How elves regard humans?

[loopylobes]

How do elves treat humans when they talk? Is it OK RP-wise for an elf to start up a conversation with a human in a tavern?

What is the most RP way an elf will regard a human?

Thankyou!

[RogueGunslinger]

Mistrust, I'd presume.

Yes it' alright to strike up a conversation with a human in a tavern.

[Fathi]

It's okay for an elf to strike up a conversation with anyone if he thinks there's a good reason (see: profit, swindling, making contacts).

Keep in mind that pride is one of the defining elven characteristics. Elves are proud to be elves--they're proud to be quick, sly, sneaky, tricky, and especially proud to be a member of their tribe. Conversely, a human is not so quick, not so sly, not so sneaky, and not so tricky. And humans almost all don't have tribes.

I think the way an elf would regard a human in that aspect varies: they might feel a sort of condescending type of pity or just outright racist dislike. Some elven tribes are a lot more racist and xenophobic than others.

In the end, I think an elf would see a human as a tool they could use to achieve their own goals. If that means "befriending" the human in order to gain an advantage, such as having the human around to help them with a certain task or to funnel information or to merely sell stuff to, then I think the elf in question would be more than motivated to start up a conversation and act congenial. But an elf would never really befriend a human unless extreme trials of trust had been passed--and even then, a human is not a member of the elf's tribe.

[loopylobes]

Are there such things as tribeless city elves? How would one be affected by not having a tribe?

[RogueGunslinger]

Are there such things as tribeless city elves? How would one be affected by not having a tribe?

They, themselves, would be their tribe.

[SMuz]

Hmm.. here's something I'm wondering - How would elves treat their clans? I mean, I wouldn't want an elf in my clan for worry that he'd steal all the stuff from the store or be all disloyal to the clan if his tribe wants to rip off my clan. I'd assume that an elf wouldn't steal from his clan because there's no glory in stealing from someone who trusts him. But will an elf treat a clan as if it was his tribe, especially if it's got lots of new roundear faces? After many years, and getting to know a lot of trustworthy humans, will he, eventually, trust humanity in general?

And if an elf does something bad and gets kicked out of his tribe, how will he react to it? Will he feel immensely mortified? Will he try to join another clan? Or will he simply decide to live his life solo?

[Marauder Moe]

Hmm.. here's something I'm wondering - How would elves treat their clans? I mean, I wouldn't want an elf in my clan for worry that he'd steal all the stuff from the store or be all disloyal to the clan if his tribe wants to rip off my clan.

I don't think an elf with a tribe would ever join a clan.

EDIT: unless he and his tribe were planning some sort of large heist.

I'd assume that an elf wouldn't steal from his clan because there's no glory in stealing from someone who trusts him.

None of my characters would ever make that assumption.  I think there's plenty of glory in tricking people into trusting an elf.  It's not easy.

But will an elf treat a clan as if it was his tribe, especially if it's got lots of new roundear faces? After many years, and getting to know a lot of trustworthy humans, will he, eventually, trust humanity in general?

No.  An elf will never trust "humanity in general".  Elves only trust two types of people: tribemates and individuals who have passed enough trust tests.

The thing to remember, though, is just because you don't trust someone doesn't mean you can't work with them.  Good example: Jayne from Firefly.  No one trusted him, but they all worked well together (most of the time).

And if an elf does something bad and gets kicked out of his tribe, how will he react to it? Will he feel immensely mortified? Will he try to join another clan? Or will he simply decide to live his life solo?

Depends on the elf.  All of those reactions seem plausible.

[spawnloser]

It should take an act of Congress to make an elf do anything that would cause his/her tribemates to kick him out, seriously.  If you only trusted a handful of people in the world, would you do anything so grossly wrong (within the morality structure you all share) that they would never speak to you again?  Don't think of it like family in our modern world... because you trust and can trust other people.  An elf would assume that noone else in the world will be trusted... ever.

An elf that has a tribe already has a clan.  The only reason to join some other organization would be to rip it off.

As far as tribeless elves go, though, I think this is horribly overdone.  Seriously.  There are city tribes and desert tribes.  Talk to the appropriate clan staff and join one.  You'll learn what it is to be an elf so much better than if you just hop into some city elf pick pocket in Tuluk or 'Nak and go off to do your thing.

[spicemustflow]

As far as tribeless elves go, though, I think this is horribly overdone.  Seriously.  There are city tribes and desert tribes.  Talk to the appropriate clan staff and join one.  You'll learn what it is to be an elf so much better than if you just hop into some city elf pick pocket in Tuluk or 'Nak and go off to do your thing.

Being tribeless iss the only option for a city elf at the moment unfortunately.

[spawnloser]

I cry BS.  In fact, I KNOW BS.  There are documented, code-supported city-elf tribes.  Granted, the only ones I know of for certain are all in the Rinth, but people who play a city elf from Allanak proper... please, just don't do this.  Tuluk should have just as many tribes as Allanak, the key word being 'should.'

Additionally, you can have a tribe that isn't documented and code-supported.  Make up a tribe!  Talk to the appropriate staff about your tribe's background and then go with it.  Make it grow.  Get others to join.  Make it bigger than just you... and eventually, maybe, it'll have as much support as some other tribes that started with just one player's imagination.  (There are a couple.)

Tribeless?  Meh.  Overdone.  Elves come from tribes.  All of this whiny emo, "My tribe was wiped out/I don't know what tribe I'm from/I don't know who my parents were," crap is pathetic.  To not even come up with something that pathetic and to just say, "I have no tribe," without coming up with how a tribal is without a tribe is lazy beyond excusability for a serious roleplayer.

[FantasyWriter]

Tribeless?  Meh.  Overdone.  Elves come from tribes.  All of this whiny emo, "My tribe was wiped out/I don't know what tribe I'm from/I don't know who my parents were," crap is pathetic.  To not even come up with something that pathetic and to just say, "I have no tribe," without coming up with how a tribal is without a tribe is lazy beyond excusability for a serious roleplayer.

Well said.

[RogueGunslinger]

Your request just simply wont happen until more documentation and support are given to c-elves, or restrictions are placed on playing c-elves(karma/sponsored roles).

But I hear tell that staff are planning to give the city elves some lovin'.

[Synthesis]

I cry BS.  In fact, I KNOW BS.  There are documented, code-supported city-elf tribes.  Granted, the only ones I know of for certain are all in the Rinth, but people who play a city elf from Allanak proper... please, just don't do this.  Tuluk should have just as many tribes as Allanak, the key word being 'should.'

Additionally, you can have a tribe that isn't documented and code-supported.  Make up a tribe!  Talk to the appropriate staff about your tribe's background and then go with it.  Make it grow.  Get others to join.  Make it bigger than just you... and eventually, maybe, it'll have as much support as some other tribes that started with just one player's imagination.  (There are a couple.)

Tribeless?  Meh.  Overdone.  Elves come from tribes.  All of this whiny emo, "My tribe was wiped out/I don't know what tribe I'm from/I don't know who my parents were," crap is pathetic.  To not even come up with something that pathetic and to just say, "I have no tribe," without coming up with how a tribal is without a tribe is lazy beyond excusability for a serious roleplayer.

The only way I've ever managed to get into a coded city-elf tribe was by IC recruitment.  The way the coded tribes (at least, in the 'rinth) are, a PC who is a hard-coded member of the Sandas or other tribe has power equivalent to (probably greater than) a soldier in Allanak proper, because there is a fairly dense population of bad-ass NPCs who will open with a backstab and then fight to the death for you.  Furthermore, there will be little to no oversight of your activities, allowing you to run amok until you do something so totally over the top that the Staff have to step in and put the kibosh on you. While having homies watching your back may be realistic, it is not something that the Staff will hand out lightly to the relatively unsupervised.  Imagine if a d-elf PC had 3-4 NPCs to accompany him around the desert who backstabbed everything that attacked the PC.

As far as making your own clan is concerned:  you'd have to have at least 3-4 long-term players in the clan...in a place like the 'rinth, this is exceedingly unlikely to happen.  Over a period of two years a while back, a friend and I tried to get a d-elf clan started...I have a long series of characters who were from that tribe...and nothing ever came of it, other than padding my character list.  Developing a clan is not merely a matter of good roleplay:  it takes a certain organizational mindset, a lot of patience, Staff support, and the ability to stay alive for a long period of time.  These are not trivial things, and dismissing folks who don't bother with them in order to play a member of a severely under-represented and difficult-to-play race is juvenile.  There was a period of time that the Staff were interested in fleshing out the world with coded tribes (human and d-elf), and several tribes came about during this period...but this period is over. 

Furthermore, the elven tribal structure could easily be entirely disrupted by living amongst humans.  Look at all the historical human tribes (IRL and IC) that were shattered by assimilation into a larger civilization.  Historically, all humans were from tribes...not so anymore.  It can easily be assumed that the traditional elven extended family is no longer a viable option when Big Brother is watching.  In fact, having a tight-knit extended family would be more of a liability to your average criminal than an asset, given the nature of psionics and the fact that any templar worth his salt will know that you can't kill a tree by picking off a leaf now and then.

[Jingo]

I don't have a problem with anyone playing a broken-ear lone elf in the city. The documentation says they do exist.

But when I play city-elves I usually try to put together a small nuclear family of vnpcs just 'cause.

[spicemustflow]

I cry BS.  In fact, I KNOW BS.  There are documented, code-supported city-elf tribes. 

They are all closed.

And tribeless elves don't have to be pathetic and go around crying for their lost parents. Their personality has great potential and has many paths for development. Imho, course. Still, opening some tribes up would do wonders for celven population.

[titansfan]

The truth is...currently it takes quite a bit to get into one of the coded city-elf tribes. But in my opinion it's worth it. And if you can't do that, make your own tribe, I have done this several times...pick up a few family members (that ofcourse fit your background) and suddenly *bam* your running around causing mischief....my bad, not running, sneaking :p

[spawnloser]

If you have a problem with the city elf tribes being closed, bitch about them being closed to the appropriate staff.

Oh, and I never said you had to have a coded clan/tribe.  I said you'd better, ffs, put some thought into your tribe and KNOW as much about your virtual tribe as you would know about your coded tribe if you were in one.  The lamer than a parapalegic with a sprained ankle "my tribe was wiped out" EXCUSE is old... and not only that, it's pathetic and cheesy and cliche.

If you aren't going to play an elf as a member of a tribe, you may as well special app a human with a buffed agility, because that's what you're doing.  I despise running into city elves in game because they all act like tall, skinny humans.

[Synthesis]

If you have a problem with the city elf tribes being closed, bitch about them being closed to the appropriate staff.

Oh, and I never said you had to have a coded clan/tribe.  I said you'd better, ffs, put some thought into your tribe and KNOW as much about your virtual tribe as you would know about your coded tribe if you were in one.  The lamer than a parapalegic with a sprained ankle "my tribe was wiped out" EXCUSE is old... and not only that, it's pathetic and cheesy and cliche.

If you aren't going to play an elf as a member of a tribe, you may as well special app a human with a buffed agility, because that's what you're doing.  I despise running into city elves in game because they all act like tall, skinny humans.

[musashi]

Whether or not its for the best, to me it's always seemed like city elves are there for newbies to pick and try to play like middle earth elves until they realize that elves don't act that way in Armageddon.

I dunno, I've just never seen a well done city elf, ever.

[spawnloser]

You got a problem with what I'm saying Synth?  Maybe you could explain why you think a solitary elf is a good thing in this game.  Perhaps you could explain how a solitary elf is in line with the documentation.  I'm waiting.

[Synthesis]

City elves are scattered across the settled places of Zalanthas, and have adapted to live by their wits. True to the nature of elves they also live by their quick fingers, and are usually avoided by the honest citizens of other races. Some city elves are members of tribes camped in some run- down space within its walls; others lead shiftless lives with no ties of loyalty at all.

Are we done yet?

[musashi]

City elves are scattered across the settled places of Zalanthas, and have adapted to live by their wits. True to the nature of elves they also live by their quick fingers, and are usually avoided by the honest citizens of other races. Some city elves are members of tribes camped in some run- down space within its walls; others lead shiftless lives with no ties of loyalty at all.

Burn ...

[SmashedTregil]

It's pretty easy to get wtfpwned if an elf shows his elven nature right off the bat, just to prove that elves are different in my opinion.  Condescending behavior to humans? Forget that. You can feel superior, think superior, talk superior shit with your elven tribemates in private, behind a locked door, with scan and barrier up, but in public ? In public an elf is the most accomodating, most gentle, most trustworthy and helpful person you can ever meet. Unless he's not alone and you're in his territory ...

[Thunkkin]

City elves are scattered across the settled places of Zalanthas, and have adapted to live by their wits. True to the nature of elves they also live by their quick fingers, and are usually avoided by the honest citizens of other races. Some city elves are members of tribes camped in some run- down space within its walls; others lead shiftless lives with no ties of loyalty at all.

Are we done yet?

[SmashedTregil]

An example of one of my celf backgrounds. He was a throw away character of mine that I made during my very busy time, so his total lifetime was about ... hours? He didnt get to talk to anyone or do anything (That's what playing when busy at work does to you, most of his existence was idlying). Mentions a tribe. I think it's an okey example of how to be a tribed elf without having a coded tribe, but leaving yourself open to everything if desired.


Surviving in the labyrinth, Varia is a part of a small obscure tribe
eeking their life off the spiced out hounds of the alleys and an occasional
theft.  Just below a dozen strong, the two remaining elders of the tribe,
seem eager to convince what young they have to find another tribe to take
them in.  But it was not always so.  Varia remembers, that no more then
fifteen, eighteen years back, the tribe had a small fame as expert thieves.
So accomplished they were in this art, the theft itself was beginning to get
engrossed by a multitude of rituals, and added difficulties, just so the
tribemates could demonstrate their skill.  Soon enough, the greatest of them
have stolen something he shouldnt have stolen, from someone he shouldnt have
touched, and streams of bounties, bynners, militia, and gangs began to pick
the tribe apart like sewer rats.  The tribe have gone into hiding, keeping
it's heritage quiet, mostly struggling to survive and outwait the heat.
Regardless of all Varia's elders say, about persuing a different tribe, or
keeping quiet and low profile, Varia's main and singular hope and dream is
return the glory that his name once possessed.