Getting tired of fighting

[Anonymous]

I always thought stamina should slowly decrease while in combat. The amount could be different for different classes or be directly linked to endurace or even be random per round.

I can see warriors losing maybe 1-2 stamina per every second round or so and every other class anywhere from 2-3.

Also people aren't as effective when they are tired, so the more tired the person is the worse they would fight. Of course for warriors and possibly (less so though for) rangers the penalities would be less severe then other classes as you get more and more tired. Also the effect would begin after 50% of stamina is gone and slowly increase after that.

As a balance, being tired should also effect how well you learn skills, this would probably only be linked to your wisdom.

Just to add the stamina costs for kick, disarm, bash -might- have to be lowered a bit for warriors -only-

I really think this would add more stratagy and realism to the game.

[Morfeus]

http://www.zalanthas.org/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=18478&highlight=stamina+warrior+fighting

http://www.zalanthas.org/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=18658&highlight=stamina+warrior+fighting

[Hymwen]

I think it would take too much playability away compared to how much realism it brings. I trust people to use common sense and not fight for hours and hours.

[John]

I think it would take too much playability away compared to how much realism it brings. I trust people to use common sense and not fight for hours and hours.

I would love to cut the battle short, but if that other thing refuses to (especially if it's an NPC) I don't have much choice.

[Dre]

hmm..i don't.

I play combat oriented characters i don't really see how this would take away playability. Most times you have to sit down to heal from a fight anyways. Besides you shouldn't be fighting til your near death or exhaustion either. Yet i constantly see fighters continuing to fight until one of them is moderate condition, and with evenly matched fighters this can take a while.
 

But having looked at the threads i think all that needed to be said has been said.

[Barzalene]

While I like the idea, I hope it never goes in. It's very hard to play an outdoorsy type, especially with a new pc. This would almost ensure there would never be any old pc outdoorsy types.

[Morgenes]

Just a note that this is planned to go in, we're working on foundation projects to get ready for it.

Sorry for those of you who don't want it.  Again I'll say, there is always posts about how this change or that change will 'ruin the game'.  And yet, the game is still there, and people are still playing.  The people who think the game is ruined will find another game to play that isn't ruined.

[Larrath]

I'd like to see the Offense and Defence skills also come into this.  Since these are Zalanthans, the good fighters also know how to conserve their energy, I can really see a high Offense skill giving a reduction to the Stamina loss when attacking and a high Defense doing the same when dodging or blocking.

It could open interesting ideas, specifically with tiring out a raptor for a noble to hunt and other such things.

[Moofassa]

Morgenes, will this code change apply to beasties aswell? For instance, if I chase a duskhorn until he/she can no longer escape, does this mean he can no longer fight with any effectiveness aswell?

[Malken]

I don't really like it..

It's not so bad if you're riding around on a mount, but how will it affect the races that tend to avoid mounts and are of the hunter type? ie - Desert elves.They have to spend stamina just to move around..

[Yokunama]

I think it would take too much playability away compared to how much realism it brings.

I agree.

[Larrath]

Just a note that this is planned to go in, we're working on foundation projects to get ready for it.

Sorry for those of you who don't want it.  Again I'll say, there is always posts about how this change or that change will 'ruin the game'.  And yet, the game is still there, and people are still playing.

[jcarter]

I can hear the players of desert elves crying right now.

[Anonymous]

For all you guys know it could very easily be an advantage to them. How?

You have no idea how the code will be implemented or how it will effect classes and races. It could very well be less severe on Delves then on other races. Though the ability to rest while still hidden might be nice, if not yet possible.

This is a game that went from spawning to permadeath....have faith.

[Yokunama]

Just a note that this is planned to go in, we're working on foundation projects to get ready for it.

Sorry for those of you who don't want it.  Again I'll say, there is always posts about how this change or that change will 'ruin the game'.  And yet, the game is still there, and people are still playing.

I've read it, and surely several others have also.
Whats the point in having a discussion on it if everyone isn't going to at least express their opinion and give their ideas, Larrath? I just think its going to take away some if not a lot of playability.

Just because the an Imm says this 'will' happen doesn't me we, the players as a whole, can nod do anything about it, because without us, there wouldn't be much of a game. Maybe expressing a very valid and clear point will change a few things.

Maybe its a good idea - Maybe it isn't.

[Jherlen]

I can hear the players of desert elves crying right now.

And it sounds marvelous.

[Bullet Eater]

I like the idea of tiring out during a battle. It leaves roleplaying possibilities (imagine two equally skilled fighters fighting each other to the point of exhaustion, coming to terms with each other's skill then becoming powerful allies), as well as preventing both ganks and drawn-out battles amongst fighters.

[Yokunama]

I like the idea of tiring out during a battle. It leaves roleplaying possibilities (imagine two equally skilled fighters fighting each other to the point of exhaustion, coming to terms with each other's skill then becoming powerful allies), as well as preventing both ganks and drawn-out battles amongst fighters.

That doesn't feel too zalanthas. Thats just my opinion.

[The7DeadlyVenomz]

I still support this idea.

I still hope for it to go in.

And it seems like there will be some version of it tucked in, via Morgenes.

So I'm gravy.

[Anael]

Sorry if someone pointed this out already, got enough time to just skim through the thread.

It'd be nice to have encumberance have a slight affect on how fast do fighters tire. (ie, each 'tick' when the fighter loses stamina would be 1 second shorter for each level on encumberance... or something)

[Cale_Knight]

Hopefully these foundation projects include things like stances that affect both combat abilities and the amount of stamina you lose.

A warrior with a shield, for instance, who's fighting carefully and defensively might not tire out as quickly as a berserker with a two-handed axe.

[Yokunama]

This could easily be abused in some ways
People will be grouping together to quickly lower the stamina of the intended target, as if certain groups of NPCs don't do enough of this to wipe out your HP. Many players will be seeing their character's stamina drop from 100 to 50 or 100 to 10 within seconds.

"Assess -v" will play another part in the role a lot of twinkish deaths. Which allows the players to tell the status of someones stamina. More player will be attacked and more likely killed because they are "The man/woman looks completely exhausted". Yea, playing on the weak can be good roleplay, but entering a room, assessing someone, drawing your blades, and killing them isn't roleplay.

This leaves little room for those emotes and little special manevours kick, bash, backstab, and disarm. I'd like to have time to make combat creative and colorful - Not lifeless and dull. (I do not count the first few minutes of combat as actual fighting, just a few practice swings used to find the enemy out, unless the damage from the first series of blows was serious.)

Even if PCs stamina affects their combats skills, we will still see those long-threaded battles between evenly matched foes, because both of their skills would have suffered the same amount. Thus, they will still remain as equals on the battle field.

If combat is suppose to be short, equip my characters with high backstab skill and throw in the wilderness and city sneak.




Just my little rambling rant.

[Dre]

This could easily be abused in some ways
People will be grouping together to quickly lower the stamina of the intended target, as if certain groups of NPCs don't do enough of this to wipe out your HP. Many players will be seeing their character's stamina drop from 100 to 50 or 100 to 10 within seconds.

Your assuming the code will works that way. Truthfully in situations where your outnumbered most people run regardless. I doubt it will be coded so that 2 RL seconds of battle will leave you tired.

"Assess -v" will play another part in the role a lot of twinkish deaths. Which allows the players to tell the status of someones stamina. More player will be attacked and more likely killed because they are "The man/woman looks completely exhausted". Yea, playing on the weak can be good roleplay, but entering a room, assessing someone, drawing your blades, and killing them isn't roleplay.

Entering a room, and just looking at someone(gear) before killing them has never been good Roleplay. Seeing someone exhausted and knowing they are too tired to fight (as well as they would if they were completely rested) is a fact of life. Its really no different then knowing that they won't be able to run very far away from you if you attack.

This leaves little room for those emotes and little special manevours kick, bash, backstab, and disarm. I'd like to have time to make combat creative and colorful - Not lifeless and dull. (I do not count the first few minutes of combat as actual fighting, just a few practice swings used to find the enemy out, unless the damage from the first series of blows was serious.)

I've always found real ingame fights to go very fast anyways, usually one sided. Rarely (think once or twice) have i seen PC vs PC, where PC life was on the line, be able to pull off well written emote, which is actually good because it usually means they are having an adrenaline rush. I usually have marcoed emote for such occations. However, All in All a bit of balancing code wise will nullify this concern in my humble opinion.

Anyways i'm with The7DeadlyVenomz on this and am glad some version of this is being implemented by the IMMs. Just no one has any idea how it will exactly work so there is no point in assuming it will be a horrible thing (or in my case a good thing)  :wink:

[Malken]

Morgenes, will this code change apply to beasties aswell? For instance, if I chase a duskhorn until he/she can no longer escape, does this mean he can no longer fight with any effectiveness aswell?

It should, out of fairness. There are some critters that if you aren't skilled enough, you can fight for hours, without hitting them, same goes for that critter. Why should you be the one dropping out of exhaustion first and not the critters?

In that case, if critters do lose stamina as well and can't fight after a certain time, a popular way of hunting some of them is to chase them until they get exhausted, won't that make it extremely easy afterward to hunt them if they can't fight back?

[Barzalene]

I think the question that asks whether npcs will likewise be affected is a very good one.