What things should we close?

[Delusion]

A total of 66 members voted. Only 29 said that nothing should close. That gives a majority, although a slight one, who have indicated they feel there is something that should close, though there is obviously no clear consensus on what.

[BadSkeelz]

I voted "No closures" even though I do feel a lot has been opened quickly and without much meaningful integration in to the Known, unless you're in just the right role to see it. Lot of "unearned" statuses or a feeling of throwing stuff at the wall to see what sticks.

The things are open, and people enjoy them. Closing them won't do any favors for attracting or retaining players. Need to improve what we have before opening anything else, though. More living spaces, more things to do, more obtainable goals within the walls.

[Yelinak]

This game should be half its size.

[DesertT]

This game should be half its size.

Just make sure you leave the half that I want to play.

Screw the other half.   

[Vwest]

Great.  Staff acting like they value player input all to say it's a bait and switch to make them feel bad for their behavior.  Amazing strategy.  Can't see how that would damage relations at all.

Are you questioning Great Leader's correct decisions, comrade...?

[Halaster]

The idea of seasons too.

I absolutely love the idea of seasons, I just don't know that we'd ever do it and pull it off on Arm.

The idea being like "for the next year we're focusing on Allanak", and actually un-link Luir's, the Pah, Red Desert, Canyons of Waste.  So basically the game world would be Allanak, RSV, villages, Salt Flats.   Everyone plays in those areas.  Then a year or so later, focus somewhere else.

Again, I don't ever see it happening, more likely that'd be fun to start a new MUD like that.  Just kinda dreaming here.

[Kialae]

Come on guys we're playing a game here. Relax on the staff vitriol.

[Halaster]

Come on guys we're playing a game here. Relax on the staff vitriol.

Eh, we deserve it for this one.  This thread was a spectacular PR disaster, lol

[Pariah]

Come on guys we're playing a game here. Relax on the staff vitriol.

Eh, we deserve it for this one.  This thread was a spectacular PR disaster, lol

I still don't think they should be getting this shitty about it in some cases.  But I have to admit watching some of them freak out over this poll was entertaining to say the least.

I know this is like an accident and you're not supposed to find accidents interesting but I couldn't stop watching this post all day.

[Kialae]

I pretty much have nothing else to do at work but look at the forums. I can play the game too, but barely. I'm highly distracted at work lately (it's that time of year)

[Bebop]

Come on guys we're playing a game here. Relax on the staff vitriol.

Eh, we deserve it for this one.  This thread was a spectacular PR disaster, lol

Agreed.  Not only did it waste everyone's time giving input just to told be told that we're being trolled by staff.  It completely demotivated all of the players in the tribes that were potentially put on the imaginary chopping block as people voted against them being in game. 

If a player did something like this they would be accused of purposefully being sarcastic, sewing discontent, trolling and making drama - and potentially be dealt some kind of ban.    But staff do this to players when we're taking the time to give heart felt input about improving the game, and we're just expected to "learn our lesson" and be told to check our collective behavior and that this was all a punishment to show us we're wrong and to be nice or something?  Over behavior some of us didn't know was occurring?

Then staff ban me off of Discord and Hestia remarks about who "won" the conflict that staff themselves started by doing a fake troll thread when they had no intention of valuing anyone's opinion here?  Absolutely wonderful behavior.  10/10  No favoritism at all confirmed.

If a staff member really has this much resentment for the players that they'd rather troll in this fashion instead of fostering good will or doing a PSA maybe it's time for a break.

I just sent out a slew of kudos to staff today and was encouraging others to do the same in Discord to try to foster good will and this is the response from staff.  Being trolled and banned from the discourse.  Love this for us.

[Pariah]

I pretty much have nothing else to do at work but look at the forums. I can play the game too, but barely. I'm highly distracted at work lately (it's that time of year)

Me too, my job is cursed, if I don't open up a mud app, nobody needs me.

Moment I get into something in a mid client, bam every person in my job needs my help!

[Brokkr]

Come on guys we're playing a game here. Relax on the staff vitriol.

Eh, we deserve it for this one.  This thread was a spectacular PR disaster, lol

Agreed.  Not only did it waste everyone's time giving input just to told be told that we're being trolled by staff.  It completely demotivated all of the players in the tribes that were potentially put on the imaginary chopping block as people voted against them being in game. 

If a player did something like this they would be accused of purposefully being sarcastic, sewing discontent, trolling and making drama - and potentially be dealt some kind of ban.    But staff do this to players when we're taking the time to give heart felt input about improving the game, and we're just expected to "learn our lesson" and be told to check our collective behavior and that this was all a punishment to show us we're wrong and to be nice or something?  Over behavior some of us didn't know was occurring?

Then staff ban me off of Discord and Hestia remarks about who "won" the conflict that staff themselves started by doing a fake troll thread when they had no intention of valuing anyone's opinion here?  Absolutely wonderful behavior.  10/10  No favoritism at all confirmed.

If a staff member really has this much resentment for the players that they'd rather troll in this fashion instead of fostering good will or doing a PSA maybe it's time for a break.

I just sent out a slew of kudos to staff today and was encouraging others to do the same in Discord to try to foster good will and this is the response from staff.  Being trolled and banned from the discourse.  Love this for us.

Whatever the intent, I found the feedback useful.  Which is probably good, because I am the Producer that essentially made the decision to give opening all the Desert Elf tribes up a go, given what we were doing with the Red Fangs at the time.

My understanding is that you were banned for critically insulting another player.  My expectation for what is said here and on Discord is that what is said is in good faith.  Conflating arguments is not in good faith.

I view these places as a dinner table.  It is not your dinner table.  It is not your parent's dinner table. We are not your parents.  It is not our job to teach you manners.  You come to the table with your manners and you use them.  No excuses.  If you were never taught manners or you were and you do not use them, do not expect to be invited back.

It is probably good I am not on Discord much.

[Windstorm]

Brokkr: I don't believe Bebop intended to insult anyone in particular and I don't think they really did. Discord's history is thorough and I encourage you to read it. Someone got singled out, perhaps unfairly, but I don't think insult was had.

They were frustrated after something was aired here in a sort of frustrating manner and I don't really think that should be incorrectly reframed upon Bebop without some regards for the context. I didn't read anything they wrote as personally insulting to anyone.

Bebop was frustrated. There's been some frustration in the air lately. Not all of it has been expressed well.

I think not just one, not just two, but a good number of people around here that have been getting negative towards each other fairly consistently need to take a step back and take a breath and get their heads on straight.

We're here to have fun together. This is a game. It's a shared creative hobby we all enjoy. Some for different reasons and some with different visions of how it should be than others.

But we're all here to have fun. Let's try to get back to that instead of pointing fingers and trying to tell everyone else how they should play, whether their creativity should exist where it does or not.

Take a breath. Calm down. It's a game. We're here to have fun.

<3

[Kialae]

This nonsense is exactly why it's better to just not engage with the community (I know I have been here of late, but I'm usually standoffish) and have fun with the game. It's done me wonders. Leave the discord. It's great for your wellness and enjoyment of the game.

[H182]

I imagine there's a large amount of players, myself included, who generally avoid the forum because we're not interested in reading through the massive amount of absurd complaints and seeing the same niche of often toxic forum members complain about different things over and over.

There's a large amount of people who play the game, and avoid the forum and discord altogether for what are most likely obvious reasons.

Some people just enjoy playing the game. Admins, you are doing a great job with everything.

[BadSkeelz]

lol they're clearly not. They're trying but there have been some massive self-owns of late.

[Windstorm]

This is what I mean. What does anyone benefit from random oneliners chiming in just to crap on their efforts?

This community really needs more positivity and less cheeky shots at the people working to make it fun and being yelled at from all sides over it.

If anything's self-owning, it's the entire community self-owning itself. We're all supposed to be here because we're enjoying something together.

They're trying. Are you? Or are you just tearing it down?

[H182]

People simply need to remember that there is a whole large segment of the playerbase who avoids the forum.
The little niche  of posters in the forum does not constitute the opinions of the entire playerbase.

There are many people who just play to play.

This thread is an example of what is wrong with the forum. 

A poll thread like this where votes are being cast suggesting the closure of clans. Have you asked the people who
play in the clans? Who want to play in the clans? Or are you assuming that the voting poll represents the entire
playerbase and everyone who is active in game - including people who avoid the forum.

If you've never had a Dune Stalker, been involved with them IC, or know anything about it, do you really have the right
to vote for the closure of that clan What about the people who play in it? What about the people
who really enjoy it, but just don't want to come post on the forum?

What about people who love the clan and have contributed
to its development and history? Just because you, as a player, might not like a clan or rarely see characters from it does not mean
it's absent and not contributing to the richness of the game world. Have you asked the people who actually love playing it?

The forum is a small part of the voice of the players. Even less so those who post. It is not THE VOICE of the players
and does not represent the opinion of the majority or whole.

Not everything appeals to everyone, but some things appeal to some. It's about the enjoyment each player has and their ability
to help write and shape the world. Keep others in mind.

[BadSkeelz]

They're trying. Are you? Or are you just tearing it down?

Hey, I'm playing the game as the docs intended. All I ask from Staff is to approve my characters and RP with me on their innumerable avatars. That's all they gotta do to get a check mark in my book.

[Tuannon]

Personally I think Skeelz is a net credit to the game, just probably needs a bit better delivery and PR.

Don't conflate this with the negativity elsewhere, it's not the same.

[Patuk]

I don't know why this turned into a gdb hate thread and I have no idea how to figure it out. Maybe we could cunningly improve discourse on it by not trolling the playerbase en masse or something.

[HazelHomewrecker]

Then staff ban me off of Discord and Hestia remarks about who "won" the conflict that staff themselves started by doing a fake troll thread when they had no intention of valuing anyone's opinion here?  Absolutely wonderful behavior.  10/10  No favoritism at all confirmed.

I don't think that was a literal remark, and I don't appreciate the notion of staff favoritism on my part. I like to at least think that everything until now has been based on the merit of my writing and not because they just like me. It also devalues so much of the work I've done, but I try to be understanding of you because I know you were feeling very passionate about how you felt concerning the whole debacle. I have literally no problems with you, I would like to see you return fully to the discord and play the game happily, but I'm sick of being targeted at this point--and I certainly don't need staff white-knighting for me either.

If you have nothing better to do than attack me because you perceive favoritism, then yeah I think it IS time for you to take a break.

The poll thread was a troll bait-and-switch that never should have happened, especially in this case where a PSA could have really done the job ten times better without getting people involved to the point where they felt unheard and unappreciated. I added you on Discord, and I would be glad to talk to you to try and smooth things out between us (honestly, I still don't know why you have issues with ME when we've literally only spoken twice before.)

[valeria]

A total of 66 members voted. Only 29 said that nothing should close. That gives a majority, although a slight one, who have indicated they feel there is something that should close, though there is obviously no clear consensus on what.

I realize this thread has turned into something else, but I just want to point out that this is not necessarily true.  Because there was the ability to select more than one thing, some people (like me) may have selected 'don't close anything' but also the thing they would prefer to see closed, if anything.

[Lotion]

close everything except tablelands and take away free clan water
remove the virtual world
open every possible clan in the tablelands
give people a hack and slash fight for survival with enforced rp for like two months and see how it goes