AIM that Bill is a breed.

[Synthesis]

lol

a hard-coded feature is now OOC.

I like it.

BACKSTAB IS TOTALLY AN OOC WAY TO KILL PEOPLE, GOSH!

[Eloran]

Don't be a dick man, you know what he meant.

It's crappy if you assess -v a person with "human" in their desc who looks like a human and talks like a human but use the information gleaned from assess -v to determine they are a half elf, as opposed to any clues given in their mdesc.

[Armaddict]

Not really the same, Synthesis.

He's talking about information being gleaned automatically, and sometimes even accidentally, even though said information is not readily apparent, because of a nuance of how the wording in assess -v displays information.

As noted, half-elves can pass for either elves or humans.  They aren't drastically out of place.  Just a glance doesn't always tell you, "Oh, they have elvish blood in them.", particularly if they are going out of their way to hide it.  The mentality won't change, but that doesn't make them easily recognizeable, unless you're a bender.

Don't try to make him look stupid for the request, it's actually fairly legitimate.

[tortall]

I think there's some cases where:

Otherwise, you're just trying to get half-elf agility and other bonuses without having to suffer the IC consequences.

Is not true. I've seen breeds passing as humans fine, for very well RPed reasons, and I applaud anyone for playing them that way.

I will also applaud anyone who IGNORES THE FACT THAT YOU CAN TELL THEY'RE A BREED thought asses -v. If you can't tell from their mdesc, they're human.

Thank you. :-)

[hyzhenhok]

lol

a hard-coded feature is now OOC.

I like it.

BACKSTAB IS TOTALLY AN OOC WAY TO KILL PEOPLE, GOSH!

Consider the following.

Assess -v informs you that a given character is a certain age pertaining to their race. If they are the same race as you, it conveniently compares your ages.

Character A has no idea Character B is a half elf by either his sdesc or mdesc. There may be hints, both written in the descs and in how Character B is RPed, but it's not blatant. This is obviously allowed, both by the docs and by Imm approval of half-elf descriptions that do not mention half-elfness.

If B is human: Character A is young. He types assess -v. His character now knows "Character B is older than you." He now knows that Character B is older than him.

If B is a half-elf: Character A is young. He types assess -v. His character now knows "Character B appears to be in adulthood for his race." He now knows that Character B is older than him.

But wait! Character B's player knows that through the way the code works, you only get the "appears to be in (Age category) for his race" if you assess -v someone who is a different race. And Character B's player knows for sure that he rolled a human when he wrote up his current character.

Say this is going on in an interview for PC B to join PC A's clan, which only hires humans. PC A turns down PC B because of what the player learned through assess -v.

This is a problem, because, the player's character ICly does not necessarily know what the player himself OOCly knows. Because, like, they're not the same person. They live in different worlds. You see, Armageddon is a roleplaying game. Funny how roleplaying works like that.

To the OP, I heartily agree, because this is a clear case of "to fool the character, you have to fool the player."

[Synthesis]

Sounds a whole lot like trying to avoid the IC consequences while getting the half-elf racial bonuses.

[Armaddict]

That's because you're listening to your own blathering in your ears based around trying to win the game rather than reading very well phrased explanations to you.

[Synthesis]

If you want to play in Clan A, and you know Clan A doesn't hire breeds, you probably shouldn't pick half-elf.

Crying about it once you get caught is just sad.

[Armaddict]

That hasn't been mentioned at all in the explanations you received.

You're throwing around arguments that have nothing to do with anything.

[FantasyWriter]

If you want to play in Clan A, and you know Clan A doesn't hire breeds, you probably shouldn't pick half-elf.

Crying about it once you get caught is just sad.

Who's crying?

[Eloran]

What if you want to play in Clan A and hide your blood? What if you're only part elf and don't know it?

[Synthesis]

Say this is going on in an interview for PC B to join PC A's clan, which only hires humans. PC A turns down PC B because of what the player learned through assess -v.

Totally not an argument that was brought up.

[BlackMagic0]

Say this is going on in an interview for PC B to join PC A's clan, which only hires humans. PC A turns down PC B because of what the player learned through assess -v.

Totally not an argument that was brought up.

And no one is crying about it. We are saying its rather out of character.
As if you can not tell by the main desc, and short desc. You should not be able to judge their age and go.. OH MY GOD THIS MAN LIED TO ME!

And the RP would be amazingly fun if you ask me. Attempting to keep it all hidden, secret, and pretend to be human. Though torn inside.
And if you get caught.. now that only adds more RP fun.

Is not true. I've seen breeds passing as humans fine, for very well RPed reasons, and I applaud anyone for playing them that way.
I will also applaud anyone who IGNORES THE FACT THAT YOU CAN TELL THEY'RE A BREED thought asses -v. If you can't tell from their mdesc, they're human.

To add. This is a good thought, a good roleplayer would not take what ass -v said IC if they couldn't see through the lies with the short and main descriptions.

[FantasyWriter]

Hey Synth... do you actually have an argument against it being changed?

[Synthesis]

If I want to play that my character picked up on some subtle clues about your "hidden breed," it's damn well within my rights.

[Eloran]

If I want to play that my character picked up on some subtle clues about your "hidden breed," it's damn well within my rights.

What if there are no subtle clues?

[FantasyWriter]

If I want to play that my character picked up on some subtle clues about your "hidden breed," it's damn well within my rights.

Then read the main desc and watch for the clues most people put in there.
Would you approve of the code throwing out guild labels, too?

[Synthesis]

If I want to play that my character picked up on some subtle clues about your "hidden breed," it's damn well within my rights.

Then read the main desc and watch for the clues most people put in there.
Would you approve of the code throwing out guild labels, too?

Most people don't describe themselves in sufficient detail for such subtle clues as may be apparent to appear in the main description.  As such, the code provides a medium for ascertaining these facts.

Incidentally, ass -v is not the only way to figure these types of things out by the code.