Ho,

what about a situation like this:
there's an ungemmed magicker living in some plains, hunting and gathering like other hunters too, not differing much (but the ability to cast spells) from other hunters.

now other hunters see that magicker, and he doesnt (tries to) kill them, but cooperate, hunt together, share their meat (with the magicker lighting the camp fire with a small fireball :) ), well, basically getting along well with each other ?

that would sooner or later take away the fear (not respect) from the not-magickers (towards that one magicker) and they could actually do stuff together ?

or is that fully impossible due to some reason ?

regards, ---theebie---

This is a hard question to answer because it deals with so much IC information and in the end, really comes down to your char.

Was he born in the north? People tell stories there of a great cataclysm of magic, and everyone knows how it devastated the city. It's like living in Hiroshima Japan by yourself because most of your family was vaporised fifty years ago and making friends with the guy who invented the A-bomb.

Does he have past knowledge of mages? Does he have reason to trust them?

Magic isn't a blessing to most people. If you were in Zambia, and some witch doctor was shaking and rattling a thing and fire burst from his hands, would you ever trust them? Turn your back on them? Who knows what that fire makes them think. Does it affect them? Make them crazy in the head, even if they seem nice?

Magic is scary and unnatural, I think any friend ship or showing of trust of any kind should be earned many times over.

Possible, but don't expect the same treatment from somebody else.

I'm a firm believer that concepts of good and evil don't exist on Zalanthas.  But thats me.


As for the magicker thing, almost all non-magickers are distrustful and fearful of them.  Considering that magick is the single most destructive force in their little world and that it has caused so much strife, it very rare that you'll find some one willing to embrace such a thing.  Magickers themselves are suppose to be fearful of their own power.

All things consider, you wouldn't sit around the camp fire with a sentient Atom bomb.  Even if it was a nice guy and offered you a beer.


So no, it wouldn't be normal nor is it likely to happen.  People are strange though, certain events can change a perception, but its deeply ingrained into all races of Armageddon that Magick is a dangerous force and shouldn't be embraced, trusted, or reckoned with.

Edited:Because Public education needs your support and more money.

First of all, in answer to the question in the subject of the thread - no, not all magickers are 'evil'.  Magickers are people first and mages second - some people are good and some people aren't as good.
(I'm also of the opinion that there's no true Good/Evil in Zalanthas, too).

Now, about magickers and hunters.  The upbringing and personality of the characters makes a large difference here, as does the Element called upon by the magicker - there's a serious difference between how most people view a Vivaduan and how they view a Nilazi.

So let's start:
1 - Homeland: in Tuluk, there's no real distinction between an elementalist and a defiler - every mage is The Single Most Evil Manifestation of Soul-Eating Energy, they completely destroyed Old Tuluk (killing at least, say, one hundred thousand people) and even being nice to a known magicker can be sufficient grounds for being disappeared.
In Allanak, most people know that there's a difference between a defiler and an elementalist and they will have had more exposure to gemmed elementalists - if they have positive experiences with them, they might not fear magickers as much as the next guy.  If they have negative experiences, they'll probably run away or try to kill the magicker at first sight.
In Red Storm, everyone knows that there's at least a couple of magickers around at almost any given time, but the magickers mind their own business like everyone else.  But a Red Stormer is most likely to know how calm and composed (or explosively dangerous) a magicker can be, again depending on their experiences.

2 - The invoked Element - some elementalists are feared more than others.  From most feared to least feared, the ladder is generally this:
Defiler/Mindbender
Nilazi
Drovian
Elkran/Suk-Krathi
Whiran
Rukkian
Vivaduan
Under most circumstances, only a completely insane or ruthless person would ever consider befriending a Nilazi.  Vivaduans, on the other hand, are known for their powerful healing abilities and are generally considered (incorrectly, heh) to be harmless.

3 - Blind luck - it also depends on the circumstances of the first meeting.  For the first couple of meetings, at least, things are going to be very tense.  After all, when a magicker strikes, they strike extremely quickly and with mind-boggling power.  It takes time and is generally very rare, depending on the hunters and their nature and the magicker and his nature, and all sort of other circumstances that come into play.

But unless a non-magicker has been around mages for several years of their lives, I can't see them ever being comfortable around spellcasting; at least when it's not necessary.
Using a head-sized sphere of explosive flames in order to light a campfire is not only overkill, it's also frightening.  First of all, what happens if the magicker misses, or if they start a fire?  Second, don't forget the superstitions; everyone knows that being around mages when Lirathu isn't above Jihae causes fertility issues.  And finally, just imagine you were sitting in a forest, IRL, and someone went within two feet of you and used an army-grade flamethrower to light a campfire.
A twenty foot jet of fire that could burn you to a crisp within five seconds if that pyromaniac turned just a little bit.

Magickers wield tremendous powers, and almost all Zalanthans have been taught from early childhood to fear and avoid them.  It's possible to make friends with a magicker eventually, or even have a character who's fascinated and just adores magickers, but these things are very rare and very unusual.

Quote from: "Larrath"
Magickers wield tremendous powers, and almost all Zalanthans have been taught from early childhood to fear and avoid them.  It's possible to make friends with a magicker eventually, or even have a character who's fascinated and just adores magickers, but these things are very rare and very unusual.

What Larrath said.

I think like everything else in life, trying to determine what personal relationships should be like, has alot to do with your own charisma. Just like in real life, there are people who rise above ethnic or racist conflicts. Like a certain Sunni general in Iraq of a mostly Shiite army.

If by your RP, people are provoked and inclined to accept and get along with you, then so be it. The problem however, is that most of us come into the game with Western ideals of being non-judgemental. So people tend to expect that 'eventual acceptance'. Few of us play that demanded intolerance and then are able to RP getting over it. Since most of those whom can accept the 'intolerance' tend to stick to it like its the only game in town, lest they get accused of being too accepting. There is in fact, alot of times I've noticed on Armageddon, a certain behavior from PCs that seems less derived from realistic IC stimulus, but more from an OOC paranoia that imms are watching them whom won't understand the background.

A part of me tends to think that in a 'real' Zalanthas, we'd see alot more variety of behavior than we do on a mud. Since we tend to fall into the extremes of either sticking to the docs and stereotypes 100% and never wavering regardless of where your PC might have room to differe from the majority, or entering into it with Western preconceptions (which the former is a backlash of). In a real Zalanthas, I could see charismatic Magickers, Mindbenders, Sorcerors and Muls rising to all sorts of powerful leadership positions in the wastes (and which the docs speak of) but that which we rarely see ingame.

That said...Muls, Magickers, Mindbenders and Defilers are a helluva lot more scary and powerful than Sunnis and Shiites. So I tend to side with hating and fearing them regardless. If only because, since I am not an RL Zalanthas native, and am thus, unable to effectively roleplay how a true minority would feel, its safer to stick to the majority.

I'll put it this way. I'm playing an exceptionally 'good' character, in alignment terms, and he probably still wouldn't give a 'good' magicker a chance.

Fear and prejudice run strong in Zalanthas. But mileage may vary, as each character is still a unique individual.

Any normal human being/dwarf/elf would be hard pressed to trust or respect anyone that they know would be able to summon goodness-knows-what that would kill them in the blink of an eye.  A mage may try his damndest to make people trust him, but ultimately they would be terrified that this mage could turn on them at a whim and do something horrible to them, especially after seeing what he does to those animals he's hunting.

Quote from: "Cuusardo"A mage may try his damndest to make people trust him, but ultimately they would be terrified that this mage could turn on them at a whim and do something horrible to them, especially after seeing what he does to those animals he's hunting.

And a mundane character doesn't even have to believe that the magicker would do anything to him purposefully to be nervous.  Accidents happen all the time.  Hanging out with someone who can outright kill you with one misdirected spell isn't an activity many would relish.

It'd be like hanging out with a guy you "kinda" know that carries around a lit and active flamethrower.  But not just that he carries it around, you've heard stories since you were born of people like him burning down villages, women, children, and destroying entire cities.  He and his kind melt faces and roast people alive, and YOU want to sit around a campfire and talk with him?  Until he gets tired of you?  Until he loses his concentration and WHOOSH - you're a smoke stack?

There are a great many factors stacked against befriending a magicker.  That isn't to say it is impossible, but as others have said it would be an extremely rare and unlikely thing.

-LoD

Yes.

Quote from: "LoD"And a mundane character doesn't even have to believe that the magicker would do anything to him purposefully to be nervous.  Accidents happen all the time.  Hanging out with someone who can outright kill you with one misdirected spell isn't an activity many would relish.

It'd be like hanging out with a guy you "kinda" know that carries around a lit and active flamethrower.  But not just that he carries it around, you've heard stories since you were born of people like him burning down villages, women, children, and destroying entire cities.  He and his kind melt faces and roast people alive, and YOU want to sit around a campfire and talk with him?  Until he gets tired of you?  Until he loses his concentration and WHOOSH - you're a smoke stack?

There are a great many factors stacked against befriending a magicker.  That isn't to say it is impossible, but as others have said it would be an extremely rare and unlikely thing.

-LoD

Touché.

But wouldnt magickers (who are lonely hunters in the plains) WANT to befriend them ?

Quote from: "theebie"But wouldnt magickers (who are lonely hunters in the plains) WANT to befriend them ?

Depends on the magicker and their personality.  But it's definitely a possibility, sure.  Even evil magickers are human/elf/dwarf/whatever and they're all "social" races.  The desire for companionship and company affects even magickers.

Quote from: "theebie"But wouldnt magickers (who are lonely hunters in the plains) WANT to befriend them ?

Some magickers would probably love to befriend them. They've likely been turned into complete outcasts because of the abilities and some might crave a normal human interaction like they had before. Unfortunately for them the general populace is extremely prejudiced and pretty fearful about magickers in general and will want nothing to do with them. That's part of the challenge in playing a known magicker - you're not going to be "one of the lads" anymore.

Quote from: "theebie"But wouldnt magickers (who are lonely hunters in the plains) WANT to befriend them ?

That depends on the magicker in question.  Some magickers would, some magickers wouldn't.

And regardless of what the magicker wants, the majority of hunters wouldn't want to really become friends with a mage.  But many hunters would also be too clever/fearful to let the magicker know that.

Most mages would know that they are hunted, even in the wild.  They would be aware that many people pretending to 'befriend' them are just looking for the opportunity to take their head and win the bounty.

My general opinion is that you should have a good deal of IC backup as a non-mage before you befriended a mage and vice versa.

IC Backup meaning:

1) A big fat "my chur luvs magos cuz..." in your background

or

2) An update your imm reading "my chur luvs this magos he meets cuz..."

Yes.  Yes they are.  They killed the planet and they'd kill you with their insanely powerful magicks.  If they want to be your friend, it's because they're testing to see if you'd make a good lackey or mindless automaton servant.

The whiskered, yellow-haired young man says, in Naruto:
"Believe it."

Quote from: "Dakkon Black"This is a hard question to answer because it deals with so much IC information and in the end, really comes down to your char.

Was he born in the north? People tell stories there of a great cataclysm of magic, and everyone knows how it devastated the city. It's like living in Hiroshima Japan by yourself because most of your family was vaporised fifty years ago and making friends with the guy who invented the A-bomb.

Does he have past knowledge of mages? Does he have reason to trust them?

Magic isn't a blessing to most people. If you were in Zambia, and some witch doctor was shaking and rattling a thing and fire burst from his hands, would you ever trust them? Turn your back on them? Who knows what that fire makes them think. Does it affect them? Make them crazy in the head, even if they seem nice?

Magic is scary and unnatural, I think any friend ship or showing of trust of any kind should be earned many times over.

That was so much better then what I thought to add.