Anyone else hate sandstorms...

[Cerelum]

Prompt
l
You can't see a thing; sand swirls about you!

Prompt
time
It is late morning on Terrin, the 79th day of the Ascending Sun,
In the Year of Desert's Defiance, year 47 of the 21st Age.

Prompt
The wind changes direction.
The wind slows down a little.

Prompt
The winds pick up without warning, triggering a whirling sandstorm.

Prompt
l
You can't see a thing; sand swirls about you!

Prompt
weather
It is a hot day.
A tremendous sandstorm whips stinging dust from the west across the land.
Jihae, the red moon, is high in the sky.

Prompt
The howling winds decrease slightly and the storm subsides.

Prompt
weather
It is a hot day.
A tremendous sandstorm whips stinging dust from the west across the land.
Jihae, the red moon, is high in the sky.

Promptl
You can't see a thing; sand swirls about you!

Prompt
ooc Are you kidding me?
You say, out of character:
     "Are you kidding me?"

[Dar]

There are some areas in Zalanthas where some amount of sand exists. On occasion it piles up and we fail to detect it. The winds our weather control system sends to properly recycle the air flow tend to pick that sand up and whirl it about a little. Which causes an occasional sandstorm effect, sorry for inconvenience. Please enjoy the rest of our sand free world.

[Lizzie]

I think the argument isn't that we -have- sandstorms, or even that we have them frequently in certain areas. I think the OP is protesting that the game echo -clearly- indicates that the sandstorm has just subsided - and yet when he types 'weather' it shows that the sandstorm is just as nasty as it was a second ago.

I've experienced this too and it IS ridiculous. If the game echo is telling me that the storm has just subsided, then give me at least 45 seconds to do SOMETHING before it picks back up again. Being stuck in a sandstorm, unable to quit out of the game because you're not a ranger with ranger-quit, for 45 minutes in a row, is not playable. You might as well make everything outside the gates of the nearest safe-area off limits to anyone other than rangers - and even a ranger will get lost in certain storms, so that isn't even foolproof.

It's the change in echo, with zero change in condition, that is the biggest issue. If the game is TELLING me that the storm just went away, then the storm should go away. At least long enough for me to move to the next room without getting lost.

[Tisiphone]

I think the OP's just griping. A perfectly good use of this board.

I still think the other posts have their own merit, though. Let's talk about weather?

I'm on the fence. On the one hand, I like Arm's weather; it really drives home the point about the harsh environment. I don't want sandstorms to just be ignored, the way they pretty much are now when they're not up to the, "You idiot, why are you walking around now, you can't even see past your eyelashes," level. However, blinding sandstorms ALL THE TIME puts a real strain on playability.

Perhaps we could have a system with more serious, coded gradations between the two states of perfectly clear and absolutely blinding, with the latter happening somewhat less often (replaced by really really really harsh, but still operable)? We could even make it as simple as saying that walking through a sandstorm puts a greater strain on your stam than walking through clear weather. Maybe there should be a point where you can see the room you're in, but not any of the adjacent rooms.

Thoughts? I'm hesitant to ask for this to be implemented, because I don't know how broadly and negatively or positively it might affect game balance between guilds and activities. I don't want to penalize solo rangers (any more than making sure they know that being a solo ranger is, frankly, not a good way to survive unless you KNOW the game world), and I don't want to make cities unplayable either.

For my part, I see on the one hand that it might make archery more powerful and more usable by allowing attempted shots or different gradations in penalties for a greater share of the time. It might also make traveling a good bit more dangerous.

[SMuz]

I'd like to see sandstorms being less common and less harsher (especially within the city) BUT when there is a sandstorm, you'll get lost in it. Like a non-ranger char would type "north" and have a 10% chance of ending up going west.

I really hate sandstorms when I want to quit urgently or when I have only half an hour on the game. It's also not cool that a person who's memorized the map could just ignore the sandstorm completely sometimes.

[Jingo]

No sandstorms in cities. No sandstorms in cities.No sandstorms in cities. No sandstorms in cities. No sandstorms in cities. No sandstorms in cities. No sandstorms in cities. No sandstorms in cities. No sandstorms in cities. No sandstorms in cities.No sandstorms in cities. No sandstorms in cities.No sandstorms in cities. No sandstorms in cities.No sandstorms in cities. No sandstorms in cities.No sandstorms in cities. No sandstorms in cities.No sandstorms in cities. No sandstorms in cities.No sandstorms in cities. No sandstorms in cities.No sandstorms in cities. No sandstorms in cities. No sandstorms in cities. No sandstorms in cities. No sandstorms in cities. No sandstorms in cities. No sandstorms in cities. No sandstorms in cities.No sandstorms in cities. No sandstorms in cities. No sandstorms in cities. No sandstorms in cities.No sandstorms in cities. No sandstorms in cities.No sandstorms in cities. No sandstorms in cities.No sandstorms in cities. No sandstorms in cities. No sandstorms in cities. No sandstorms in cities.No sandstorms in cities. No sandstorms in cities.No sandstorms in cities. No sandstorms in cities. No sandstorms in cities. No sandstorms in cities.No sandstorms in cities. No sandstorms in cities. No sandstorms in cities. No sandstorms in cities.No sandstorms in cities. No sandstorms in cities.No sandstorms in cities. No sandstorms in cities. No sandstorms in cities. No sandstorms in cities.No sandstorms in cities. No sandstorms in cities.No sandstorms in cities. No sandstorms in cities.No sandstorms in cities. No sandstorms in cities. No sandstorms in cities. No sandstorms in cities. No sandstorms in cities.

Even at night.

[Sokotra]

From what I understand, cities are (or should be) slightly protected from sandstorms.. but not all that much.  The cities aren't high-tech biodomes.  The walls might lessen the effects a little, but you should still have sandstorms in the cities.

[Cerelum]

Trust me, I get that sandstorms are something the game has, and I don't hate them indifferently, I just think that they do need to go away.  Yes there are sandstorms where you can't see your hand in front of your face, but not every day, all day.

Just have it follow the echos that say it went away and it probably would be cool.

JaRoD

[drunkendwarf]

I started a thread on this a couple years ago.

I think there needs to be -some- way to deal with sandstorms, regardless of what guild you are. Even if the only thing you can do as a non-ranger is quit out and play later. I'm all for as harsh as they are - but it's the shits when you have to leave in 30 minutes and just sit there watching the clock tick down as you're stuck in a sandstorm and can't do shit. I've lost a character because I had to just cut link and go to work, and I got caught in the storm a full hour and a hour before I needed to be at work. Granted, durations have been cut quite a bit since then, severity of storms has even been cut down quite a bit. But it still severely cuts down on playability when you're stuck in one with a time limit. Everyone should have some OOC way of quitting out of the game, or some other way to deal with a sandstorm, when the need arises.

How hard would it be, code wise, to allow anyone to quit out in the middle of a sandstorm?

[a strange shadow]

I'd like to see a camp command that takes 5 minutes.

Rangers can still insta-quit.

[Rhyden]

I think the real question is:

Why are there not more weathered storm rangers and dirty dune traders to guide common folk across the perilous desert so that we can avoid those

You say, out of character:
     "Are you kidding me?"

sort of situations.

[spicemustflow]

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Even at night.

I agree completely. But, speaking of open desert, I'd like even more storms and they should rend the flesh from the traveler's bones unless he's properly equipped. And no camp making in five minute for city dwellers. Only ones who, by logic, know how to make a camp (regardless of class) are tribals delfs, and people who've received special training in game. Make it a skill that can be learned. Just like it is actually. It would be very jarring if a rinthi elf or a silky aide could camp in the relative safety in the middle of the Red Desert.

[X-D]

and even a ranger will get lost in certain storms,

Untrue. Rangers are immune to anything that would cause any other class to get lost code wise. No matter what the move echo says,they do not get lost, the player might, but that is not the same thing.

As to this....

rend the flesh from the traveler's bones

Um...No. In order for large enough chunks of sand and stone to be flying at the speed that would "rend flesh from bones" You would be moving through the air at the same speed as the sand, so sand rending your flesh would be the least of your worries.

[Pantoufle]

I'd like to see a camp command that takes 5 minutes.

Rangers can still insta-quit.

Well, to be fair the act of quitting is an OOC act.  I don't like any coded function which prevents people from returning to the real world. 

For the sake of argument, should we then implement a code which forces city based guilds to "tuck themselves in" or "find a vacant cot in the Gaj dormitory" before logging out?

(Or did you mean a camp command for non-rangers so that they're not forced to drop link if something requires them to leave in a hurry?  That I'd like to see too.)

[a strange shadow]

(Or did you mean a camp command for non-rangers so that they're not forced to drop link if something requires them to leave in a hurry?  That I'd like to see too.)

Exactly what I meant.

[fourTwenty]

I think the real question is:

Why are there not more weathered storm rangers and dirty dune traders to guide common folk across the perilous desert so that we can avoid those

You say, out of character:
     "Are you kidding me?"

sort of situations.

TAKE. A. RANGER.

Seriously, this kind of shit is your own fault. I've never seen it go from clear to unnavigable save for a certain area that's coded different (but even then after a few minutes it goes right back to where it was.). If you're leaving the city when it's not clear or staying out as the weather starts to get worse then it's your own damn fault. I never leave the city if I can't see more than two rooms away, and if I can only see two rooms away and the wind starts to pick up I take my ass home immediately.

Moral of the story: Keep your non-ranger ass in the city if the weather's not clear or TAKE. A. RANGER.

Edit to add: Yall keep saying that quitting is an OOC thing being affected by IG conditions. But your in that situation in the first place because you ignored IG conditions to start with. Careful planning is the most important part of any desert trip and most people ignore it.

[staggerlee]

I don't think quitting out is a particularly elegant solution to hostile ic circumstances.  As Fourtwenty and others have hinted at.
In fact... it's pretty much the opposite of the kind of behaviour that's expected.

[Riev]

Careful planning is the most important part of any desert trip and most people ignore it.

Usually man, I think you tend to go overboard with the arguments, but this is SPOT fucking ON. There are some rooms where I've gone from "The air is silent" to "Jesus christ why did you even move into here?" and its taken me 20 minutes to find a way out. My dumb ass didn't check the weather. If you leave the city, and there is already a horrible sandstorm, don't go out. If you have work in half an hour, don't leave the city. If you have -any- inkling that you may have to quit out soon, don't leave the city.

Emergencies happen. Some people on the GDB hate having to quit out in quit safe rooms, other think it adds to the reality. We've said before that most people don't use the GDB, so if you're going to make an argument, I say make it clear and concise. Is it an OOC thing to quit? List out the reasons why, and give examples. Counter points before they come up. Make it a discussion, not a QQ fest.

[Qzzrbl]

I think the real question is:

Why are there not more weathered storm rangers and dirty dune traders to guide common folk across the perilous desert so that we can avoid those

You say, out of character:
     "Are you kidding me?"

sort of situations.

TAKE. A. RANGER.

Seriously, this kind of shit is your own fault. I've never seen it go from clear to unnavigable save for a certain area that's coded different (but even then after a few minutes it goes right back to where it was.). If you're leaving the city when it's not clear or staying out as the weather starts to get worse then it's your own damn fault. I never leave the city if I can't see more than two rooms away, and if I can only see two rooms away and the wind starts to pick up I take my ass home immediately.

Moral of the story: Keep your non-ranger ass in the city if the weather's not clear or TAKE. A. RANGER.

Edit to add: Yall keep saying that quitting is an OOC thing being affected by IG conditions. But your in that situation in the first place because you ignored IG conditions to start with. Careful planning is the most important part of any desert trip and most people ignore it.

<3

[Tisiphone]

Right now, if you leave because of a sandstorm, you go linkdead and you stand there. You already have much better chance of surviving linkdead than you "should", since the timer for hunger and thirst turn off.

If you come back to your terminal with a dead character, your PC wandered of into the sandstorm and DIED IN A SANDSTORM, which is completely possible.

Do I agree it should happen this way in a game? I dunno. But it being inconvenient isn't a -great- argument.

[evil_erdlu]

Last time I was stuck outside, I waited for three RL hours, then made my way to another spot where I can quit.

Did that piss me off? Yes it did. Did I have a chance to know that there would be a storm? Nope.. I started travelling in clear weather, moved to another area with no storm, when I got back, the clear weather in the first area was a 'tremendous' storm... For three RL hours. Being a newbie I didn't know any quitsafe locations in the second area. I was stuck about 10 leagues away from my goal for hours.

But right now my character has a Bio entry about how the f*ck he managed to get his a** to Location X and I have fun memories about it. So.. yes, storms are greatly disturbing but we can't control everything. Sometimes the story requires a stupid death. Sometimes the story requires a dwarf swearing he will *beep* *beep* *beep* every whiran and elkran he ever meets.

I feel lowering the storm's power is the same as weakening the large bugs around Allanak. Without the fear of meeting one, outdoors travel would be less fun.

[Qzzrbl]

Or people could just start hiring desert guides.

Because really, that's not a terribly profitable profession anymore these days.

[Qzzrbl]

I'm also in favor of more Gith raiding major roads and generic NPC highwaymen, and dangerous wildlife being more frequent.

I've made it from Red Storm to Tuluk without seeing so much as a scrab or carru, and I was actively looking for them.

Traveling is too safe, IMHO.

Wanna hire the Byn for an escort?

What's really the point?

Just a waste of coin.

[Riev]

Traveling is too safe, IMHO.

Wanna hire the Byn for an escort?

What's really the point?

Just a waste of coin.

This. A thousand times, this. I'm sure that having badass NPCs on the road feels rather safe, but it'd give the Byn a reason to do the escorts they're so used to doing, not to mention giving city-state militias shit to do.

Oh no! A family of scrabs has taken over the North Road? Allanak, ATTACK.

[LittleLostThief]

Complaining about sandstorms aside, to answer a question of the OP...

Imagine that sandstorms exist on a 0 - 1000 scale.  I'm just making up the numbers.

0 - 100 is clear.
101 - 250 = Gritty...
So on and so forth.

When you get the message that the sandstorm lessons some, you are seeing a negative number applied to the force of the sandstorm.  It is effectively jumping a random number of notches down, although this jump might not be enough to actually change the sandstorm message you get with the "weather" command.  The sandstorm IS lessened, just not enough to make a significant difference to the "classification" of the storm.  Yet.