Weapons Out!

[nauta]

So.  I'm not much of a combat person -- let's just get that out there.  However, a number of times I've been told, in game, to keep my weapons out while wandering around by superiors or people who want to keep me safe.  This has always bothered me, since, I mean, who the hell walks around, for miles and miles and miles, while riding or while running, with their weapons out?  (Mutatis mutandis for all those guys at the bar with shields held in their right hand, a beer in the other.)

I assume there's a coded benefit to having a weapon out (it helps with defense or some first strike thing if some NPC randomly jumps you?) and so people were trying to ICly tell me about something with an OOC benefit.  But.

What -do- people think about all our characters running around with scissors in their hand?  Is this one of those things that you just overlook and suspend disbelief on?  Is this something I'm not understanding about how Zalanthan life really is?  Is there even a potential 'fix' to it, coded -- autodraw or something -- or social?

[Marauder Moe]

I think it's one of those oddities of Armageddon we just have to accept.  Combat in this game can begin very quickly with little to no warning, and the penalties for being unarmed when attacked are really severe.

[BadSkeelz]

Pretty much what Moe said. Riding around unarmed in the wilderness is just too dangerous to willfully do it. It's not uncommon to see mobs enter a room and instantly attack (twice). There isn't time to draw a weapon.

[Asanadas]

Those NPC spiders aren't going to RP with you. You have to just accept riding around armed as a part of the game. I just emote putting the sword on the side of the saddle, or whatever.

[Dar]

I would say riding around unarmed would become acceptable as soon as we become capable of looking diagonally.

[FantasyWriter]

I just emote laying it across my lap or something like that.

[nauta]

Disclaimer: I'm no codemaster.

IDEA: autodraw (nosave autodraw).  This would automatically draw the weapons in the order you sheathed them when an NPC initiates combat. 

(Also, didn't they change the auto-combat thing on NPCs a while ago to slow it down?  I know the few times I've had nasties arrive from the west there's been a few clicks where I had plenty of time to draw my weapons.)

I get you can emote your way around it, but there are also situations -- PC to PC -- where there's a lot of unnecessary gruntage about having weapons out and being all menacing when really they missed the emote about the weapon being on your lap.  (Or something.  I guess it's super minor and veterans are used to it.)

IDEA: stamina or endurance drains each league you have a weapon drawn, plus a chance of poking your eye out if you are running with scissors.

[BadSkeelz]

What would that actually add to the game other than a hassle for warriors?

[RogueGunslinger]

(Also, didn't they change the auto-combat thing on NPCs a while ago to slow it down?  I know the few times I've had nasties arrive from the west there's been a few clicks where I had plenty of time to draw my weapons.)

No, not at all. And if your internet lags for a fraction of a second it can even seem like the mob shows up and attacks instantly.

And the double-attack bug is fucking brutal sometimes.

[Jave]

Just draw your weapons codedly and then RP as if you have them sheathed but at the ready Nauta. It really is a code thing in this instance. The NPC's (unless animated) are going to close and attack you without pause.

[Jihelu]

I always rp it as holding the handle and not being retarded/being able to draw fast when getting rushed.

[RogueGunslinger]

I just roleplay that I have my weapons and shield are out all the time. Because my characters are endurant badasses who never tire.... Unless they walk in the desert a little bit. They all have chicken-legs too.

[KankWhisperer]

No weapons outside? WITCH!

[Riev]

No weapons outside? WITCH!

[Refugee]

No weapons outside? WITCH!

[Delirium]

Which is an OOC attitude created by the coded necessity of having one's weapons out while travelling, but prevalent enough that it's wise to regard it. When even a limp-wristed merchant is better off carrying a big fuck-off sword compared to nothing, having one's hands empty is very suspicious.

[Jingo]

There should be a ten second delay and a ride check when manipulating your inventory with weapon out and riding.

[Saellyn]

There should be a ten second delay and a ride check when manipulating your inventory with weapon out and riding.

Yeah, -no-.

[valeria]

I don't mind it.  I know that realistically, sheathes are a thing for a reason (because weapons are very heavy).  But I also know that the code isn't always realistic, so I don't equate <primary hand> with held up and ready for combat.  I view it as just being near to hand.  Maybe I'm riding around with my hand on my sword hilt, ready to iaido when danger appears.

[Vwest]

What -do- people think about all our characters running around with scissors in their hand?  Is this one of those things that you just overlook and suspend disbelief on?  Is this something I'm not understanding about how Zalanthan life really is?

I normally just play it off as my character being hardened to having a weapons or two out most of the time.

We usually blow off horrific creatures as trivial because a raptor or a scrab can be killed without too much risk, even to relatively new characters. I like to look at the creatures in-game and assess -v them when my character is face to face and engaged with them, to keep things in perspective. Sure, my character can blender them into tiny, harmless chunks in seconds, but that doesn't make them any less monstrous and they're not something any sane person would ever want to risk encountering without a weapon in hand.

If I have a character focused on an especially large weapon, like a halberd or greatsword, I'll normally have them travel with a lighter weapon in hand.

But generally? My characters carry their weapons in hand and I don't play it off as just having them sheathed by ready. My characters carry their weapons out because holy shit these creatures are terrifying and they're everywhere.

Code-wise, because of how obscenely broken unarmed vs armed combat is in Arm, it's borderline suicidal for anyone to be caught in the danger zone without a weapon drawn. I've seen important, high skill characters killed in seconds because they forgot to draw weapons, then lost link in a dangerous place, like the 'rinth or out in the desert, to the most common and irrelevant of aggro NPCs.

There should be a ten second delay and a ride check when manipulating your inventory with weapon out and riding.

And people say I'm a troll.

[hyzhenhok]

I am of the opinion that not every little coded thing needs to be interpreted as a literal thing within the game world when they are inconsequential. When someone forgets they're holding a mug until they get to the compound, whatever, let them discard it and ignore it. Everyone is sitting around the bar with full helmets and facewraps and sunslits on--whatever! We play on and pretend that's not actually how things are. I will froth at the mouth and ragequit if you try to make it an IC plot point that my newbie clannie forgot to unstrap his shield after sparring.

But...having weapons equipped or not while riding actual has serious code consequences to both your riding and your combat. I'm all for handwaving away things that don't matter and are merely a matter of convenience, but the "my weapons are drawn but not really" thing seems pretty borderline. If you ride up to me with your character codedly armed and ready to fight, but try to RP that you are not armed and ready to fight, that's not going to work for me. If you want to RP as a badass or an ignorant fool who rides with his weapon sheathed or in his lap instead of at the ready, I think you should actually do so codedly.

I think in Zalanthas, you should not feel silly riding around with one weapon in hand. Riding from Allanak to Tuluk with both hands full the whole way, yeah, I think that's a bit silly. But one weapon? Your character can do a lot of things with the weapon while it's still in hand, so it doesn't mean you're literally riding around in a battle stance. And nasty stuff might surprise you at any moment in your journey.

[Saellyn]

Know how I RP it?

Leaning it on my shoulder. My hand's on the hilt, that weapon -is in my hand-, but it's leaning against my shoulder.

Or over my shoulders.

Or in my lap with my hand very much on it.

Either way you look at it, though, it's up to the player to RP it properly. The problem with this is how NPCs (and some PCs, don't even try to tell me otherwise) will see you out there, and if you're not armed? They will destroy you and end you as fast as they can.

[nauta]

But...having weapons equipped or not while riding actual has serious code consequences to both your riding and your combat.

In a sense this is right, but in another sense it isn't.  At present, the way it -looks- to a casual observer, then, yes, it looks as if we have a binary affair: weapon sheathed / weapons out.  But from what I gather up above, things aren't as binary.

There's two options, if it is even worth pursuing, that I thought of:

1. Semantics.  Just change the language of drawing / holding / wielding / sheathing weapons to something more vague, e.g., you ready your weapon near your hand.  Change what look tells you to something like: readied near the primary hand.  Leave the code exactly the same, since having a weapon readied and having it drawn are (codedly) the same thing.

2. Autodraw.  The hoped for implementation would be to not add any extra hassle to people -- if an NPC arrives, it automatically draws the weapons out before they strike.  It'd have to be a save toggle, since certain people might not want to autodraw.

What would that actually add to the game other than a hassle for warriors?

Well, as I mentioned above, I'd hope it doesn't add a hassle to anyone at all.

[KankWhisperer]

3. It's not a big deal.

[Jingo]

Maybe some of us like the idea of a lone ranger that needs to draw his gun and not have it his mega dexterous hands at all times.

[KankWhisperer]

[Refugee]

There's a lot of things you have to do to accommodate the code in this game.  We just accept it and move on.  You intentionally just ignore it.  It's part of playing this game, or any game really.

If you're arbitrarily going to pick something from all the things we have to do to criticize in someone's RP, then pick something else.  Because really, it's no big deal unless you make it a big deal, and that's a choice -you- make.  It's already brutal out there, and this will make it ridiculously worse.

Besides, one of the greatest moments in any of my PC's lives is when they forget to empty a hand and the beetle still -moves-.  It's always a wonderful milestone.

[Asanadas]

You can feel free to make fun of my character always riding around with his sword out with your character.

And then you can do it on your next character, and your next character, and your next...   

[hyzhenhok]

But...having weapons equipped or not while riding actual has serious code consequences to both your riding and your combat.

In a sense this is right, but in another sense it isn't.  At present, the way it -looks- to a casual observer, then, yes, it looks as if we have a binary affair: weapon sheathed / weapons out.  But from what I gather up above, things aren't as binary.

It is binary. When an item is vaguely, generally about your person but not held or equipped in a certain place, that's what your inventory space is for. Roleplaying that an item is floating in your inventory when you've actually ep'd it is like using backstab on someone and roleplaying that you were just trying to knock them out. When you have a better coded alternative for what you're trying to play out, and the coded difference is relevant to the situation at hand, I don't think you can justify doing one thing and roleplaying that you did the other.

There's a lot of things you have to do to accommodate the code in this game.  We just accept it and move on.  You intentionally just ignore it.  It's part of playing this game, or any game really.

If you're arbitrarily going to pick something from all the things we have to do to criticize in someone's RP, then pick something else.  Because really, it's no big deal unless you make it a big deal, and that's a choice -you- make.  It's already brutal out there, and this will make it ridiculously worse.

There's lots of things we ignore, but this isn't arbitrarily picking something out. Making a choice to do something codedly when that choice has coded effects that are very relevant to the situation at hand and then roleplaying that you didn't do that coded thing seems very clearly over the line to me. It is not comparable to stuff like not bothering to take off your helmet and sunslits and armored gauntlets every time you enter a tavern out of coded convenience.

[555]

Explain mounted archers? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mounted_archery

[nauta]

I think it's important to remember that we're talking about weapons out while riding (or running) for miles and miles and miles.  I think there might be three schools of thought on the subject (judging from the above):

1. It's realistic.  Period.  We're motherfucking Zalanthans.  That's how we roll.  Kiss that muscle.  Right there.

2. It's unrealistic, but just RP around the code -- use emotes to act as if a drawn weapon isn't drawn.

3. It's unrealistic -and- it's a bit of a cheat.

For my part, I kind of think it's a bit unrealistic -- at least if there's no concomitant hit to endurance after a period of time.  I'm not sure if I'm (2) or (3), however.

[555]

Infantry marches for ten, twenty, thirty, fourty miles, at a quick pace, with weapons out. This can get quite tiresome with an M-249, much less and M-60 or M-240B, which is why those with the proper build are usually chosen for such weapons. Also, Zalanthans do tend to be a lot stronger and tougher than your average earthling.

[Vwest]

Maybe some of us like the idea of a lone ranger that needs to draw his gun and not have it his mega dexterous hands at all times.

So have your character keep their weapons sheathed until it's time to draw, partner.

Nothing stopping you.

[Zerero]

The lone ranger comes upon a dusty traveler in the middle of the desert. Both of their weapons are sheathed. They nod respectfully toward each other and begin to go in opposite directions, neither of them looking back.

[RogueGunslinger]

I have actually had that exact scenario happen, usually out foraging or something though.

[BadSkeelz]

If you don't want to ride around wielding a weapon, you're welcome to do so.

Enjoy your RP superiority on your many, many new characters.

[Refugee]

There's a lot of things you have to do to accommodate the code in this game.  We just accept it and move on.  You intentionally just ignore it.  It's part of playing this game, or any game really.

If you're arbitrarily going to pick something from all the things we have to do to criticize in someone's RP, then pick something else.  Because really, it's no big deal unless you make it a big deal, and that's a choice -you- make.  It's already brutal out there, and this will make it ridiculously worse.

There's lots of things we ignore, but this isn't arbitrarily picking something out. Making a choice to do something codedly when that choice has coded effects that are very relevant to the situation at hand and then roleplaying that you didn't do that coded thing seems very clearly over the line to me. It is not comparable to stuff like not bothering to take off your helmet and sunslits and armored gauntlets every time you enter a tavern out of coded convenience.

Ah.  I obviously wasn't clear.  I didn't mean to ignore people RPing that they aren't armed when they are, which seems kinda lame to me too since they'll get the coded benefit. 

I mean to ignore that we ride around with our weapons out because ... code.  We're all a bunch of badass harsh-world survivor sorts with battle beetles that we steer with our legs and seats like a well-trained cutting horse.  But if you're not that, do feel free to leave your sword in your sheath! 

Unless your sergeant orders you to arm yourself, in which case, suck it up and take the consequences.

[whitt]

I think it's important to remember that we're talking about weapons out while riding (or running) for miles and miles and miles. 

Problem being with this, is that the critters encountered magickally appear right next to you as soon as you or they enter a room.  Fix this so there is time to "draw sword" between "An xxx arrives" and "An xxx slashes at you delivering a grievous wound.  You reel from the blow."  and this becomes less of an issue.

[KankWhisperer]

Stealthed NPCs are going to have a field day with these new no-weapon role players.

I mean NPCs will totally respect your role-play choices!

[Vwest]

Stealthed NPCs are going to have a field day with these new no-weapon role players.

Kagors rising.

[Majikal]

You can feel free to make fun of my character always riding around with his sword out with your character.

And then you can do it on your next character, and your next character, and your next...   

Nominate best post in thread. 

[BadSkeelz]

You can feel free to make fun of my character always riding around with his sword out with your character.

And then you can do it on your next character, and your next character, and your next...  

Nominate best post in thread.  

Seconded. KankWhisperer makes good points too.

[Jave]

It just depends on context Nauta. While riding around out in the desert with weapons codedly drawn but RP'ing as if they are just at the ready -- it's no big deal. Your character is in theory on the lookout for dangers and you just want to be codedly prepared for that. No one's gonna think that you're cheating.

However, if you and your main squeeze are mudsexing in an apartment and roleplaying as if you're naked with clothes and armor tossed all around but actually you're fully armored with weapons drawn scanning and listening while crafting a travel cake -- we tread into the realm of people thinking you're being an idiot 

[555]

However, if you and your main squeeze are mudsexing in an apartment and roleplaying as if you're naked with clothes and armor tossed all around but actually you're fully armored with weapons drawn scanning and listening while crafting a travel cake -- we tread into the realm of people thinking you're being an idiot  

What's wrong with that? I just happen to be very good at multi-tasking.

[Patuk]

OP: 'what's the deal with weapons drawn everywhere huh'

Response: 'git gud scrub'

/thread

[KankWhisperer]

OP: 'what's the deal with weapons drawn everywhere huh'

Response: 'git gud scrub'

/thread

My main concern was this becoming some kind of trend of wanting people to be suicidal for no real gain. I also don't think it warrants Staff coding time, personally. I also don't think it is all that unrealistic. I've hiked around all day with a hatchet or machete for example and I'm no Zalanthian.

Really it's if you want to play 'hard mode' for your own jollies. I roll all random stats and never store. I don't expect everyone to do that, however.

[Mordiggian]

You as a player are free to make the decision to ride without your weapons out.

You could even set up client-side triggers that would automatically draw your weapons in combat, if you have the know-how.

The odds of any sort of auto-draw function being added are slim for both code and balance reasons that I'm not going to get into on the GDB.

[Saellyn]

I wonder if you can set up an autodraw script for yourself.

Take into account EVERY SINGLE mob animal that exists outside. Now create a script that draws when ANY of those arrive.

Now you can ride outside, with weapon sheathed.

Hope nobody stole it while you weren't looking.

[Akariel]

Wildcards bro. Have it trigger when * arrives from the east.

[nauta]

Wildcards bro. Have it trigger when * arrives from the east.

I haven't tested this in tintin++:

Code Select Expand


#action {^%* has arrived from the {west|east|north|south|up|down}} {stand; draw bone.sword; draw bone.sword; pem nipples stiffen.}


(I'd also have to test the lag from draw vs. the non-lag from angry things like carru and mekillots or whatever.  Also, the stand is in there because I often mudsex outside.)

[Saellyn]

Well. Hm. The issue with wildcards is that applies to... -everything-.

* arrives from the east

instadraw


You want it to react to npcs because they're the danger, not pcs.

Unless you want it to react to PCs. I dunno.

[Jave]

You guys drew weapons on Sandy Claws during Githmas ... yeah I think our playerbase would draw weapons on each other as quickly as an NPC 

[hopeandsorrow]

I envision a situation where with in a tense meeting where tempers are high between random elements of criminality, mercenaries, and hunters.

The talks are near a conclusion, for once there will be no blood shed but then suddenly...

A rat arrives from west.


The mid level power structure flattens out in one spam fest.

Kind of wish it would happen.

[Delirium]

Well. Hm. The issue with wildcards is that applies to... -everything-.

* arrives from the east

instadraw


You want it to react to npcs because they're the danger, not pcs.

Unless you want it to react to PCs. I dunno.

That's where you get into regex. Though I am not sure I'd want to autodraw since drawing a weapon incurs a delay.

Dying to a mekillot because you are set to autodraw your weapons upon their arrival would be... hilarious I guess.

[KankWhisperer]

[nauta]

Well. Hm. The issue with wildcards is that applies to... -everything-.

* arrives from the east

instadraw


You want it to react to npcs because they're the danger, not pcs.

Unless you want it to react to PCs. I dunno.

That's where you get into regex. Though I am not sure I'd want to autodraw since drawing a weapon incurs a delay.

Dying to a mekillot because you are set to autodraw your weapons upon their arrival would be... hilarious I guess.

Yep.  I thought the suggestion to client-side it was in jest, though.  The only (non suicidal) solution would be to do it server-side, granted that charging beasts will gore before you can draw your weapons under the current code regime.  (Other suggestions above are interesting too: give some delay between the 'X arrives' and 'X attacks' and allow us to look around corners.)

But, from what I can tell, it's just a peculiar quirk of Armageddon code, and so we should always have weapons drawn; the way things stand now code-wise, this is the only option and I guess we just suspend disbelief a little.

(On an unrelated note, I find it a little humorous what you can and can't do while resting.  I can't open this ceramic tube or my belt, but I -can- continue wielding my two weapons, draw, and sheath.)

Point of discussion: Would people not autoflee as much (and would more variety in wilderness RP occur) if this peculiarity were smoothed out?  On the one hand, I like how it is pretty 'tense' out there; on the other hand, it does seem to limit the sorts of flavor roles one can pursue outside the city.  (I like how the rinth worked in this regards: the NPCs were not aggro so you could wander around and play that flavor role of a poor urchin without any fear of NPC death.)

[Marauder Moe]

Wilderness RP... with NPC animals?

[BadSkeelz]

Point of discussion: Would people not autoflee as much (and would more variety in wilderness RP occur) if this peculiarity were smoothed out?  On the one hand, I like how it is pretty 'tense' out there; on the other hand, it does seem to limit the sorts of flavor roles one can pursue outside the city.  (I like how the rinth worked in this regards: the NPCs were not aggro so you could wander around and play that flavor role of a poor urchin without any fear of NPC death.)

No.

The wilderness is wild. It isn't a place for flavor roles, unless you want to be feeding the wildlife.

Incidentally, the only time I've spamfled is when someone drew a weapon in a blacked out room (they didn't know I was there, but seeing it was disconcerting enough that I took no chances). I'm not particularly proud of it, but the fact is that riding around unarmed and drawing a weapon is far more suspicious than riding around while armed.

[nauta]

Wilderness RP... with NPC animals?

Yep - kank whisperers and the like.  

'Flavour role' is probably a better way to capture the idea rather than those into bestiality with carru (although, you know...) -- in the rinth you can play a (weaponless) urchin.  Examples in the wild (all possible now, just tack on +"giant bone sword" for now): grebbers, leaf gatherers, wandering minstrels, storytellers, lore gatherers, chalton farmers, chalton farmhands, merchants.  Especially in the tribes, it's hard to believe that everyone in a tribe is a buff combat dude/tte.

I can see the arguments against such roles as being disgustingly anti-Zalanthan; hence the point of discussion.

[BadSkeelz]

Those roles can exist already. They just won't exist very long unless they get a buff dude/tte  to watch their back.

Our PCs live in a world of giant insects that can lurk invisibly in stony ground and ninja dinosaurs that can hide behind a blade of grass, so long as they're northwest of us. If you don't want to walk around with a weapon drawn, don't. Either accept you're going to die or hire people who are willing to meet the code on its terms. You'll do a lot more to foster interaction and fun by hiring people to protect you than you would instituting a pointless and detrimental code change like what you've proposed.

[Asanadas]

Bring in directional look code, and it'll help roleplay here, I'm sure.

[Jingo]

Holy shit some people are defensive.

I just think it's a damn shame the game works the way it does. I'm not expecting anyone to play a certain way. And I certainly wasn't expecting anyone to ridicule what I thought would be a rule of cool idea.

[Desertman]

So.  I'm not much of a combat person -- let's just get that out there.  However, a number of times I've been told, in game, to keep my weapons out while wandering around by superiors or people who want to keep me safe.  This has always bothered me, since, I mean, who the hell walks around, for miles and miles and miles, while riding or while running, with their weapons out?  

I'm assuming you are in the desert?

In Zalanthas, you hardly ever go anywhere without getting attacked a few times on every single trip.

It isn't like going hiking in Yellow Stone and seeing a bear that only attacks you one in fifty thousand encounters....

In Zalanthas you are going to see that bear 98% of the time and 100% of the time that bear is going to attack every single time you get close enough to see it.

Being told to keep a weapon at hand or a shield out is just the realistic day-to-day math of being a travelling Zalanthan.

It's not about if you are going to get attacked. It's about when, and how many times, and how hard is the attack going to hit you.

IRL, you absolutely wouldn't ride for miles and miles with your weapon at hand. Zalanthas is not RL though.

The RL equivalent would be me telling you that you have to go hiking for several miles through the forest. You are told ahead of time you WILL get attacked by two to four bears by surprise at different times before you reach your destination. I give you a sword and tell you that you can carry it, or you can sheathe it on your back.

Are you going to carry the sword in your hand, or are you going to sheathe it on your back?

[KankWhisperer]

So.  I'm not much of a combat person -- let's just get that out there.  However, a number of times I've been told, in game, to keep my weapons out while wandering around by superiors or people who want to keep me safe.  This has always bothered me, since, I mean, who the hell walks around, for miles and miles and miles, while riding or while running, with their weapons out?  

I'm assuming you are in the desert?

In Zalanthas, you hardly ever go anywhere without getting attacked a few times on every single trip.

It isn't like going hiking in Yellow Stone and seeing a bear that only attacks you one in fifty thousand encounters....

In Zalanthas you are going to see that bear 98% of the time and 100% of the time that bear is going to attack every single time you get close enough to see it.

Being told to keep a weapon at hand or a shield out is just the realistic day-to-day math of being a travelling Zalanthan.

It's not about if you are going to get attacked. It's about when, and how many times, and how hard is the attack going to hit you.

IRL, you absolutely wouldn't ride for miles and miles with your weapon at hand. Zalanthas is not RL though.

The RL equivalent would be me telling you that you have to go hiking for several miles through the forest. You are told ahead of time you WILL get attacked by two to four bears by surprise at different times before you reach your destination. I give you a sword and tell you that you can carry it, or you can sheathe it on your back.

Are you going to carry the sword in your hand, or are you going to sheathe it on your back?

Stab you because will lose to bears.

[Desertman]

So.  I'm not much of a combat person -- let's just get that out there.  However, a number of times I've been told, in game, to keep my weapons out while wandering around by superiors or people who want to keep me safe.  This has always bothered me, since, I mean, who the hell walks around, for miles and miles and miles, while riding or while running, with their weapons out?  

I'm assuming you are in the desert?

In Zalanthas, you hardly ever go anywhere without getting attacked a few times on every single trip.

It isn't like going hiking in Yellow Stone and seeing a bear that only attacks you one in fifty thousand encounters....

In Zalanthas you are going to see that bear 98% of the time and 100% of the time that bear is going to attack every single time you get close enough to see it.

Being told to keep a weapon at hand or a shield out is just the realistic day-to-day math of being a travelling Zalanthan.

It's not about if you are going to get attacked. It's about when, and how many times, and how hard is the attack going to hit you.

IRL, you absolutely wouldn't ride for miles and miles with your weapon at hand. Zalanthas is not RL though.

The RL equivalent would be me telling you that you have to go hiking for several miles through the forest. You are told ahead of time you WILL get attacked by two to four bears by surprise at different times before you reach your destination. I give you a sword and tell you that you can carry it, or you can sheathe it on your back.

Are you going to carry the sword in your hand, or are you going to sheathe it on your back?

Stab you because will lose to bears.

Well played Sir.

[Refugee]

 

[TheWanderer]

if my underlings want to be the very best they can be by needlessly risking their lives through small, barely noticeable things that will garner absolutely zero attention from me or the majority of the playerbase

more power to them

[Desertman]

if my underlings want to be the very best they can be by needlessly risking their lives through small, barely noticeable things that will garner absolutely zero attention from me or the majority of the playerbase

more power to them

Thanks, now this song is in my head.

[valeria]

There's a difference between ridicule and principled disagreement.  If you read my posts in the tone of this:


"Just not a fan."

... it's more accurate to how I intend them when I'm disagreeing with someone's idea.

[Jave]

I laughed 

[Saellyn]

JESUS CHRIST WHAT IS THAT GET IT OUT OF THE THREAD

God damn spiders are creepy!

[WanderingOoze]

If dying is the most likely outcome of riding with
My weapons sheathed, yeah...weapons out.  IC reason?
I dont wanna get ded, son.

[Patuk]

If dying is the most likely outcome of riding with
My weapons sheathed, yeah...weapons out.  IC reason?
I dont wanna get ded, son.

Sure, now you think that's a good idea

Also this thread's tone is and remains awful

[WanderingOoze]

If dying is the most likely outcome of riding with
My weapons sheathed, yeah...weapons out.  IC reason?
I dont wanna get ded, son.

Sure, now you think that's a good idea

Also this thread's tone is and remains awful

Haha...Yeah, I learned  my lesson.

[BadSkeelz]

Sure, now you think that's a good idea

Also this thread's tone is and remains awful

Just like the idea.

I'll give up being able to ride with weapons out if we also knock out other unrealistic and immersion-breaking factors like magick and non-human races.

[BadSkeelz]

Stepping aside from the code considerations, I really like the "Weapons out!" moment and the image of a war group arming themselves before leaving the gate. It's a sign that shit may about to get real as you leave civilization behind.

[Patuk]

'no u' in any shape or form does nothing to make this a better thread. Stop it.

[BadSkeelz]

Cry me a river. The objections and critiques in this thread are no less thought-out or presented than the original idea.

[bcw81]

Guys, please, watch it. Either discourse can be had, or I'm going to start moderating.

[Refugee]

Stepping aside from the code considerations, I really like the "Weapons out!" moment and the image of a war group arming themselves before leaving the gate. It's a sign that shit may about to get real as you leave civilization behind.

I like this too.  It's sort of team-building.  "It's just us now guys, against a whole world that wants us dead.  I've got your back, you've got mine."

[KankWhisperer]

[nauta]

Cry me a river. The objections and critiques in this thread are no less thought-out or presented than the original idea.

Hey Badskeelz!

Which idea are your criticizing?  If it's the autodraw idea, then here's the proposal.  It's still not thought out, but I don't see why you'd be against it, other than on the grounds that it's new code, and there are better things for the coders to fuss with (and then we totally agree).

autodraw (a toggle): if an NPC makes a move to attack, you will automatically draw your weapons, because being unarmed sucks.  Unlike with draw, there is no delay and you'd always draw before the attack happened.  And if you want to suck like a gick breed elf, you can do nosave autodraw to not automatically draw.

So, there's no fuss no muss: if a spider jumps out of nowhere, you will quickly draw your weapon before it can attack you.

Unless there's something I'm missing.  I also agree with the view that there's nothing wrong with badass Zalanthans charging out of the gates weapons out, especially units of soldiers.  I just also think that my wrists would get tired after a while.

[Sinister]

Personally I think that would take away from the RP. A assassin creeps up on his unarmed victim. LOOK he magically has all his weapons in hands.

[nauta]

Personally I think that would take away from the RP. A assassin creeps up on his unarmed victim. LOOK he magically has all his weapons in hands.

Definitely.  It'd be limited to NPCs -- PCs would not be affected.

[BadSkeelz]

Cry me a river. The objections and critiques in this thread are no less thought-out or presented than the original idea.

Hey Badskeelz!

Hi Nauta!

I've disliked every single one of your ideas in this thread.

Thematically, I feel that riding around armed is the proper thing to do in the setting and for what (most of) our characters are. I think we'd lose more than we'd gain by making Arm more "realistic" in this regard.

Taking exception to characters riding around with their weapons in their hands seems a ridiculous quibble when we play in a world of giant insects, niinja dinosaurs, All Terrain Elves, magickers, and hairless dorfs who aren't going blind.

Trying to "correct" it with code (like your autodraw) is a solution in search of a problem. It isn't necessary, it would distract our coders from other issues, and even if implemented it ultimately adds nothing.

You would also have to overhaul the entire NPC engagement/combat system to make riding unarmed anything less than a death sentence.

Finally, there is nothing stopping you personally from playing a PC that is too weak to actually ride around arm. Please feel free to do so, more power to you. But there's no reason to inconvenience the rest of the playerbase with something that makes only you happy.

[TheWanderer]

I pretend they put their weapons in their lap or something on occasion. It's not like they're just held at a rigid, unmoving position their entire ride through the desert.

[Vwest]

And I certainly wasn't expecting anyone to ridicule what I thought would be a rule of cool idea.

lol noob

l2gdb

[LauraMars]

I think every facet of this subject has been discussed to exhaustion, and to avoid further sniping and uncharitable remarks I'll go ahead and lock this thread.