How to play Dwarves?

[wizturbo]

A focus can be bent to the will of someone crafty enough. It has been done. That is how a dwarf is enslaved.

That is a simple, excellent answer.


Seeker

I agree...wow that's an awesome answer.  I never considered how they enslaved dwarves.

[jhunter]

A focus can be bent to the will of someone crafty enough. It has been done. That is how a dwarf is enslaved.

So at one point there was a whole crapload of dwarves working as slaves in the mines right?

How in the hell do you convince that many dwarves that working in a mine will help them accomplish their focus? Especially when you don't know for certain what it is. And how do you keep them from talking amongst each other and figuring out between them that it's all bullshit?

I can see how one person might bend a single dwarf's focus to their will.

But how do you do it to so many, in the same place, for so long? Go around and do some one-on-one with each of your hundreds of slaves? Keep them from ever communicating with each other as they work in a mine?

The only feasible possibility I can see for this is the use of flat out mind control.

[wizturbo]

A focus can be bent to the will of someone crafty enough. It has been done. That is how a dwarf is enslaved.

The only feasible possibility I can see for this is the use of flat out mind control.

Yup.  Both psionic and non-psionic versions could apply.  

You get some good slave "breakers" who have experience working with dwarves and they could probably break a dozen or two slaves a year by finding their focus and working things a way that convinces the dwarf that the ONLY way to possibly forfill that focus is by mining obsidian in the mine.

[Savak]

On the other hand, a focus itself can enslave a dwarf in working towards its end.

Initially, the bulk of the dwarves were probably enslaved by force, but that really isn't the point at all.  A dwarf can still work as a slave, perhaps because it believes it cannot complete its focus if it stops -- they may "have" to finish in order to move on to the important thing (their focus).  But that really isn't the point, either.

A dwarf doesn't act like a human by virtue of the role they are in.  It's how they play that role.  There's oodles of positions or jobs a dwarf could hold -- how they are played determines whether they are "acting" like a short ugly bald human with muscles, or like a dwarf.

[Yokunama]

I agree with the 'focus' bit though, focus really gives your dwarven character something to thrive for, which is what we do with all our characters, am I right? But with dwarves, its a more powerful goal than with other races.

A goal is a goal no matter who sets it.

The goal means something more to dwarves, because of their "stubborn nature". Futhermore, this goal is not just something dwarves can just give up on at any given time. This goal is their life and they will not stop at nothing even if it means dieing trying to reach this goal.

~winks~  :wink: Don't let the newbies become more familar with the theme than you.

[moab]

Dwaves fear neither death or pain in the acheiving of their focus.  
Seeker

I think this is wrong.  I believe a dwarf actually fears death prior to achieving his focus.  I believe the docs read - hrm - lemme look it up.....

Actually, it seems as if Seeker is correct on this point.  I thought I had read (and maybe this simply came from a Dark Sun book that if a dwarf dies before achieving his focus he becomes some sort of undead thing.

Is this the case or not?

[Xamminy]

In the Dark Sun novels, a dwarf that abandons his focus will become undead upon death.

[Agent_137]

So basically, to enslave a dwarf by force, you say:
If you don't work for me, I'll kill you, and then you will never fulfill your focus.

To enslave one by words, you say:
The best way to achieve your focus is by working for me! *Insert bullshit reasoning here.*


Am I on the right track here?[/u]

[Lazloth]

Before you embark on a life of dwarven enslavement, you should probably brush up on the premise of a focus.  Some stuff is archived here and there.  Foremost, the notion of a focus is a concept known only to the dwarf in question (and some would argue not even to him/her.)

I think a lot of dwarves wind up with the "serve for life" focus, especially those cultivated into slavery.

[John]

nearly all of them at one time -were- slaves...

So people should include being enslaved in their background a lot more with only a small percent never having been enslaved?

[Rhyden]

Hey, nobody disrespects LOTR! Not that you did or anything, I was just getting that point across, oh yah, and Star Wars, don't be disrespecting those and we'll be on friendly grounds, now, where was I? Oh yes, Xygax...

I don't always play your stupid average Tolkien-invented, hard-liquered, ruff-tuff, scottish dwarf -all- the time, just most. In fact, I'll make a dwarf so pansy he'd hide from a gimpka if that was their personality. I'm simply stating that the Tolkien-version of the dwarf is probably the most easy to role-play in Armageddon, and yes, it gets boring after a while.

*If there's a better slightly stereotypical version of a dwarf in Zalanthas, I'll discover it IC, but I find that some stick to the Tolkien-dwarf and some just have no real personality at all. Of course there is the exception of the truly different dwarf tripping over his feet and munching on a kank-honey lollipop, singing to himself a marry tune about elves and whatnot.  :wink:

But if it would help matters at all, I'll try to get my mind off LOTR and more onto Darksun. This doesn't mean I'm going to completely copy darksun dwarves, it'll just give me a few new ideas, help evoke some of my own. But for those of you who generally play the Tolkien-dwarf out there, keep playing them!!! They add so much color to the game, especially in a really quiet, polite tavern, if you know what I mean  :twisted:

[Rhyden]

-By my dwarven beard this thread is getting long.

You're all probably going to hate me now, aren't you?

[Dracul]

nearly all of them at one time -were- slaves...

So people should include being enslaved in their background a lot more with only a small percent never having been enslaved?

I beleive Thats meant historically.

[The7DeadlyVenomz]

Dwarves are folk who live for a reason. This reason is, as your driving force is to you but doubly so, essential and all-encompassing to a dwarf. A dwarf most certianly fears death and pain, when it is not related to achieving their focus. Even when it is related, there is likely a better way to acheive their focus than by stupidly and brazenly defying any and all barriers and opposition.

A dwarf, while perhaps not quick of mind in the manner that a human is, is nontheless wiser than just about every race, for a dwarf will analyze and reanalyze every facat of his focus, every avenue that he can see, and he will choose the one that makes the most sense to him.  Rare, then, the dwarf with a willy-nilly attitude to anything.

This means that some dwarves will have a quick, short, and to the point manner about it, while other dwarves will take their time to uneeringly acheive their focus without conceivable possibility of failure. No dwarf is alike, and their manner of reaching their focus is not the same.

In many regards, dwarves are just like humans, when it comes to their personality and the way this affects them. There are cowardly dwarves just as there are cowardly humans, and brazen, bold dwarves just as there are human counterparts. There are friendly dwarves, surly dwarves, feindish dwarves, and certianly noble dwarves. There are dwarves who have had a relatively normal life, some who have had catastrophy strike them and theirs, and dwarves who have lived in and out of slavery.

All of those factors impact both what the dwarf's focus is, and how the dwarf will go about acheiving the focus. This means that while a dwarf must have a focus and must spend their lives trying to (in their own view, at least) achieve their focus, all other aspects of a dwarf are up for grabs, free for customization and personification.

Obviously, a dwarf can not spend 100% of his breathing life in active pursuit of his goal. This means, then, that a dwarf can enjoy the pub, can enjoy sexual relations, and can function briefly in a capacity which does not actively further his goal, such as raising children, maintianing a mercenary job or perhaps serving as a guide on some grand excursion. Even a dwarven body needs rest, and it during these times that one will see a dwarf at play.

But even during these times, when the dwarf figuratively stands and scans the horizon of his focus' landscape, he is furthering his focus. The mind still roves towards the goal, even if only in the farthest recesses of the brain, for the goal, the focus is not just an idea, an idealogy, a dream, or a facination. It is an instinct. It is as much a natural function for the dwarf as breathing is, and perhaps even more so.

Though dwarves can be one-dimensional, this is as unlikely as it is for a human to be so, for dwarves are persons with reactions and feelings just as other living creatures. The difference, then, lies in the fact that, where all creatures of intellect war with theirselves concerning what is important utmostly in their life, dwarves do not. They know.

A dwarf has no definition for failure personally, for a dwarf will only fail if he dies. He understands how the less motivated beings of the world can fail, but he can not comprehend the meaning of personal failure. If one road is closed for them, they will find another. And if all are closed and none can be found, then they will make another for themselves. It is in this regard that a dwarf is utterly fearless, for when the way must be dug, when it must be reopenned, only death itself (and perhaps, in some cases, not even then) will halt their progress. This single attribute is something that no other being under the sun can lay claim to.

You see, a dwarf knows what matters the most.

[SewerRat_inTheOpen]

So a dwarf can be played like a normal human, except that the focus is a decisive/main factor influencing the behavior of a dwarf?

[The7DeadlyVenomz]

So a dwarf can be played like a normal human, except that the focus is a decisive/main factor influencing the behavior of a dwarf?

No. See, this is the major misconception. The focus is not a decisive or main factor influencing a dwarf. It is the dwarf. The factor is what the dwarf is, or rather, the dwarf is what his focus is. hey govern each other, can not function without each other ... look at it as though it is a parasitic lifeform. They feed off one another.

So a dwarf can not be played correctly as a human, because their minds are utterly alien to that of a human. When I drew the relationship, it was in this: Dwarves have feelings and emotions, just like a human. They are not stolid walls of never-ending abrasion and non-emotionalism. The point is to create a dwarf that is not single dimensional, but rather facated, as they should be.

The focus will drive, urge, slave the dwarf, but the dwarf will go as he will. There is no focus without the dwarf, and there is no dwarf without the focus. This single thing makes it impossible for a dwarf to be correctly played as a human.

It is perhaps wise to say that the mind of a dwarf is so hard to role-play correctly that very few will ever get it utterly correct, myself included. It burdens the player with an unbelievable amount of responsibility and a somewhat skewed experience of fun.

To those who are successful, even if only in a passerbyer's view, kudos.

[Anonymous]

So a dwarf can be played like a normal human, except that the focus is a decisive/main factor influencing the behavior of a dwarf?

Now, let's evaluate the answer to this particular question:

So a dwarf can not be played correctly as a human, because their minds are utterly alien to that of a human. When I drew the relationship, it was in this: Dwarves have feelings and emotions, just like a human. They are not stolid walls of never-ending abrasion and non-emotionalism. The point is to create a dwarf that is not single dimensional, but rather facated, as they should be.

Huh.... okay....

The focus will drive, urge, slave the dwarf, but the dwarf will go as he will. There is no focus without the dwarf, and there is no dwarf without the focus. This single thing makes it impossible for a dwarf to be correctly played as a human.

Interesting...

It is perhaps wise to say that the mind of a dwarf is so hard to role-play correctly that very few will ever get it utterly correct, myself included.

Oh!

Let's try to organize all of that: a dwarf has emotions (like a human), but the focus serves as the driving force in his/her entire life. You failed to mention what aspects of the dwarf it influences (all of them?). Does it influence emotions (it influences decisions, we know that)? Why I am pointing this out is - (no offense to Deadly Z) because you didn't answer the question, you merely made a few states that simply corroborate it on some levels. I think the reason why you cannot play (or others for that matter) a dwarf properly is because you do not know -how-.... you know they should have a focus, but you do not understand how to function with it, how to interpret events in terms of it, and how to develops the personality with respect to it. That is why dwarves are usually bland or Tolkien-types.

You're all probably going to hate me now, aren't you?

For a while now.

Sa'alam,

Dirr

[Delirium]

I thought 7D's post was nicely written, actually, and it gave me courage to perhaps try the dwarven mindset with a future character. I was always very intimidated by it, much moreso than the elven mindset.

I've seen two very well played dwarves, lots of mediocre dwarves and plenty more bad ones. It doesn't strike me as an easy thing to pull off.

[Anonymous]

Maybe I'm incapable of comprehending complex ideas.

Sa'alam,

Dirr

[Rhyden]

Hey, Anonymous, Salam dirr or whatever the hell you are, it seems you don't like me. Well, frankly, I'm not too keen with you either. It seems whatever I write in this GDB, you have to argue, or accuse, or simply insult. Stop, now. This is a general discussion board. People can have opinions. People don't need personal critics on their backs in this board. So stop, now. You're starting to look like a 2 year old child. Sorry if this is off-topic, but I'm not gonna start a completely new post about this sillyness.

[The7DeadlyVenomz]

Dirr,

While I think that perhaps you are trying to pick the whole thing apart, I'll humor you, because I may actually not have answered the question, and since that is what I was trying to do, it is important that all folk who read this (normal and pinko alike :lol: ) understand it.

Question:So a dwarf can be played like a normal human, except that the focus is a decisive/main factor influencing the behavior of a dwarf?

Answer No. The reason that a dwarf can not be played like a normal human is because a dwarf's focus is not a decisive or main factor in their life. A focus is the dwarf. The dwarf is a living focus.

The amount of sleep the dwarf will normally require will depend upon their foci. The types of food consumed may be governed by the same. The topics the dwarf is likely to bring up while conversing will likely concern the foci. The clothes the dwarf wears, the tattooes he will get, the dwarf he will mate with, the way he will rear his children .... every single facat of a dwarf's life is dictated by the focus the dwarf has.

There is absolutely nothing that the dwarf does that goes against his focus. There may be things that do not actively help his focus, but you can be sure that while that dwarf releases the tension of life through sexual encounters, he will be thinking about his focus, even if he is not completely aware that he is. While he drinks and chats about the upcoming arena fight, cogs in his head will spin concerning his focus and how better to perfect his accomplishment of it. The focus exists in every single thing.

To give blatant examples of a dwarf commoner ---

Kro is a 21 year old dwarf.  Young, brash, his focus has developed into a yearning of knowledge. Though there are many facats to such a foci, he particullarly leans towards knowledge of elven heritage. So, Kro has a foci to develop his knowledge of evlen history.

Kro must eat to live in the harsh enviro of Allanak, so he takes a job as a field worker. Every day but Nekrete, he trudges out with the other field workers, many of whom are slaves, and labor beneath the hot sun for most of the day, cultivating roots and grubs and wheat and so forth. While Kro works, he talks to folks about life, generally keeping it light and airy and subtle so that the slave drivers and field masters do not punish him for talking too much.

He may make a comment such as, "That arena match last night was brutal, a violent display of swordsmanship, aye, mate? Why, I sure thought that mul would rip the head from that half-breed, but damned fine footwork from that one, no? Must be that elven blood in him, ya think? I mean, I've hearda longnecks out running packs of gith. You think they bred for that or something?"

You see, in the above example, Kro, while laboring in the fields for sid and talking about an arena match, completely managed to mold the chatter into something regarding his foci, and it is highly likely that he did not even realize it.

Let us have another.

Kro has met a dwarven female named Brianna. He feels so strongly about her that he decides that he is going to mate with her, maybe for a long time. Apparently, Brianna feels the same way about Kro. Brianna has had a foci since her days as a plump youth to breed warriors. Obviously, that means that she will be selecting fathers whom she believes will make good stock.  At the same time, she takes a job as a mercenary, because she thinks that is she is a capable warrior, it will be in her blood to pass on to her offspring.

Brianna, however, feels no need to love these stock. The love she has in her heart is reserved for Kro, because Kro is such an intelligent dwarf, or seems to be. He is gentle mannered and will not get in her way, and she has no reason to get in his way. He understands that she will mate with other dwarves, and he does not care too much because it is likely that he will be off somewhere anyway, foraging for knowledge in abscure and likely complicated fashions.

So, Kro loves Brianna and wishs to mate with her because she does not hinder him in any way, in fact is supportive of his forays into the world for knowledge, and she is skilled in bed. Brianna loves Kro because he does not hinder her in her pursuit of a warrior child, possesses knowledge that may benefit her in the long run, and is mild mannered enough that her occasional short outbursts will not be taken as they would be by a more formidable dwarven male. On top of these rational, there is the simple emotion of attraction and lust and simple love, which is a combination of all that attracts one to another in the first place.

A final one ....

Kro, eager to be on his way for knowledge, leaves his mate and her newborn child with a heartfelt goodbye and journeys into the wilderness, hopefully for Luir's Outpost, where it is said that one can serve with elves personally. On the way, an elven raider attacks him. Now Kro, who is no real fighter, nonetheless is decent with a big stick and soon the lanky longleg is on the ground, fearful for his life. Kro, who glances at the sky and sees a sandstorm coming, knows that he should get on his way and find safe shelter.

Nope, this chance is too good to pass up, and so without further thought, he cracks the elf a tight one in the head, laying the longneck out cold. When the elf awakes, he is fettered with solidly tied ropes of grass, laying in a tent surrounded by the howling sandstorm. The dwarf Kro offers the elf food and water, but we know elves, eh? No doing. Kro shrugs and gets down to the real reasoning for his kidnapping of the elf. Stories. Lots and lots of stories, what the elf knows about his race, what the elf eats from day to day, how the elf has sex, how the elf runs so fast. If the elf doesn't answer, it's a hard left to the nose and the question gets asked again. This goes on for several days before the storm finally lets up. Kro is extremely thirsty now, but he keeps pouring his dwindling supply of liquid down the elf's throat so that he can still speak and tell his stories.

It's time to part, so Kro knocks the poor elf out again and leaves him in the sands, then packs the tent and heads on towards Luir's Outpost. So eager had he been to gain knowledge from the elf that he had no water left, and he nearly dies before he reachs those black walls of the Outpost...


I hope this answer and the sequel of examples have assisted you in further understanding what it is to be a dwarf. I'll post with my view on other issues raised as I can.

[Maybe42or54]

Wow. Who's up for playing a dwarf with me?

[Anonymous]

That is a very comprehensive answer -and- fulfilling one, at that. Likewise, I think it is a good representation of what a dwarf should be on Zalanthas - the example, especially, includes a variety of aspects of behavior, which are all equally important in character creation and development.

Sa'alam,

Dirr

PS: At some point in time - this thread could be useful in the archives.

[Nine_lives]

Maybe I've missed some piece of literature I should have read over, but would a dwarf openly discuss his/her focus, or is it something entirely personal that they tend not to share with others?

I am aware that personality and the question of whether the sharing of one's focus would be beneficial to the focus itself must be taken into account, but what I'm really looking for is whether it is some kind of taboo or simply not a piece of information the dwarven race feel necessary to inform other individuals about.

Thanks