Requested Feedback on Webpage

[Sanvean]

ShaLeah sent in an idea for this and I liked the idea a lot, so I reworked it some. It's here: http://www.armageddon.org/intro/quickstart.html

When ready, it will be linked in on the main page, as well as the Intro section.

Feedback I would like:

1) Are there crucial links that have been left out? I left out some that didn't seem very important to me in order to make the links that are provided more meaningful. Bearing that in mind, are there places you would insert links or information?

2) Are there places this can be tightened/shortened? One of the crucial things about a Quickstart is that it needs to be short and to the point, as well as full of information. Are there things that could be lopped off without too much information being lost?

3) Is there anything else that should be edited/changed? What typos have I missed?

[My 2 sids]

Welcome to Zalanthas. If you don't want to go through the entire introductory section of the Armageddon MUD website, this Quickstart provides some game basics. The following truths about the world of Armageddon Mud are as common knowledge to Zalanthans as how to order a BigMac at McDonald's is to us.

One of the first things I'd like to say about this sight is I don't like what it's saying.  I think telling people this is a "quick way" to start, is just inviting people to try and beat the system.  :roll:  We all know players who have made it without reading everything in the docs before hand, but I don't think we want to necessarily promote this type of player.  :?  Instead I'd like this to either replace or be apart of the normal start up.  If you tell people from the get go that they can do this –instead- of the full introduction page, no one is going to use the full introduction page.  Although I think this page looks alright (I've not had time to go through it carefully yet) I think it needs to not try and look like it is circumventing the other reading.  

[Lasakar]

I like it.

My suggestion. Put the races, classes and so on to ONE link each. Too many links on one site is too badly arranged. From the link (e.g. races) make  branches to other the links (e.g. elves, humans). Some exits allready.

Something about riding is useful too. To many times I died while make a big mistake while riding (like using the way, not dismounting on time and so on). I can mail something I have written.

[Northlander]

The thieves link leads to the magick faq.

The first Tuluk link leads to help allanak.

I feel half-elves should be mentioned in the racial overview.

I'd note the existence of tribal religion.

[flurry]

I'd note the existence of tribal religion.

I was also going to say that.  

Also I might link to "spice", since it means something different than what a newcomer might think it does.

Oh, also perhaps a paragraph about how dangerous the desert is, and that people would be very wary of leaving the cities unprepared.

[Tamarin]

Put links to the noble houses maybe?

[Bestatte]

The thing about Kurac isn't -just- that they handle spice (and yes, identifying what spice IS would be useful to a newbie), but also that they are the primary producers of sandcloth and desert wear.

I didn't check any of the links, but I have only one comment about the content of the page:

* A Western idea that our players have a hard time abandoning is that there is no sexism on Zalanthas; women and men are treated equally. Keep in mind that the following would not happen in Armageddon: a man expressing shame at being beaten sparring by a woman; someone referring to women as needing protection or coddling; a woman being shamed for sexual promiscuity while a man is praised for it. Attitudes towards sexuality are broad. Homosexuality is common, and not seen as aberrant. Multiple sex partners are common among Zalanthans, particularly in the upper classes.

It seems to me this paragraph is emphasizing sex more than I'd prefer to see. I think the issue isn't that homosexuality is "common" and that multiple sex partners are "common" so much as neither of these behaviors are considered inappropriate or worthy of notice. By stating that they're common, an unsuspecting newbie might get the impression that this is a sex mud. All kidding aside, I really wouldn't want to give people that impression.

Perhaps soften it, by stating something like this instead:

Sexual practices among humanoids are broad and varied, and no emphasis is put on any behavior, any more than any other behavior. Homosexuality does not come with any social stigma, nor does having multiple sex partners. Sanctioned marriages do not occur among commoners, with the exception of merchant house family members for political purposes, though monogamous and/or multiple bonding between adults is common. Racial mixes are generally unheard of and treated with scorn by their peers, superiors, and subordinates.

In this way, it discusses more of the social aspects of family life, stresses that the 2 parents 2.3 kids ideal in RL doesn't exist as "normal" in the game, and still offers to newbies the idea that yes, sex happens on occasion. I would also skip the part, or change the part, about how what "won't" happen in Arm regarding women and men feeling shamed or whatever. It -does- happen, and in some cases with good logical IC reason. A man who comes from a family of brothers, in any society, will view women differently than a man who comes from a family of sisters. It's just the way it is, and I think it would be a disservice to suggest otherwise to the incoming newbie. And definitely keep the consent link in.

[Northlander]

Good call, Jazz. A link to more information on the nobility is definitely needed.

In the spirit of consistency, I'd append "larger than a ring" at the end of "a commoner may go a lifetime without seeing a metal object".

In the spirit of having it be a Quick Start, I'd remove the entire "A Western idea..." paragraph and make sure it's on the Introductory Information webpage instead. Consent rules are still mentioned under the game rules link. [EDIT: Bestatte has a great rewrite, there.]

Same with the "Though a range.." paragraph. Just mention somewhere that the harsh sun keeps fair-skinned a limited number.

Change the semicolon of "...can start in several cities; you are advised.." into a 'but'.

And that's all I have this time around!

[My 2 sids]

Also,

A Western idea that our players have a hard time abandoning is that there is no sexism on Zalanthas; women and men are treated equally. Keep in mind that the following would not happen in Armageddon: a man expressing shame at being beaten sparring by a woman;

I'd leave this part out or at least chop it down to a few sentences.  I think skip the "western idea" because equality is actually a -modern- term, not a western one.  Also, the examples you've given do actually accure in game.  The differences in the sexes is too great to try and take out everything.  If you really want -that- kind of equality... I say lets take out sexes all together.  

a woman being shamed for sexual promiscuity while a man is praised for it. Attitudes towards sexuality are broad. Homosexuality is common, and not seen as aberrant. Multiple sex partners are common among Zalanthans, particularly in the upper classes.

I'd leave this out too.  The GDB/players/Imms are still having debates over sexuality so I don't think it should be stated in this introduction section.  The idea that multiple sex partners are common in the upper classes is also confusing because -they- are the ones who most likely will become married.

[X-D]

The idea that multiple sex partners are common in the upper classes is also confusing because -they- are the ones who most likely will become married.

Probly not the place for debate on the subject, but nothing says that marriage in zalanthas has anything to do with sex or number of partners, if anything it is stated that marriage is most often for political reasons, so, they would be even more likly to have multiple partners, I see nothing confusing on that part of the doc, specialy if you remember to leave western/modern ideals out of the game, though it would probly amaze you to find out exactly how many long happily married couples are swingers IRL.

[Ayashah]

half-giants (a race originally produced by magick, known to be as stupid as they are large).

I thought it was basically accepted that though half-giants arent usually geniuses that they arent necessarily stupid. Just sorta frozen at the child stage or so in mentality.

[X-D]

Nope, they are DUMB, imagination, zilch, ability to problem solve, tiny, memory is alright, understanding abstract idea's, HAH.

They can learn though, slowly, and imitate fairly well, maybe even sounding and acting like a normal human for the most part after many years (I've known many retarded people that seem pretty darn normal in their 40's).

[Red Ranger]

Attitudes towards sexuality are broad. Homosexuality is common, and not seen as aberrant. Multiple sex partners are common among Zalanthans, particularly in the upper classes.

I disagree with the emphasis in this portion of the paragraph.  While it may not be the intent of the writer, this makes homosexuality and the taking of multiple sex partners seem the norm, which is an assertion that I don't think is necessarily valid.  My simplest suggestion is to just leave it at "Attitudes toward sexuality are broad."  

If specific mention of homosexuality and the taking of multiple sex partners is seen as necessary, I suggest Bestatte's modifications mentioned above.  If a more terse change is desired, I suggest changing the two instances of "common" to "not uncommon."  The two have different meanings.  In the context of the document, the word "common" suggests that those practices are the prevailing norm, while calling them "not uncommon" emphasizes that they represent a significant minority of sexual practices.

Red Ranger

[Agent_137]

First of all, I'd like to say a one page introductory is a great thing. I know many people who I try to get interested in arma, but when I say you have to read the docs...many pages of docs...they balk or play without reading. So while you'll get more people who don't know a WHOLE lot about arma on their first char, you'll get less people who don't know shit, and more people overall.


Second, you need to mention how the Byn is very receptive to n00bs. Had I knew that and joined the Byn with my first char, he would have lived longer and I would have had a better intro into Arma.

[John]

One of the first things I'd like to say about this sight is I don't like what it's saying. I think telling people this is a "quick way" to start, is just inviting people to try and beat the system.  We all know players who have made it without reading everything in the docs before hand, but I don't think we want to necessarily promote this type of player.

I like to consider myself a good roleplayer, and when I came to Arm I did read all the docs. However if I ever tried another mud, I wouldn't read all the docs (especially if they were to Armageddon proportions). So I don't think forcing players to read the entire docs is a good thing. Plus, the intro section was originally (IMO anyway) meant as a "quick-guide" to skip reading the entier website. Now, I think it's changed to a "help the newbie's questions" section instead of a quick-guide.

I like it Newbies will read the entire website if they see the game is worth it

Humans are the most prevalent and powerful race. Elves on Zalanthas are shifty, fiercely tribal, and prize the art of thievery. Dwarves on Zalanthas are hairless and devoted to a focus, a goal which they pursue at all costs. Other races you may see are muls (the sterile offspring of dwarves and humans, used as slaves) and half-giants (a race originally produced by magick, known to be as stupid as they are large). We advise that your first character be a human fighter-type in order to learn how to play the game - thieves and merchants are difficult to play.

I'd condense that too....

Humans are the most prevalent and influential race. Elves are fiercely tribal and prize the art of thievery. Dwarves are hairless and devoted to a goal which they pursue at all costs. Other races are muls (the offspring of dwarves and humans, used as slaves despite being sterile and dangerous) and half-giants (a race originally produced by magick, known to be as stupid as they are large).

I'd nix the entire "fighter-type" part from there, bring up the "getting hired" part and put it there. I also editted out "elves are shifty" as I thought "prize the art of thievery" explained it well enough.

We advise you to play a human-fighter if you wish to play an unemployed character as merchants and thieves are hard to play. However getting employed is encouraged while learning the basics of the game. Jobs include spies, hunters, entertainers, aides, crafters, physicians - your ingenuity and ability to play are your only limits. Merchant Houses and Noble Houses are good sources of employment but tend to only hire humans publicly.

Magick exists and is feared. Most magickers that your character will encounter are elementalists, focused on a single force, such as Water, Stone, Wind, or Fire. Sorcerers and Nilazi (Void elementalists) are feared, shunned, and reported to the nearest authority. In Tuluk, all magick is illegal except for the powers practiced by the Templarate. There is no religion in the city-states other than the worship of the Sorcerer-Kings, who do not tolerate other religions.

I think that helps hint that religion outside of the 2 cities does exist.

Merchant houses are also major powers, and guard both their monopolies and secrets well. House Salarr handles weapons and armor, House Kurac handles the drug known as spice, House Nenyuk handles banking, and House Kadius handles luxury goods. Smaller merchant houses exist, struggling for existence wherever they can find a niche.

Clears up the spice thing

I'd change what Bestatte wrote to:

Sexual practices are broad and varied, with no emphasis placed on it other than the disgust at interracial sex and their offspring. Neither homosexuality nor having multiple partners is thought of as abherrant by most societies in Zalanthas. With the exception of the Nobles and Merchant Families, marriage is not legalized, though monogamy and/or multiple bonding between adults is common. Physical and social equality exists between genders on Zalanthas with chivalry being thought of as abberrant by most of society.

It condenses the examples of "what won't happen" to a smaller format while getting the point across still.

Just some ideas

[Carnage]

I say lose the italics. It's more unpleasant for me to read, personally, than seeing font normally.

[Kalden]

I say lose the italics. It's more unpleasant for me to read, personally, than seeing font normally.

Definitely. Couldn't exactly put my finger on what was bothering me, but that's mostly it.

I also agree that the sexual stuff should be taken out. Seems like someone's personal opinion that Zalanthas is full of aberrant sexual behavior. The only thing we know for sure is that there aren't heavy societal biases against it.

[EvilRoeSlade]

Second, you need to mention how the Byn is very receptive to n00bs. Had I knew that and joined the Byn with my first char, he would have lived longer and I would have had a better intro into Arma.

We don't need to put all the newbies in one clan.  They can learn the game much more effectively if they are spread out.  The bit about recommending that people seek employment is quite enough.

[gfair]

I predict that this quick start page will grow so much that it will eventually replace the extended edition.

On the topic of sex, I would say "Sex is not the central purpose of this game.  That said, attitudes towards sex in Zalanthas are very open, homosexuality and polygamy are not taboo or uncommon.  Men and women are equal, so make sure you play your PC and treat others as gender-equal."

Things I'd add:

A second page with common command examples, if we're going to have a quick start page, we should also have a quick interface guide for reference.

A recommendation: Put in time learning the intricasies of the emote system, because old habits die hard and wrongly-formed emotes are (Jarring? A bad habbit?)

Emphasis on the fine line between IC and OOC, and what is not acceptable OOC.

A note on suicide.

[crymerci]

I like the idea behind this page, and I think that newbies will find it helpful.  I disagree with whomever said it was a cheat or a copout.  I do, however,  think there perhaps should be a disclaimer to the effect that "this is not meant to take the place of reading the rest of the game's documentation".

The only other issue I had was with this section:

Your character knows that both the nobility and the templarate are to be feared and avoided. Either group is capable of having a commoner killed for looking at them wrong. Your character believes that nobles are better than ordinary people by right of birth. You can spot nobles and templars by the metal rings they wear, as well as the fact that they are accompanied by guards.

Templars are to be respected and feared.  Nobles are to be respected, but not always feared.  Some inspire fear, some inspire love, some inspire awe, some inspire confusion and then there's a select few that people snicker at.  Yes, they can have you killed, but so can anyone with resources.  Unlike templars, they are not "the law" or "the man", and I think this is a distinction that new players often miss.  Let's not set them off on the wrong track.

Also, as far as rings and guards, this is a good general tip, but not everyone with a guard or even a silver ring is a noble.  I can't think of a better way to put it, though.

[gfair]

Also, as far as rings and guards, this is a good general tip, but not everyone with a guard or even a silver ring is a noble.  I can't think of a better way to put it, though.

"If you see other people bowing or paying courtesy to someone, calling them either "My Lord/Lady" or "Chosen Lord/Lady", chances are they are either a Noble or a Templar.

Does that work?

[EvilRoeSlade]

I agree wholeheartedly.  The purpose of the nobility is to give the common folk a base of power that is more friendly and approachable than the templarate.  A noble who is being feared and avoided is probably doing something wrong.

Your character knows that both the nobility and the templarate are to be feared and avoided. Either group is capable of having a commoner killed for looking at them wrong. Your character believes that nobles are better than ordinary people by right of birth. You can spot nobles and templars by the metal rings they wear, as well as the fact that they are accompanied by guards.

Your character knows that both the nobility and templarate have a great deal of power in the city state.  The templarate commands the militia of the city and wields dread powers, while the nobility are often a source of employment and economic stimulus.  Both should be treated with the appropriate respect and reverence, since they can make life hell for a commoner who displeases them.  Templars wear a set of robes that indicates their status, while nobles can be distinguished by the metal rings they wear and the guards that accompany them.

That's my suggestion.  A newbie could still mistake a merchant family member for a noble, but it is after all, only a quick start.

[EvilRoeSlade]

A Western idea that our players have a hard time abandoning is that there is no sexism on Zalanthas; women and men are treated equally. Keep in mind that the following would not happen in Armageddon: a man expressing shame at being beaten sparring by a woman; someone referring to women as needing protection or coddling; a woman being shamed for sexual promiscuity while a man is praised for it. Attitudes towards sexuality are broad. Homosexuality is common, and not seen as aberrant. Multiple sex partners are common among Zalanthans, particularly in the upper classes. If you intend to roleplay out adult scenes, please make sure you are aware of our consent rules.

I question whether this is even needed in the quick start.  To make it more concise, I propose that it be cut out.  We should teach newbies the general idea of the game world here, and avoid such specifics.  In the end, it's just a minor point that I think is better taught later on after they've managed to get on their feet for a bit.

[Kalden]

Yeah, I agree with ERS. Just leave that sex stuff out.

[Carida]

Well, as a rather brand-spanking new player. I'd have to say that I agree with My 2 Sids on the first part, calling itself a 'quickstart' would have made me think.. Ok I know all the basic stuff.. not going to bother to read the rest. And I would have only have read the other stuff until it was needed and I couldn't understand something.

Also, about the sexual stuff.. personally if I saw this when I first started playing it would have made me think that sex was rampant and this was why it was mentioned in the first place. And would have put me off. But this is just my opinion. And it might not put others off. Most of that stuff I just learned by playing.

But, if its really thought that that perticular section is needed, I would go with Bestatte's suggestion. Because the way it looks now, it does seem to hint that having multiple lovers is the only way to go.

OOoh also about the italic.. yes.. its yucky.. bothered my eyes.