Perfume/Cleaning Oil Durations

[Katima]

Hello folks!

As some of you may know, I recently reworked and economized soap. This was just a small part of a bigger project I'm working on to economize and balance scents in general.

It was brought to my attention by other staff that there was a big discussion in the not too distant past where players said that they're not interested in perfumes and cleaning oils because when you use them, they burn out too quickly. I'd like to meet you all halfway on this and find a happy medium between staff opinion and community opinion about the ideal length of a single 'use' of perfume or cleaning oil. In the poll here you'll find all of your options which I made up myself. My fellow staff have weighed in, and now its your turn.

I'm not leaving this up for very long because I need to get to work, so make sure your opinion is expressed before its too late!

[Lotion]

poggers

[Usiku]

poggers

Hrm?? 

[betweenford]

poggers

[mansa]

poggers

Hrm?? 

ok boomer

longer is better.
is there a way to remove perfume?  perhaps with a strigil?

[Brytta Léofa]

poggers

ok zoomer


I think perfumes should last one long play session. So: 8 days, but including logged-out time (like alcohol).

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You are no longer smelly.

I also wish spice smells wore off whilst offline. Nearly got reamed out by my Byn sarge for using spice in Nak. "Sarge! It's from that trip to Luirs.. ..last month.."

[Fredd]

I'de like for my scent to be saved if i log off. Similar to poison status, ect.

4.5 hours is plenty long enough for a scene

my BIG problem with scents, is that you have to actively SNIFF someone to notice it. And that has an echo. And then people look at you weird.

Scents should add a tag line to you desc. So they are always noticable. Otherwise you are that weird guy walking around, shoving a hand under peoples nose, and going "sniff me."

[Alesan]

my BIG problem with scents, is that you have to actively SNIFF someone to notice it. And that has an echo. And then people look at you weird.

Does it? I've never seen this.

[Riev]

I've never seen sniff echo.

[Alesan]

The thing I HAVE seen echo is if you just "sniff" without arguments. That's the only one I've ever done that people have reacted to as if they saw what I did.

[Katima]

my BIG problem with scents, is that you have to actively SNIFF someone to notice it. And that has an echo. And then people look at you weird.

Sorry, but also good news: this is incorrect. I've tested this to obnoxious levels with the assistance of other staff members, NPCs and even on a mortal PC because you made me doubt myself, lol. There is no echo when you sniff except to yourself. Maybe it used to be that way, but it isn't that way now. You don't even create an echo to others if you openly sniff a room you're standing in with <sniff room>.

As Alesan said, the only time you'll echo is if you type sniff with no arguments, because <sniff> with no arguments is like  <wave> with no arguments in that it is a hard-coded emote with a specific output. It creates an emote when you use it without targeting someone, because its designed to do so in the code.

[Alesan]

I'de like for my scent to be saved if i log off. Similar to poison status, ect.

We are not going to do this, sorry to say. Scents will continue to tick down once you've logged off. The changes are to make them more beneficial while players are logged on, and to ensure they don't run out during long scenes.

my BIG problem with scents, is that you have to actively SNIFF someone to notice it. And that has an echo. And then people look at you weird.

Sorry, and also good news, this is incorrect. I've tested this to obnoxious levels with the assistance of other staff members, NPCs and even on a mortal PC because you made me doubt myself, lol. There is no echo when you sniff except to yourself. Maybe it used to be that way, but it isn't that way now. You don't even create an echo to others if you openly sniff a room you're standing in with <sniff room>.

As Alesan said, the only time you'll echo is if you type sniff with no arguments, because <sniff> with no arguments is like  <wave> with no arguments in that it is a hard-coded emote with a specific output. It creates an emote when you use it without targeting someone, because its designed to do so in the code.

The only other comment I have to make about it, is if it is coded as an emote... it isn't highlighted as one within the ANSI coloring system.

[Katima]

The only other comment I have to make about it, is if it is coded as an emote... it isn't highlighted as one within the ANSI coloring system.

I'll have to look into that, cause I just noticed the same thing.

[Katima]

is there a way to remove perfume?  perhaps with a strigil?

Not currently, that I know of. I've put in an ask to our coders to see how difficult creating a script for that would be. If it ends up getting done, I'll of course make an announcement for it.

[Fredd]

I'de like for my scent to be saved if i log off. Similar to poison status, ect.

We are not going to do this, sorry to say. Scents will continue to tick down once you've logged off. The changes are to make them more beneficial while players are logged on, and to ensure they don't run out during long scenes.

my BIG problem with scents, is that you have to actively SNIFF someone to notice it. And that has an echo. And then people look at you weird.

Sorry, but also good news: this is incorrect. I've tested this to obnoxious levels with the assistance of other staff members, NPCs and even on a mortal PC because you made me doubt myself, lol. There is no echo when you sniff except to yourself. Maybe it used to be that way, but it isn't that way now. You don't even create an echo to others if you openly sniff a room you're standing in with <sniff room>.

As Alesan said, the only time you'll echo is if you type sniff with no arguments, because <sniff> with no arguments is like  <wave> with no arguments in that it is a hard-coded emote with a specific output. It creates an emote when you use it without targeting someone, because its designed to do so in the code.

Awesome. I swear it used to echo. But it's awesome that it doesn't. Thank you for checking.  Could we maybe get some sort of tag to show that someone is scented? That way we know to sniff them?

[Delirium]

They always wore off too fast for the price imo.

Glad to see this getting looked at.

[Brytta Léofa]

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n [smelling fancy]

[Brokkr]

The only other comment I have to make about it, is if it is coded as an emote... it isn't highlighted as one within the ANSI coloring system.

I'll have to look into that, cause I just noticed the same thing.

Because sniff by itself is a command that does stuff, for certain races.  Not just an emote.

[Fredd]

They always wore off too fast for the price imo.

Glad to see this getting looked at.

I always thought of them as something you wear for scenes usualy. Like the big fancy noble party, where you would expect everyone to be scented.

Another thought. So, Oil's which need a strigil AND an Oil to use, last the same amount of time as perfume? This should be changed. if someone is fully cleaning themselves with oil and strigil, that scent should last longer. This should be your day-to-day thing. While perfumes should be shorter lived, for fancier scenes.

Another thing to note. Perfumes are just 1 application, which is sort of annoying. And bottles of Oil are like 2. You common Aide wouldn't really be able to afford this. But i've seen it demanded of them.

Because of this, and my aforementioned "bottles of oil should be more day-to-day" I think bottles should last 9ish hours. More or less a full day of rp. And the bottle should have 6-7 applications. So it can be used across the week, letting the people who SHOULD be scented, easilly be able to do it without to much upkeep.

Perfume vials should have 3-4 applications and keep lasting 4.5 hours... Okay maybe 6? Long enough it should reasonably cover any formal event, and enough applications to use for a couple.

Just for context: None of you remember those tiny trial sized perfumes/cologns the big brands used to give out? You'de get several uses before it was empty. That';s more or less what I pictured perfume vials to be. So 1 use seems silly.

[sucre]

Strigil oils are fine as is, IMHO, because they come with multiple uses.

Perfumes should last longer because so many of the vial objects are one and done. Either that, or they need their prices adjusted accordingly.

[Fredd]

Strigil oils are fine as is, IMHO, because they come with multiple uses.

Perfumes should last longer because so many of the vial objects are one and done. Either that, or they need their prices adjusted accordingly.

They don't come with THAT many uses though. Like 2-3 if i remember correct.  Which seems a bit shallow.

What about my point of Perfume vials should also have more uses? that would seem to solve your issue with them.

[sucre]

I'm pretty sure it's 3-4, some having more, I use them fairly regularly on my PC. That said, perfumes are ~40 sid for basic scents that last less long, iirc, outside than oils. Oils you can get for 20-30 more sid and have more than double the uses and, afaik, they last longer.

I suppose your idea for more perfume uses would work. I didn't go through every reply in this thread before I added my comment, sorry for that.

[Fredd]

I'm pretty sure it's 3-4, some having more, I use them fairly regularly on my PC. That said, perfumes are ~40 sid for basic scents that last less long, iirc, outside than oils. Oils you can get for 20-30 more sid and have more than double the uses and, afaik, they last longer.

I suppose your idea for more perfume uses would work. I didn't go through every reply in this thread before I added my comment, sorry for that.

If I could find the ones with more then  4 uses, i'de probably use them a lot more then I do. And I should probably use them a lot more.

[Katima]

So to clarify the debate, currently single-use perfume vials last the exact same amount of time as strigil oils if the perfume is set to default duration. All strigil oils were set to last 9 IC hours per 'use', and all strigil oils have 3 uses. This brings them to 27 IC hours per bottle, which is the exact same amount of time a single-use vial lasts.

Sucre is probably thinking about the legacy perfume oils and lotions offered by a certain fancy-pants clan that have multiple uses. IIRC that clan has 2-3 single-use and 4 multi-use scents spread between oils, perfumes and lotions. Their oils predate the Oil Tradegoods project and as such operate the same way typical perfumes operate, but some of their products intentionally have more uses than oil tradegoods because of the clan's specialization in frivolity.



We are not making vial perfumes that last more than one use, because they're tiny vials of liquid perfume. What we are doing is making it so that a single 'use' of a scent item applies a scent for whatever amount of time wins the combined staff and player voting process. This means that multi-use scents will naturally last longer than their single-use perfume vial counterparts.

For an example scenario: If 12 hours won, a vial of perfume would last 12 hours and need to be bought again after, or an Oil Tradegood cleaning oil would last 12 hours x3 uses, so 36 hours total. And those fancy-pants items will be adjusted as well, so if players are willing to put in the work to find the PC/NPC sources related to the fancy-pants clan, they could get potential days worth of uses out of a multi-use product sold by that clan.

Its also still being discussed whether or not oils and lotions will have longer durations than single-use 'liquid' perfumes. If 9-12 hours wins out as the minimum for single-use, its unlikely that there will be a difference other than the difference offered by number of uses in the item. But even under those terms, multi-use items will be drastically extended in shelf-life.

[Katima]

I'de like for my scent to be saved if i log off. Similar to poison status, ect.

Through science Brokkr and I have figured out that this is actually how it works by default. I had 4.5 IRL hours on my timer, logged out for an hour, and when I logged back in it was still 4.5 IRL hours. So scents only tick down while you're online.

Also, a 20 year old bit of facts that people who smoke spice might love: scents fully overwrite spice smoke smells that linger on a PC (this might also apply to the stinky scent you get from being around poop, rejoice Bynners!). Better yet, if you have a perfume active, you can smoke spice and it won't re-overwrite the perfume, OR stack with the perfume scent. The perfume stays dominant over smoke. Brokkr told me it was announced long long ago when perfumes were added to the game, so I was permitted to re-announce it to everyone! We're going to look into having that feature explained in the helpfiles for spice and perfume.