The delicate matter of roleplaying when you're an Immortal

[Bestatte]

I've seen some of the things ShaLeah's talking about. I've been on the receiving end of a very -very- small amount of it. It happens. It happens here, it happens in every game, it happens in the real life corporate world, it happens in big families in real life. To have faith that it doesn't happen in this game is to be blind to realities of human nature.

HOWEVER

I think that simply not informing the players of any new policies regarding which types of characters the staff is and is not allowed to play, will solve a HUGE chunk of it.

If ShaLeah didn't know that this or that PC was played by an IMM, she might not have suspected foul play. That doesn't mean she definitely wouldn't have - but that little voice in her head that said "Aha!" might not have been so loud.

Staffers need to be more careful of this kind of thing than anyone else in the game, BECAUSE of perceived victimization. ShaLeah's specific situations might be totally on the mark, or might be totally coincidence, or totally legit ICly. She has no way of knowing, she's stating how she PERCEIVES it, and I agree with her that grouped together like that, it smells kinda bad.

If she didn't know it was an IMM though - they could easily have all been coincidences and she could've continued playing happily and totally oblivious to any OOC machinations going on. And that probably would've been FINE, if you think about it. Like Venomz says - it doesn't matter if it was arranged OOCly or ICly, whatever it is. What matters is that you shouldn't have any reason to know, or even wonder. And keeping the IMM policy confidential will solve a huge chunk of that problem.

[Halaster]

Just out of curiosity, whoever this Imm is that you have a bad history with, have you emailed them directly and asked them to leave you alone, or try to work it out with them?  You may have, I don't know.  I'm just wondering, because, that's typically the best approach before posting on the GDB or something.

[Xygax]

I'm not sure there's a whole lot more than can be added to this thread, so I'm going to go ahead and lock it up before it decays into flames or goes beyond its original scope.

The staff already concede (as Sanvean has suggested in her previous posts), that there is, at the very least, a risk of a perception of cheating or favoritism, or even as someone mentioned previously the risk of making an honest mistake that exposes someone to an event that shouldn't have happened but did because of OOC knowledge.  This risk is meaningful (someone asked why you should care) because we feel strongly about the use of OOC channels and its effect on our game, and it doesn't matter what those channels are.  If it taints a player's experience of the mud overall, it's a Bad Thing; something we should try to diminish as much as possible, whether it be by adding code, improving policy and communication, or sending ninjas to peoples' houses.

I don't think we have anyone on staff that would overtly oppose a player or their character (either with their avatar or via staff channels) simply because they didn't like that player.  Most likely, if you feel you have been persecuted by a staff member, it is the result of a series of coincidences and bad timing; or the personality clashes you think you have with them in RL end up pouring through the virtual personalities you both tend to create in your PCs.  Sometimes, people just don't get along in the real world or on Zalanthas.  This occurs among the player-community as much or more than it occurs between players and staff.

If you feel that a staff member -in particular- is using OOC information gained by their staff position to do you harm, e-mail the mud account.  If you feel that ANYONE (staff or otherwise) is carrying a grudge against you that they play out in PC after PC, e-mail the mud account.  This forum is not an appropriate venue for those concerns in either case, even if you voice them in vagaries and are an non-specific as you can be.  All that you can hope to gain by posting them here is to foment suspicion and mistrust between the staff and the players (yes, both ways).  It will not result in positive interaction.

That said, I think a lot of the discussion here has been productive and I know that a lot of you are proposing policies that either are already in effect or that have been bandied about between us all for a long time, and know that your feedback is appreciated.

I'll be glad to get more suggestions via e-mail if you feel that some idea or particular point has escaped this discussion.

Thanks,

[Sanvean]

A few things.

One - when people log in, we don't see their chosen nickname.  We see (whatever their actual name is) has entered the world.  For the most part, we try very very hard to respect aliases, but it's difficult when that character is usually known by their actual name up in immland. Mistakes happen, though, and are usually followed by an "OH CRAP" on the imm channel.

Two - I am not aware of -any- clan where a player has been allowed to make a family member over and over and over again.  Seriously.  I know there is a lot of speculation about who plays what, and 90% of the time people are wrong, so my presumption is that this is more of the same.

Similarly, I'm not aware of any immortal making repeated PCs just to persecute other characters, and it's something that I would consider a gross violation of staff guidelines.  There was an incident two or three years ago where a staff member was asked to rein in their avatar(s), but since that was dealt with at the time, I'm presuming old history is not being dredged up again.

I will say that I have seen staff members be more eager to work with the players who are more pleasant to work with and/or better roleplayers, which seems pretty reasonable to me. Saying things like "you suck" or demonstrating too much OOC involvement is usually not calculated to make someone feel real inclined to deal with you on a daily basis.  Again, this would seem to be a no-brainer.  Just as in real life, if you're nasty, people are not going to want to be around you. Is this favoritism?

Three - It would be nice if people didn't play "guess the staffer"! I can think of at least one staff member who, upon coming to staff recently, was messaged by a player trying to guess their identity in a very intrusive way.  It seems to me to be way too much interest in OOC and not enough in the IC dimensions of other characters.  

Four - I don't think people should be logging on their avatars the minute they see the person they want to play with log in, but perhaps for different reasons, because to me it's a sure tip-off that it's an avatar.  Otoh, I'm not sure how this is different than arranging to play with a friend, which is a pretty common practice among the playerbase.  I can understand why someone might choose to hang out fixing typos or building objects while waiting for their buddy to appear.

Five - I'll post the guidelines in the next couple of days when they're more final, since this is something that people are interested in.  It would be nice (and probably more productive) to see more discussion of the overall picture and less of laundry lists of old grievances.

In the meantime, I'd suggest treating other characters as what they are - other characters.