Update on Weight/Height Ranges?

[mansa]

Having different sexes be able to have different sizes is what I was refering to -

If no code changes go in besides allowing females to be smaller for instance, will that just be like a setting you can do, if female display X - Y choice, if Male display X - Y choice and I guess genderless between Female X and Male Y?

That will never happen.

I was sorta asking why you feel that way, not just for a confirmation of the fact you feel that way.

I never really thought about size or weight before this thread, but seeing as people actually -care- about it and it doesn't really matter as spoken by the staff themselves, outside of that little bash thing, why does it seem so outlandish to you it will never happen?  Seems like simply a quality of life improvement if anything to make people feel better about their characters, no harm no foul.

The theme of the game is that there is no difference in Genders.  There is no "females are smaller and weaker" mindset.  That doesn't exist.  That baggage that exists from the real world does not hop over into this game.  If someone wants to make a small character, there is no reason why one gender should be "smaller" than another, since both are equal.

This thread is about changing the default parameters set aside for the races, and primarily about the human race.  That can means smaller or larger than the default parameters - for any gender, as genders are equal potential.

[Pariah]

Having different sexes be able to have different sizes is what I was refering to -

If no code changes go in besides allowing females to be smaller for instance, will that just be like a setting you can do, if female display X - Y choice, if Male display X - Y choice and I guess genderless between Female X and Male Y?

That will never happen.

I was sorta asking why you feel that way, not just for a confirmation of the fact you feel that way.

I never really thought about size or weight before this thread, but seeing as people actually -care- about it and it doesn't really matter as spoken by the staff themselves, outside of that little bash thing, why does it seem so outlandish to you it will never happen?  Seems like simply a quality of life improvement if anything to make people feel better about their characters, no harm no foul.

The theme of the game is that there is no difference in Genders.  There is no "females are smaller and weaker" mindset.  That doesn't exist.  That baggage that exists from the real world does not hop over into this game.  If someone wants to make a small character, there is no reason why one gender should be "smaller" than another, since both are equal.

This thread is about changing the default parameters set aside for the races, and primarily about the human race.  That can means smaller or larger than the default parameters - for any gender, as genders are equal potential.

I get that there is no difference or being better as a man or a woman or a genderless.  BUT, this seems like a very strange line in the sand to draw if all it changes is some bash potential and other minor things.

Or do you think that being shorter is a lesser person, I'll redirect you to some short ass Italian women I know who will beat you silly.

Again, I respect your opinion but this seems like a strange mountain to die on as they say.

[Brokkr]

It also impacts sizing for clothing, armor, exits, etc.  It isn't about "that little bash thing".

We are not going to support difference weight/height for different genders within the same race.  If you can't read the room on that one from just the GDB Staff posts, [sarcasm, sorta] please do not play in Tuluk[/sarcasm, sorta].

[Brytta Léofa]

I get that there is no difference or being better as a man or a woman or a genderless.  BUT, this seems like a very strange line in the sand to draw if all it changes is some bash potential and other minor things.

The issue isn't how big a nerf to female combat potential it is; it's that it changes female combat potential from equal to less then male.

And the problem with that is that lots of players want to play badass women fighters, and despite it being an almost ubiquitous fantasy trope over the last 20 years it is STILL very difficult for some players to wrap their head around the idea of a world with (literally coded) physical gender equality.

[LXXXVIII]

Having different sexes be able to have different sizes is what I was refering to -

If no code changes go in besides allowing females to be smaller for instance, will that just be like a setting you can do, if female display X - Y choice, if Male display X - Y choice and I guess genderless between Female X and Male Y?

That will never happen.

I was sorta asking why you feel that way, not just for a confirmation of the fact you feel that way.

I never really thought about size or weight before this thread, but seeing as people actually -care- about it and it doesn't really matter as spoken by the staff themselves, outside of that little bash thing, why does it seem so outlandish to you it will never happen?  Seems like simply a quality of life improvement if anything to make people feel better about their characters, no harm no foul.

The theme of the game is that there is no difference in Genders.  There is no "females are smaller and weaker" mindset.  That doesn't exist.  That baggage that exists from the real world does not hop over into this game.  If someone wants to make a small character, there is no reason why one gender should be "smaller" than another, since both are equal.

This thread is about changing the default parameters set aside for the races, and primarily about the human race.  That can means smaller or larger than the default parameters - for any gender, as genders are equal potential.

I get that there is no difference or being better as a man or a woman or a genderless.  BUT, this seems like a very strange line in the sand to draw if all it changes is some bash potential and other minor things.

Or do you think that being shorter is a lesser person, I'll redirect you to some short ass Italian women I know who will beat you silly.

Again, I respect your opinion but this seems like a strange mountain to die on as they say.

Not a strange mountain to die on at all if you're female, or care about how females feel when faced with the gender based limitation of their options.

Please keep it equal here, as fits the theme as previously stated.

Fun fact: women have been getting taller at a faster pace of growth than seen among men. My theory for this is that it is because of less discrimination against women and less malnourishment of women.

I've seen gross parents in the American south intentionally starving their daughters because "it is more feminine to be small." While biology may be a factor in height, grotesquely enough social factors are too. The dimorphism you observe in real life is, at least in small part, the result of biased views which do not exist in Zalanthas according to the theme.

Keep with the theme of the game and keep the height ranges for male, female, and androgynous characters the same. Want to be a super short dude like Tyrion Lannister? Go for it! Want to be a super tall woman like Brienne of Tarth? Go for it! Want to play any other concept in between? Go for it!

~ Sincerely, a biological female who is taller than the median height biological male

[Pariah]

I was under the influence that the people requesting the shorter females /were/ the female.

Again, I have no horse in the race, I honestly don't care, just didn't see it as being a huge deal if women could be shorter than men and men taller than women.

[LXXXVIII]

Because we can never get stats on the actual sex/gender of players, your guess is likely as correct as a coin flip, or even less correct given real world statistics about who games (roleplaying is the one genre where the gender of players approaches equality but it's still skewed towards men, source, a tech company I worked for).

And as others explained, because there are coded implications to height, it is a big deal and violates the theme.

[Pariah]

Because we can never get stats on the actual sex/gender of players, your guess is likely as correct as a coin flip, or even less correct given real world statistics about who games (roleplaying is the one genre where the gender of players approaches equality but it's still skewed towards men, source, a tech company I worked for).

And as others explained, because there are coded implications to height, it is a big deal and violates the theme.

Fair enough, I can see that now.

[ShaiHulud]

sings "Short people got no reason to live"..

[Riev]

Going back a couple pages, I think Dumbstruck was just asking for more range so that there was a more noticeable difference between "rail thin, dying 'rinther' and 'Gaston from Beauty and the Beast".

Currently it is between 6 and 9 stone, which is about 84lbs and 126lbs.

It sounded to me like there was a desire to just have that spread out a bit more than 40lbs of body weight. I do not necessarily think it would affect my RP, but I wanted to make sure there was that consideration. (and maybe there's no need to change it, anyway)

[Pariah]

Going back a couple pages, I think Dumbstruck was just asking for more range so that there was a more noticeable difference between "rail thin, dying 'rinther' and 'Gaston from Beauty and the Beast".

Currently it is between 6 and 9 stone, which is about 84lbs and 126lbs.

It sounded to me like there was a desire to just have that spread out a bit more than 40lbs of body weight. I do not necessarily think it would affect my RP, but I wanted to make sure there was that consideration. (and maybe there's no need to change it, anyway)

I somehow totally misunderstood it, I thought they were advocating for distinguishable differences from male/female.

But if they just want to have skinner humans or fatter humans all around.  I dunno how that changes anything.  But I'm not an expert on this at all, I didn't know that height even mattered with things.

[Patuk]

Going back a couple pages, I think Dumbstruck was just asking for more range so that there was a more noticeable difference between "rail thin, dying 'rinther' and 'Gaston from Beauty and the Beast".

Currently it is between 6 and 9 stone, which is about 84lbs and 126lbs.

It sounded to me like there was a desire to just have that spread out a bit more than 40lbs of body weight. I do not necessarily think it would affect my RP, but I wanted to make sure there was that consideration. (and maybe there's no need to change it, anyway)

Characters who weigh six ten-stone are 132lbs heavy, and 9 ten-stone is 198. The range is both higher and larger than you imply.

[Riev]

1 stone is 14lbs

My math is correct. Where is 1 stone 22lbs?

[Riev]

1 stone is 14lbs

My math is correct. Where is 1 stone 22lbs?

Why the hell is a stone equal to a kilo why is Arm always so wrong.

[Pariah]

I never understood the measures of weight and distance used in arm.

I don't know why they didn't go with either Metric or Imperial for easy of use.

I default to "leagues" outdoors which makes no sense.  Go four leagues east and one league south.

I heard someone use that once and YEARS ago, and I just kept doing it for lack of better use. I don't wanna say go five rooms, turn south go three rooms.

[Riev]

I never understood the measures of weight and distance used in arm.

I don't know why they didn't go with either Metric or Imperial for easy of use.

I default to "leagues" outdoors which makes no sense.  Go four leagues east and one league south.

I heard someone use that once and YEARS ago, and I just kept doing it for lack of better use. I don't wanna say go five rooms, turn south go three rooms.

The man rode from a league away at full speed, cover 3 miles in 3seconds and bashed me in the face before I could react.

https://gfycat.com/favoriteillustriousgoral

[mansa]

1 stone is 14lbs

My math is correct. Where is 1 stone 22lbs?

Isn't 1 "stone" equal to 1 kg?
and 1 "ten-stone" equal to 10 kg?
and 1 kg is equal to 2.2 lbs?
and 10 kg is equal to 22 lbs?

https://www.armageddon.org/help/view/Units%20of%20Measurement

...
Mass:
All masses are measured in stones. Stones are relatively equivalent to a kilogram in real life. Larger masses, in order to avoid using too many counting markers, have become called in five-stone, ten-stone, and hundred- stone. People are typically measured in ten-stone while objects are usually measured in stone.

[Pariah]

1 stone is 14lbs

My math is correct. Where is 1 stone 22lbs?

Isn't 1 "stone" equal to 1 kg?
and 1 "ten-stone" equal to 10 kg?
and 1 kg is equal to 2.2 lbs?
and 10 kg is equal to 22 lbs?

https://www.armageddon.org/help/view/Units%20of%20Measurement

...
Mass:
All masses are measured in stones. Stones are relatively equivalent to a kilogram in real life. Larger masses, in order to avoid using too many counting markers, have become called in five-stone, ten-stone, and hundred- stone. People are typically measured in ten-stone while objects are usually measured in stone.

Now this could simply be a "Zalanthas is different than real earth."
https://www.google.com/search?q=how+much+is+1+stone+in+kg&client=firefox-b-1-d&ei=CE6aY9T1NOigiLMPupyBqAc&oq=How+much+is+1+stone&gs_lcp=Cgxnd3Mtd2l6LXNlcnAQARgBMgoIABBHENYEELADMgoIABBHENYEELADMgoIABBHENYEELADMgoIABBHENYEELADMgoIABBHENYEELADMgoIABBHENYEELADMgoIABBHENYEELADMgoIABBHENYEELADMgcIABCwAxBDMgcIABCwAxBDSgQIQRgASgQIRhgAUABYAGD8D2gBcAF4AIABAIgBAJIBAJgBAMgBCsABAQ&sclient=gws-wiz-serp
But google says a stone is 14 pounds.
or 6 kg.

[Brokkr]

Stone is an actual measurement in real life.

In the UK, the scale I had would weigh you in stones if you wanted.

[Patuk]

Real life stones also aren't Armageddon stones, which are just kilograms. I sympathise with Riev, because his is a mistake that's easy to make.

[Pariah]

Real life stones also aren't Armageddon stones, which are just kilograms. I sympathise with Riev, because his is a mistake that's easy to make.

Stone is an actual measurement in real life.

In the UK, the scale I had would weigh you in stones if you wanted.

So wait...

You used a real life unit of measurement, but didn't use the unit of measurement how it works, you instead altered it to a different unit of measurement, while keeping the same name?

[Filthy_Grey_Rat]

It's a conspiracy revolving around Penn State. WAKE UP CHALTON!

[Patuk]

Stones were kg before Brokkr was ever on staff, but yes, you are right.

[FantasyWriter]

So wait...

You used a real life unit of measurement, but didn't use the unit of measurement how it works, you instead altered it to a different unit of measurement, while keeping the same name?

We also do this with 'leagues.'

[Dar]

I've played sooo many short malnourished youths.  It's easy for me, just pick lowest and shortest number.  Everyone will see as thin and short except dwarves and elves.  Which is enough for me to play the role.