Question for old rangerphiles

[RavingTregils]

Covid returner here. So I stored a >30 day played ranger who was about ready to die anyway (aging stats suck as well) and I just can't seem to find a replacement.

I put a lot into a stalker but it just sucked.

I was a PvE player, no pk, so a lot of the skills on the ranger tree didn't matter: sneak/hide/poison don't care. On the other hand, master ride, skin, scan, brew, maybe climb are extremely important. Archery was fun but now it's useless against anything you need arrows for. Before storing, shot an X and it was on me before I could even swap out weapons. Fortunately, that ranger had no problems smacking it down. Over many many maxxed archery rangers, I have never one-shot killed anything of importance even with extremely good strength/agility. So master archery isn't that important anymore.

If you've played a lot of rangers you know that advanced ride will get you a "mount refuses to move" just when a pack of raptors are on your tail. Or you run out of cures far away from the cities. Sooner or later you will be ambushed out there by a big pack of somethings even with master scan. Ranger just gave you a decent chance at getting away.

I don't understand why the best mounted class is also the best on foot. It feels like scout should be the best for old PvE ranger players but the lack of brew, only advanced scan/ride makes me think it will not survive that unexpected ambush. So, I hesitate to put in the time to train one up. And we all know it takes a lot of time.

Best I can think of is scout + apothecary just to get brew. Problem is, I see it dying when that mount refuses to move and you really need to be running or failing to see that one spider is actually four.

My question is, how are y'all getting your fix? There's only three with master skinning (without skinning, no point hunting). You just toughing it out with stalker? Not exploring the far reaches solo anymore?

The game is fine. Lot of players, lot going on. I'm just wandering if I am overlooking some combo or is the old solo hunter/explorer that could handle running into a pack of kryl, spiders, etc. no longer an option.

[Fredd]

I'de like to state that if the thing wouldn't normally be aggressive, then it won't charge you. if you shoot a jozhal, or something, it'll just run.

[rinthrat]

'Your mount refuses to move' really isn't a thing anymore. It doesn't even happen with novice ride. I haven't had problems with ride even on a PC that did not get ride from a class or subclass and had to use whatever the cap for general ride is. You stop falling off at some point. It's pretty hard to even get to master ride because you just don't fail.

Advanced scan is pretty good at spotting beasties. The difference when it comes to spotting beasties is tiny, if it's there at all.

Packs definitely got tougher because they're a lot better at giving chase now. But you really, really don't need master ride or scan.

[mansa]

There's been a bunch of changes over the past couple years:

"NPCs react when you shoot at them with projectiles, rather than just standing still."  - this may have some NPCs run into the room and be agressive or run away.

"Riding with two weapons out / etwo uses your proficiency in dual_wield or two_handed rather than the ride skill itself"

Weapon Skill Gain and Offense/Defense Skill Gain have changed so it is more of a logarithmic scale, and it takes into account the opponents skills into the equation.  This means you can't get to "advanced" or "master" weapon skill proficiencies just by killing rats and tregils.

Stalker and Scout starts with parry, where it took Rangers a long while to branch it.

I believe Scout starts at the same combat proficiency as Rangers did.  (https://gdb.armageddon.org/index.php/topic,53932.msg1016045.html#msg1016045)



If you started a brand new Ranger, right now, you may be in the same situation as you were in with your Stalker, with the exception of Climb and Brew.

[Lotion]

"Riding with two weapons out / etwo uses your proficiency in dual_wield or two_handed rather than the ride skill itself"

Not sure if also new but this applies to shield use as well

[HortaCulture]

'Your mount refuses to move' really isn't a thing anymore. It doesn't even happen with novice ride.

Um yes it does. It absolutely does. Especially at novice ride. Personal experience recently confirms this.

It happens very rarely at advanced though. If ever.

Riding gear is good. Anecdotally at advanced ride, with good riding equipment, two things still happen (but rarely)
You are off your mount and in combat, and try to remount --and it moves out of the way.
You are in rough terrain/sandstorm and riding fast/running --and get some message about mount being stubborn

but I feel comfortable saying at advanced, with equipment, you will not see "refuses to move" very often, if at all. But you gotta have equipment.

"Riding with two weapons out / etwo uses your proficiency in dual_wield or two_handed rather than the ride skill itself"

Not sure if also new but this applies to shield use as well

It's a combo actually, seems to be. I've had cases where I cannot just cannot ride with shield/etwo/dual-wield (at jman~ roughly) and put on riding gloves. And then suddenly I can.

As to the question of how I get my fix (massive rangerphile here, card carrying support group member) tbh I'm still figuring out what I can live without. It really is a question of that, what it comes down to.

Points to consider:
I was never a huge stealth ranger myself so the loss of master stealth skills doesn't bother me.
Having SOME utility is super important to long-term play-ability. I find it really hard to be straight combat without so much as fletchery/brew/skinning to support myself or amuse myself when things are slow.

Skinning is REQUIRED to get the ranger experience imo so I'll just say that now.

Scout + sub with brew
- not too bad, scratches most of the itch, combat against the standard batch of NPCs is fully possible, and you can train a scout up pretty painlessly. Advanced scan not great often feel blind but it's livable. I have discovered if I don't have master scan, I don't even use scan, because in practice I never see anything I NEED to see. Heh. So it doesn't even matter. So I gradually stopped using it.

Raider + woodworker
- actually a good compromise (for me), you get some craft skills (good for money/downtime) and you get hunt and skinning. Only jman mind you but enough to get by, without being the waste master. I get to be a foresty-outdoors fighter person that's still hugely useful in multiple avenues, to basically all indie and clanned orgs for roleplay purposes.

Stalker + mage sub
- if you have the karma you can make up for some of the noodle arms by being a filthy magicker. This can be fun. Really fun. Especially since all that utility means you never have to enter a civilized area if you really don't want to...

Stalker + anything + a lot of time and patience
It's possible to have a stalker to be really good at combat, it is. But in my experience this is only going to happen if you have reliable sparring with seasoned PCs + Good combat stats + willing to be crap for a good long while or have a lot of time to devote to improvement. This will not be possible for everyone or everyones cup o' tea

[RavingTregils]

THANK YOU!

With respect to Ride - I am currently experiencing full stops with advanced ride/advanced fighting style (shield) while walking on flat ground. No riding gear though. Happens often enough that riding scares the heck out of me.

Tried stalker. Did not enjoy it. Never liked playing warrior so fighters are out.
Magic users are kinda meh. Last one's great achievement was getting the help file for "plague" changed. Avoiding people isn't my idea of fun.

Thank you very much for the response. I was afraid I was overlooking something. But it sounds like scout-something is about as close as it gets.

[HortaCulture]

THANK YOU!

With respect to Ride - I am currently experiencing full stops with advanced ride/advanced fighting style (shield) while walking on flat ground. No riding gear though. Happens often enough that riding scares the heck out of me.

Tried stalker. Did not enjoy it. Never liked playing warrior so fighters are out.
Magic users are kinda meh. Last one's great achievement was getting the help file for "plague" changed. Avoiding people isn't my idea of fun.

Thank you very much for the response. I was afraid I was overlooking something. But it sounds like scout-something is about as close as it gets.

Get yahself some gloves/spurs/boots and test to find what works, it'll help tremendously. There's a lot of them going around IC because we're all in the same skimmer

Also beetles seem to be bigger assholes about this.. in my experience at least.

[Hauwke]

In all the time I have been playing, I have only ever gotten to advanced ride once, and yet with jman ride on even other stalkers I never had any issue falling off or being unable to move.

I think you may be having some other issue unrelated to the actual level of the skill.

[KittenLicks]

I'm going to chime in as another person that's never really had trouble with advanced ride. Funny how there's so much variance, maybe it's a stat thing.

[Spider]

Haven't had the same issues with riding, though I do tend to prioritize agility a little higher for some reason.  Gear plus higher agility I suppose if you want a more reliable riding experience.

[rinthrat]

I swear I have not seen this message on multiple characters. Including two that had to learn ride through trying and did not get ride from the class or the subclass.

There is some terrain that is extremely difficult to ride in, maybe that's the problem.

[Brokkr]

There are specific terrain modifiers, so yes, some terrains are much more difficult to ride in.  This means you may still fall off I. Those terrains where you might be beyond that possibility in others.

[HortaCulture]

It's likely terrain related it only becomes a concern in certain places. However if those places are places my PC tends to be then.. welp. Riding gear + accept the difference between advanced and master matters enough in these cases that it may not always be reliable.

[RavingTregils]

The place in question is in the middle of scrublands.
Twice now, I've had the "refuses to move".
Both WALKING, both with advanced ride/advanced shield.
One had clear weather, one had stinging sands.
One the mount was tired, one a little weary.
It's not like I've gone to this place a hundred times. More like ten.
Yes I have logs.

Maybe it is stats. This one has sucky stats. Didn't know stats mattered to ride.
Maybe gear would help. Never worried about riding gear before.
Maybe scout ride will be better for some reason.
Maybe this one spot is messed up.
I don't know what the problem is or if there is one.

But, walking in the scrublands is a far cry from exploring the unknown.

Hope you can see my mental disconnect here. I have an outdoor character that can't walk across flat terrain, much less run across it.

I asked what class other former ranger lovers were playing because I don't look forward to trail-and-error testing out all the new classes and finding disappointment with old ranger skills as I am with ride and this particular class.

[SpyGuy]

Might be stats.  I haven't had that problem with a scout with similar skills and no riding gear.

Admittedly, scout isn't the all around badass rangers were for utility purposes. No brew and they're missing a few other handy skills.  They are more solid right out of the box for melee though since they don't have to train dual wield for ages to branch parry.  I'd say in my experience as another rangerphile that scouts are a perfectly fun substitute to rangers but you'll either have to get brew from a ultility subclass or find a source of tablets and then pick a crafting/whatever subclass to have fun with during downtime.

[Riev]

There are areas in "the middle of the scrublands" that are not easy rides, even at walking speed.

Theory-crafting: Even if you have the skill to ride with a shield out, doing so may affect your overall success at riding.

[triste]

https://tristearmageddon.github.io/arma-guild-picker/skill-picker/ -- this can let you select all the skills you want and recommend a guild/subguild combination. This part of the app was inspired by something KittenLicks built. Might help you find a good ranger replacement.

When guilds were refactored, we lost a lot of specialization. We used to have specialized "Burglar," "Pickpocket," career focused guilds, and rangers were of course the outdoors specialists. This specialization was replaced with a model of tiering, in which we now have gradations of ability in stealth, crafting, fighting, and outdoors utility. Unfortunately this has created a level of homogeneity in which a lot of these guilds no longer feel "great" at what they do or highly specialized. While the refactor did achieve some great things, such as reducing the extent of guild sniffing, it caused a lot of the new guilds to feel flat and disappointing relative to the highly specialized guilds we had before as you and others have noticed.

[HortaCulture]

The place in question is in the middle of scrublands.
Twice now, I've had the "refuses to move".
Both WALKING, both with advanced ride/advanced shield.
One had clear weather, one had stinging sands.
One the mount was tired, one a little weary.

Hmm that is interesting. Perhaps it is stat related. I have not had the best AGI or WIS on my advanced ride characters either but it wasn't terrible. I can't recall having this issue at a level you're describing. Riev is right though there are some places that are deceptively hard ride checks.

More theory-crafting: War beetles do seem to be more "stubborn" that might also contribute. I'm not aware of too many things that give ride penalties outside of what's been listed. It is possible, I suppose, that some equipment might actually hinder ride, but I haven't a damn clue what would do that.

Feeding the mount are you? That's new and I dunno if feeding them contributes to them being more of "joy to ride" but maybe it does? If anyone knows.

[RavingTregils]

I appreciate the feedback. GDB kudos to all who responded.

Scout seems to be the consensus and I foresee a scout in my future.
It's ok if I never figure out this class (won't try it again).

FYI, the one good thing I noticed about feeding the mounts is they do not get tired as easy.

[Fredd]

I appreciate the feedback. GDB kudos to all who responded.

Scout seems to be the consensus and I foresee a scout in my future.
It's ok if I never figure out this class (won't try it again).

FYI, the one good thing I noticed about feeding the mounts is they do not get tired as easy.

They also recover faster. Very important for those that ride Inix.