Getting tired of fighting

[The7DeadlyVenomz]

Huh. I'd agree.

[Jakahri]

I agree that the classes were never meant to be A = B balanced, but I also think stamina drain on fighting is more of an unforutnate step in micromanaging some of the less responsible players than a feature which will bring a greatly advanced degree of RP opportunity.  And some of the players of mundane characters, like Hot Dancer, are nervous that this drain will make his most common PC choice (desert elf) even less capable of surviving in the current environment.

Absolutely. This is one of my biggest fears as well. I certainly hope the staff is taking steps to protect the desert elf class. For a few years now the race has been systematically neutered (except for the bonus to not losing as much water in the wastes as other races, which is the one saving grace that I love) and, as a result, their effectiveness at hunting or protecting their home will become nigh impossible. Desert elves already are at a major disadvantage due to massive loss of the mvs pool while in combat if skills are used.

Perhaps the code will be based off of endurance. The more hardy you are, the slower you tire. (Hence, desert elves lose half or a third as much as other races) Perhaps that has already been taken into account. *shrug*

[Synthesis]

How did the last 3 pages of this topic get turned back to magickers?

It's about stamina drain.  I think it's safe to assume that the Imms aren't going to tack stamina drain on top of mana drain for magickers, so it's a complete waste of time to talk about it in this topic.  There are other magicker-related posts out there, go post your gripes and complaints about magickers there.

As far as stamina drain during combat goes:  1) Yes, it makes sense; 2) Yes, it will suck; 3) No, it won't be an insurmountable burden.

As far as how it will affect d-elves: it can go either way.  A d-elf who plans well and stays rested will have the advantage in straight -combat-, since he will be able to fight longer, given his marginally larger stamina pool.  -However-, mount-riders will always have the -flee- advantage, since 1) Almost every mount has more useful stamina than a d-elf; 2) The mount, not being in combat, will not be draining its stamina; and 3) Even if the mount -is- attacked, it will still (probably) have a much larger stamina pool than its attacker, and will outlast them in the ensuing melee.

One problem I can foresee with the stamina drain concept is how defense and offense work together, code-wise.  It really doesn't take long for a warrior (especially a warrior using a shield) to be virtually untouchable by another warrior, one-on-one.  Sometimes combat between warriors can go back and forth without injury to either side for a very long time, especially if both warriors are capable of reversing special command attacks.  A human warrior's defense can get -so- good that they can effectively fend off a half-giant's ordinary attacks.  Now, add in the fact that it takes -numerous- effective blows to bring down your opponent and the fact that these damaging blows will be few and far between, and you have a recipe  for stalemates across the board, when fleeing isn't an option.  Of course, this makes just as much sense, really.  If you look at professsional mixed martial-arts fights, -many- of them would reach a complete stalemate if the referee wasn't there to stand the fighters back up.  Even professional fighters, who do nothing but train and train and train for these fights, get completely gassed within 10 minutes of fighting (if they're really putting their all into it).  This complete exhaustion can reach the point where you're unable to defend yourself, but equally unable to attack, either.  All you can do is lie there with your arms around your head (or lie on top of your opponent), suck air, and maybe throw a few lethargic and completely ineffectual punches.

Which is fine, because from my personal experience, attacks out in the wilds never last for more than a minute or two before either 1) Someone dies or 2) Someone flees.  Rare is the case where two people are so evenly matched that it isn't immediately obvious what the outcome of the fight is going to be.

My only suggestion is that once both parties reach complete stamina drain, they are both automatically disengaged from the fight, and are unable to initiate combat again until they rest.  (Which brings in another problem, since rangers regenerate stamina at 12 per tick, while all other classes regenerate at 8 per tick.  This 50% faster regeneration rate could have -huge- consequences, in certain cases, such as when a ranger is in an organization which spars frequently--since the ranger will be regenerating stamina much faster, they'll also be able to spar more frequently, which means they'll improve more rapidly.)

Ultimately, though, I think this addition to the code will do relatively little beyond the sparring ring.  Like I said above, most life-and-death situations are resolved -very- quickly.  It will only negatively affect d-elves that are foolish enough to stick around for a fair fight, and newbies who are foolish enough to not have their stamina as part of their prompt (perhaps the default prompt could be changed to include hp/stamina/stun, to avoid this problem).

[Saphreal]

I have always thought that you shouldn't stop training because you finally took enough damage, or because you had been training for an obscene amount of time.  When you have two High skill soldiers training together, and neither can land a blow on the other one, it can be a hard line to draw where you say, "OK, we're too tired to go on."  I would love to see something like this added to the game.

[Anarchy]

Perhaps, to protect the desert elves, city elves could be given the ability to run like d-elves (and they should have that ability - they ARE elves after all) I love elves, all the karma I have was gained by playing elves. What frustrated me the most was the "elves cant ride" issue, and yet city elves were unable to cross distances like the documents claim. I dont care if they are city elves, they are still elves. As i have said over and over again. Give d-elves a bigger bonus to movement. Problem solved, stamina loss in combat can be implemented with little adverse effects on elves in general.