Unrealistic Rp that results in pc death/storage.

[Elfmolester]

Removed by poster.

[Caitrin]

Yes, this thread needs to be locked/edited/deleted or whatever.

-I- did log, and I will send my unedited log to the imms on your behalf, Elfmolester.

[Elfmolester]

Good. I will go back and edit out my previous posts.

[Morfeus]

Please, could you be that kind and stop discussing IC information on GDB? I appreciate Elfmolester removed some of his posts. Could Caitrin do same? I am seriously not interested to learn details of this in OOC way and I am somewhat annoyed I already learned that much, thinking this thread is something worth to read.

EDITed to add: Thank you.

[Marauder Moe]

Well then, that's a little better I guess.  It's a real shame when IC conflicts become OOC ones, though.

One point I'd like to add, however... Elfmolester, you said it reeks of H&S to rob someone naked.  While that may be true in some circumstances, I think it reeks of MUSH to assume that your character concept is sacred and other players aren't allowed to "ruin" it.

You've plenty right to be upset, but I don't think any rules were broken.  Hope you have a better time in Allanak?   :wink:

[LoD]

There have been a few times when the concept I devised was completely blown apart by what I perceived to be OOC influences in the game.  And while I was frustrated that I needed to shift gears, it ended up being an extremely rewarding experience that meant more to me than had the issues never surfaced in the first place.

There is something about fighting the odds, scrabbling to survive, and pushing your limits that provides for an enjoyable and liberating experience.  When you have nothing to lose, your character can make decisions and select courses of action that might never have occurred to them.  Your perceptions change when you are desperate, and perhaps your character grows in a new direction as a result.  That's the beauty of the game.  Nothing is scripted.  Nothing is staged, static, or predetermined.

I understand being frustrated at losing everything, and I agree that muggers didn't need to go to such extremes.  However, the game is going to be riddled with adversity and opposition, whether it be in the form of a thief stealing your personal belongings, or a raider stealing your life, someone is going to make your life rough.  While your character's reactions will differ based on the circumstances, you (the player) will probably react the same -- and rather than become discouraged and abandon the role because it doesn't fit within the parameters you've created well before the character began, I'd recommend toughing it out.

You may just be surprised at the outcome, and at yourself.

-LoD

[Gimfalisette]

Personally, I find that "bad stuff happening to my character" is one of the best tools for both character development AND plot development. I have had bad stuff done to me by other PCs, and I've done bad stuff to other PCs. My characters are regularly victimized in one way or the other...I get stolen from, people start nasty rumors about me, people try to use me, I've been attacked...on and on. In the vast majority of cases, "bad stuff" does not equal the loss of the character, IF you persevere through it and adapt.

It's really just about changing your perspective from "winning the game" to "living a character's life." If you really lived in Zalanthas, and knew you only had one life, would you throw it away so easily just because you got robbed? I know my characters wouldn't. For the most part, they'd do ANYTHING to survive. And, in fact, when faced with death, that's what my characters have done in the past, no matter how humiliating or how much it would set them back.

[Agent_137]

I can think of one simple, easy, way to come back. Plenty of wealthy people who can spare the risk of losing a cloak, a skin of water, and a sack of flour if they get a loyal pair of hands in return.

there's a lot that a simple pair of hands, a pair of ears, and a mouth can do. No coded skills required.

Sifting, for example, has the distinct advantage over salt grebbing, 'sid mining, and clay digging in that there's often a PC overseeing the workers.

If you want an easy life filled with a well RP'd character's progression through a script you have laid out, go play a MUSH.

If you want a harsh virtual reality inwhich to improvise . . . then you're in the right place.

[Dakkon Black]

Yeah dood, I can't believe you've survived in arm this long if that cheeses you off.

Sometimes when I start chars I strip them of everything and junk all the coin just for fun. The underdog is a kickass role if you want it to be.

[bloodfromstone]

I have to agree with the majority here. It's not necessarily ridiculous for someone to strip you naked. People do it in RL all the time. For one thing, it prevents the person from running instantly to get help, because they instinctively want to hide their nudity. If you made enemies, they did it to destroy you, and it worked. If it was just some mugger, maybe he needed the extra 5 coins to feed his spice habit.
I think all too often conflict is removed from the game. People are too quick to kill a PC to prevent conflict. People are too willing to give up and store due to conflict that should be really interesting. If someone strips you naked and leaves you alive, you've just received the ticket to some of the most interesting and active roleplaying you can do, as it all comes down to trying to stay alive.
Learn to roll with the punches. You will enjoy the game a lot more. I promise you there will be times when something genuinely really lame and OOC happens to your character, far worse than losing your equipment, and, unfortunately, the staff is not around 100% of the time to police everything. Other players will ruin your day sometimes, and if you want to keep playing your PC, you have to learn to make the most of it.
Here is an example from my personal experience. One of my very early characters here was a young mercenary girl that I created with the OOC intentions of joining the T'Zai Byn and learning the game. Well, instead, an Atrium Host whisked her off to the Atrium to learn to be an aide. Did cut into my original intentions for the character? Hell yes. Did I originally feel put-upon because another player essentially decided my character's profession for me? Certainly. Was playing a rough, tough, bar-fighting, dirty-mouthed mercenary girl in the Atrium and eventually Borsail one of the most fun experiences of my Armageddon career? You bet.

[James de Monet]

I have been in your exact same shoes.

Don't you mean feet?   :lol:

Seriously, though.  Guy molesting an elf, they didn't kill you.  They could have.  I think that right there speaks to IC motive behind their actions (or an OOC desire not to twink-kill, but either way...)  Sure, it's easier to feel like you're doing "well" in the game if your char is successful or rich or powerful, but that isn't what it's about.  It's about playing a role, even if that role is a disease-ridden, rinthi prostitute with one eye, if you play her dejection and absolutely base life well, you're still going to be adding something to the game.  Of course, that being said, it's a game and it's supposed to be fun.  If you're not enjoying your char, then, by all means, store when it's convenient and when it won't mess up plot lines.  You don't have to be a martyr and play a role you hate for other people's ideas of what the ideal Armer would do.

[Janna]

IC Actions = IC consequences. All that I have to say on it without going into details.

[alger]

I'm envious really.  Last time someone unknown caught me sleeping they killed me.

[Rindan]

1)  Getting stripped naked is not bad RP 99% of the time.  If you were out too cold to do anything about it, and someone either wanted to make your life miserable or simply make a few 'sid, stripping someone butt naked is a-okay.  This is Zalanthas, the 5 'sid pair of pants you are wearing is, well, 5 'sid.  Getting knocked out and waking up naked shouldn't be horribly surprising.  The only time I find it lame is if the person was just sleeping and realistically would have noticed you tearing off their pants and woken up (and even then, I think they have fixed this).

2)  To quote to documentation, "complaints of unfairness on the part of other players will not be given an audience. If you think another character was mean to you, you're most likely right."  Being a dick to people is not wrong in this game.  You don't need to cut people slack.  If someone decides to terrorize you, it doesn't mean that in real life they would like to beat  you with a baseball bat.  It likely means that their character is a dick and gets off on picking on people.  I have played many such characters.  Abusing someone isn't done because I hate YOU (the guy behind the PC).  I abuse people because my character is a complete asshole and really likes making other people suffer.  If the other guy behind the PC takes this personally, well, that is sad.

3)  It isn't the end of the world.  Seriously.  You can survive and even thrive.  Whatever shit you had on you can be regained.  If anything, it could push you into doing something interesting.  About to starve to death?  You might very well go take out a loan from someone you are not sure you can pay back.  You might join an organization you might otherwise not join.  The point of the game is not to amass a pile of shit and to sit on it.  If you are playing to collect objects, well, you are playing the wrong game.

4)  Rule #1 to living a long time is to NEVER GIVE UP.  I can't count the number of times I SWORE up and down that my character was dead but decided to hell with it, I would struggle forward.  90% of the time I made.  Dying of starvation in a city is pretty hard.  Something is bound to happen, especially if you try to make it happen.  If anything, it is a little too hard to die in a city.  One of the things I do with my new born 'rinthers is to tattoo myself up, maybe buy a very cheap weapon or trinket for decoration, then promptly dump the rest of my money.  You can live.  You might get a little desperate and hungry at times, but it can be done.  Desperation can be damn fun as it is one of the few times where you MUST do something or suffer the consequences.  When you over come such desperation and come out on top, you will get a nice and warm fuzzy spot in your got.

My advice?  Take a step back and stop being pissed off.  What happened was likely mean, assholish, and completely and a legitimate thing for an ass hole or desperate Zalanthian to do.  Stop being pissed off at the guys behind some other PC playing their characters.  Dust yourself off, and struggle forward.  If you find yourself pissed off at other people while playing this game, you are most likely playing this game with a very wrong mindset.

[Zharal]

This has been an interesting thread I guess..  If not slightly amusing.  On many occasions I have found myself in a position of error or such to find myself asleep and to wake with nadda.  But I have to say I didn't rant and rave about it in such a manor. (Almost child like in some instances.) The art of survival in such positions is a skill in its own right and one that is not so hard to figure out.  So what if you lost everything, theres lots of fun in building your character back up and possibly getting revenge latter.  But to just say its not fair and kill yourself off or shelf your character just seems weak to me.  Get a little fire in ya and work it out.. The rewards in the long run is way more satisfying then just quitting to start again.

[Morfeus]

Retiring for getting in troubles or failing in some long-planned plot is IMHO not the best reason. If nothing else, you miss all fun caused by this. Without going in IC details, I have a strong feeling this is exactly the case.

I know such situation could be hard for the player at first. But really, troubles are blood of the Armageddon.

[HoD]

Up until today, I would have agreed with the poster. I would have tossed a PC aside if it wasn't what I expected or if I wasn't getting any enjoyment out of it.

Saying that. The strangest things happen when your at the bottom of the rocks.

[FiveDisgruntledMonkeysWit]

Look at the logs Ghost posted in the Player Submissions page. What would've happened in Haadith's player decided to suicide or store just because he lost everything? Imagine all the great RP that would've been lost.

[Mezzy]

I just got mugged for the first time, I saw a guy, walked past, thought "Hmm, I could mug that guy..." walked back, -THWAP- Mugger gets mugged before mugger has a change to mug the mug-ee.  Mug-ee turns around mug and mugs mugger, mugger wakes up to find himself mugged.

Oddly though, all he took was my pack and my weapons, nothing else, still had all my clothes, except he took my hood too, now I'm not in the hood.  Kinda sucked.  I suppose it was pretty funny though.

[Maso]

Stuff about mugging.

Roflcopter.

[Mezzy]

It's a funny word.  Just say "mug" about 100 times.  Wait five seconds, then say it once.
It won't even sound like a word anymore.

[Maso]

It's a funny word.  Just say "mug" about 100 times.  Wait five seconds, then say it once.
It won't even sound like a word anymore.

I do that with the word 'sponge'. It's weird.  :shock:

[Folker]

One of the most exciting, impressive, incredible and wonderful incidents and plot twists happened to my characters AFTER they got into some 'reaaaall' trouble. To be honest, all in all, surviving through events like that gives your character more wealth then the actual items and coin. Because now, your character is gifted with new enemies, new experience, new story, and new goal ... be it revenge, or survival.

Saying that, I think 90% of all my characters who got to position of stability are aware of a possibility of complete economical loss and have back ups, unless they have some kind of character traits that'd prevent that.

[John]

I just love how people seem to think that stealing from someone means they have to strip them completely of everything so that they no longer have anything to use to survive even. Unless you want to be a beggar it's a death sentence....if you're going to steal from someone, at least steal from them realistically and in such a way that they can recover from it to be stolen from again.

Sorry, but I'm not going to do this unless its realistic to do so for my character. However just as hunters shouldn't overhunt an area, neither should a thief. But if circumstance arises that I do need to steal from you in such a way as to make it nigh on impossible to recover, then I'm going to do it. Them's the breaks.

That's not enjoyable to be struggling to come back from unable to survive to a point where I can barely survive again.

Well sorry to hear that, but that's the game. I've had plenty of fun doing it as well.

Stripping someone completely naked smacks of H&S gaming.

Depending on the area you were in and the circumstance involved (which being unconscious you're not privy to), this is patently not true.

A few characters back my dude was naked having to go bar to bar and eat scraps off the tables. Now that was Zalanthas.

Exactly! It is so much fun to take a character who had a middle-class merchant upbringing and have them suddenly become buck-naked without a 'sid to their name. How far are they willing to go just to eat for the next meal? Will they kill? Will they scavenge from the dead? Will they run to a Templar or noble and beg for help? It will change your character forever going through such a circumstance.

I've always wanted to have a character get stripped naked with nothing left in the bank.  Someday I plan to make a new PC, dump all my starting coins and gear, and see if I can pull off a recovery.

Heh, now that sounds like something I might want to try (its easy to explain in your history "so and so was mugged and robbed blind of everything when he was in X").

[ale six]

Leaving somebody alive, even naked and penniless, is always a preferrable option to killing them in my book. I guess Armageddon has two types of violence and PvP... there's a "random" element, which might include muggings, thefts, desert raidings, etc, and a "premeditated" element, which would be stuff like assassinations, revenge murders, stuff specifically designed to cripple a person or group. While I think it's perfectly great to kill someone if you have a reason to kill that specific person (aka premeditated violence), it's not so great to just kill people at random. Non-permanent violence in those cases would be much nicer.

Hopefully the camp that says you can't raid or mug somebody and leave them alive without them destroying your anonymity will be more satisfied with the code in Arm2.