A reminder when it comes to writing PC descriptions

[Anon Kank]

Don't be subjective. It is much more interesting to read a detailed description of a beautiful face, than to read "this is a beautiful woman". Let the reader make the judgements -- write it in a way that makes people think "she must be beautiful" or "he must look like a mean bastard" rather than writing the subjective remark itself.

Do not describe how your character moves or speaks, since the viewer may be looking at them while they are asleep or knocked out, and wouldn't know how they customarily move or speak. Similarly, don't have your character performing actions in the description, such as nodding or whistling, unless it's an action they perform constantly, even when asleep. Don't force actions on the viewer as in 'You wonder what she is doing here' or 'You blink and look away, cowed by the intensity of his eyes.'

I have seen a disturbing rise in descriptions doing exactly the opposite of this.  Please, please keep this in mind when you are writing a character description.  It seems that some people are trying to get around it by using more obscure words when it comes to subjective adjectives as well.  Also, I was wondering if the staff is purposefully being more lenient by allowing these things.

[Xygax]

I definitely think to some degree we have been allowing a bit more range with regard to verbiage, both in main descs and in short descriptions, but overall I think the change has been for the better.  I'm a big fan of variety, and while I myself prefer a more "technical" description, such as what you quote from the character creation documents, a little more freedom in PC descriptions isn't necessarily a bad thing.

For example, suggesting in your main description that "she has alluring blue eyes" (I just made this up, I think, I don't know if anyone has actually done this), crosses this line of subjectivity, but I don't think I would necessarily reject or edit an application containing the line.  Often, for new players, it takes a little while to acclimate to the objective writing style we're aiming for, and they often improve simply by looking at other players and NPCs, and reading threads like this one.  Also, it is often possible to draw objectively valid conclusions about a subjective term like "alluring" (though this may be a bad example), and the freedom to use a term like that may yield greater freedom and better overall descriptions, especially from new players.

A little poetry in a description isn't necessarily a crime -- though, as I said before, my own preference is certainly for factual, objective descriptions.  Also, it is easy to cross the line from flowery prose to jarringly subjective verse, so the question is a bit more nuanced than just "do" or "don't" use subjective terms.

-- X

[amoeba]

I've seen it a bit in the south.  It does not appear to be from newbies, but rather at least in one glaring case of thesaurus overkill, someone trying to pick the more outragous sdesc possible.  The word is quite obscure and easily violates this line, once you look up what the damned thing means.  

I also agree with a little freedom and variety, but when something is way over the top, of the "omg, how did they let that get through" variety,  I think it is distracting.

[Xygax]

If someone seems to be way over the line, typo them.

-- X

[spawnloser]

Yeah, I gotta agree.  I recently saw an sdesc where someone brought out some five syllable word for the sdesc that basically meant "very attractive or sexually appealling."  In the mdesc, nothing specifically explained this word, which would require 99% of the playerbase to go look it up...100% of non-native English speakers.  I thought this was over the top.

Okay, I will admit there are certain principles of perception that provide some universal standards to beauty, but people's preferences do differ.  I am a whole-hearted supporter of the 'describe the feature not how to think about the feature' person.  Instead of attractive/gorgeous/handsome/pretty/sexy/etc describe HOW someone would come to that thought.  For example, parts that should be perky could be described as such and parts that should be firm can be described in that manner as well.

[The7DeadlyVenomz]

Man, I had to look it up. Me and the wife were chuckling about that word for a good ten minutes. I was like, "Come here, baby, come here. What the fuck does ... how the hell do you say this word?"

Still, that said, I know it's a weird word but it is a word that does exist. I really doubt it is going to hurt anyone to learn a new word. I wouldn't have done it, but let's not kill the player's joy for his/her strapping new, sexy-socks character.

[Xygax]

Just to expand on this, I have no problems at all with words that require the occasional dictionary reference.  I don't mind expanding my vocabulary.  The real issue here I hope is that the word(s) in question shouldn't force an interpretation of attractiveness, appeal, like, dislike, good or evil, or any sort of activity on the viewer.

-- X

[Morfeus]

English is not my first language. Often, I have to look some word up. I usually don't mind. Only thing which bothers me on "strange" words in sdesc is when I look in a dictionary, the word has five different meanings and mdesc of the said person does not give me a slightest clue which one it should be. That and sdesc like "the most beautiful woman".

[jcarter]

I've seen a number of descs that were written pretentiously. When you write, remember that you're writing to other players with average to above average reading and writing skills. In general, if I have to look a word up, I'm going to assume you're using it for the sake of being pompous.

[Anonymous]

I've seen a number of descs that were written pretentiously. When you write, remember that you're writing to other players with average to above average reading and writing skills. In general, if I have to look a word up, I'm going to assume you're using it for the sake of being pompous.

The word you are looking for is either "fustian" or, my personal favorite, sesquipedalian.

fustian

n 1: pompous or pretentious talk or writing [syn: bombast, rant, claptrap, blah] 2: a strong cotton and linen fabric with a slight nap


sesquipedalian

adj 1: given to the overuse of long words; "sesquipedalian orators"; "this sesquipedalian way of saying one has no money" 2: (of words) long and ponderous; having many syllables; "sesquipedalian technical terms" [syn: polysyllabic] n : a very long word (a foot and a half long) [syn: sesquipedalia]

[gfair]

Question Xygax - in the example of the PC with alluring eyes: does the PC have alluring eyes or not? Just because the PC says so, do we have to believe it?

I ask because when I'd see a desc like this, I'd reject all such subjective interpretations of a person's own character on the basis that it doesn't let me decide. Why should they be alluring to all people and races? That's my take on it.

[Maybe42or54]

I personally think they are fine. If they have alluring, and they make it alluring in the Desc (without using the word alluring in the desc). They just shortened it so they could fit more meaning into one word.

[Anarchy]

I'd view alluring as the most noticeable feature on a face, your drawn too it over all other facial features, you dont need to find it attractive.

[Kalden]

This reminds me of the book I'm reading right now, Steppenwolf by Herman Hesse. The main character is described as follows:

Code Select Expand

I did not get a good look at him until we were all three on our way up to the top floor. Though not very big, he had the bearing of a big man...Above all, his face pleased me from the first in spite of the foreign air it had. It was a rather original face nd perhaps a sad one, but alert, thoughtful, strongy marked and highly intellectual....He gave at the very first glance the impression of a significant, an uncommon, and unusually gifted man. His face was intellectual, and the abnormally delicate and mobile play of his features reflected a soul of extremely emotional and unusually delicate sensibility.

Herman Hesse won a Nobel Prize for Literature. Granted, I'm not saying this could work in Armageddon, but I'd be careful about saying detailed technical descriptions are always better, as Xygax was saying.

With that said, I do try to describe all the features of my characters as technically as possible.

Later...

[Jherlen]

The difference is that while you can write a story where you convey one character's perceptions of another character to the readers, you can't write a description that tells other characters how they perceive you. Let them be the judge of what they think.

[John]

I've seen a number of descs that were written pretentiously. When you write, remember that you're writing to other players with average to above average reading and writing skills. In general, if I have to look a word up, I'm going to assume you're using it for the sake of being pompous.

Oh I agree. All of those flaxen-haired people are just so pompous.

[Maybe42or54]

I've never had problems with people using "handsome," "beautiful," or things like "ugly," in their desc. It has always conveyed more to me than just their looks.

If they tell me their Pc is a beautiful man, then that sends off signals that he is feminine, takes care of himself(as in shave fingernails, pluck eyebrows/nosehairs/etc), maybe smaller in stature, longer hair that is well taken care of.

Their ugly? Well then, they may have visible rashes, diseases, or visibly broken bones. Maybe they don't take care of themselves, sweat stains everywhere, holes in their clothing, something is wrong with their teeth, maybe they are week also.

If they use these words, but don't go into detail in their desc as to -why- then that is twinkish.

I wouldn't complain if I saw a handsome man without the word (or any like-meaning word) in the Main Description.

Using the word handsome is easier to tell people about than the blue eyed man that raided me.

[Anonymous]

There's a woman here, whose ass is the tastiest ass you've ever seen. She's got boobs you really want to fondle, and lips you really want to lick. Her eyes are the most beautiful eyes you've ever seen, and she's got long legs that remind you of the girl you liked when you were a kid. Her hair is long and shiny and it reminds you of obsidian coins.

Do you see why this sucks?

Really?

[Maybe42or54]

That isn't an sdesc backed up with a Main Description telling me why that is so, it is rather extreme, it wouldn't be accepted, I don't deal in extremes of this nature. Sorry.

[jcarter]

I've seen a number of descs that were written pretentiously. When you write, remember that you're writing to other players with average to above average reading and writing skills. In general, if I have to look a word up, I'm going to assume you're using it for the sake of being pompous.

Oh I agree. All of those flaxen-haired people are just so pompous.

In general, if I have to look a word up, I'm going to assume you're using it for the sake of being pompous.

In general, if I have to look a word up

In general

In general

In general

In general

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general

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Anything else you would like to contribute to the thread, John?

[Xygax]

Question Xygax - in the example of the PC with alluring eyes: does the PC have alluring eyes or not? Just because the PC says so, do we have to believe it?

No, you don't.

-- X

[John]

I've seen a number of descs that were written pretentiously. When you write, remember that you're writing to other players with average to above average reading and writing skills. In general, if I have to look a word up, I'm going to assume you're using it for the sake of being pompous.

Oh I agree. All of those flaxen-haired people are just so pompous.

In general, if I have to look a word up, I'm going to assume you're using it for the sake of being pompous.

In general, if I have to look a word up

In general

In general

In general

In general

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general

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Anything else you would like to contribute to the thread, John?

:lol: Sorry. "In general all those flaxen haired people are so pompous."

Oh, and I forgot about all them tawny people being, "in general", pompous as well.

[Kalden]

Those words are only pompous and incomprehensible to those have a vocabularly incommensurate with the requirements of the game they are playing, John.

[Delirium]

Call me crazy, but I think John was, y'know... joking.

As to the original post in this thread - agreed.  I like simple descriptions that paint a clear picture without being subjective.  Anything over 10 lines gets really hard to read all the way through.  Avoid 'appears to be' or 'seems like' and just tell it like it is.  Poetic writing is fine, you can do that while remaining non-subjective, though too much fluff starts to obfuscate things.

couldn't resist

[bloodfromstone]

Personally, I don't like long, over complex words in descs. I feel I have a pretty decent vocabulary, and I don't mind looking things up... It's just bad writing. It's a pretty standard rule of writing to simplify. Don't use 10 words when 3 will say the same thing. The same goes for syllables. Of course, people are free to do what they will, but I find it a bit silly and inconsiderate. But, hey, to each their own.