Roleplaying theft?

[Synthesis]

I feel like Cerelum plays all the PCs I mercilessly grief with my pickpockets, because he's the one doing dumb shit when he thinks nobody is looking.

[Is Friday]

[Cerelum]

I feel like Cerelum plays all the PCs I mercilessly grief with my pickpockets, because he's the one doing dumb shit when he thinks nobody is looking.

Possible, though every character I play normally has master scan and listen.  My current is the one rare one that does not.

[Nameless Face]

This is just the Wheel of Hate, turning.

• Elves
• Half-elves
• Magickers
• Half-giant smarts
• Thieves
• Templars' Murderous Power
• Tavern sitters/Social roles
• Raiders
• Merchant House perks
• Nobility RP
• Indy wealth/ease
• Erotic RP

GDB personas pick one that they aren't doing right now with their own PC, beat on it mercilessly until they feel morally superior, then spin the Wheel again in a few weeks.  Repeat.

[John]

...aaaaand that's why your mount ticket gets yoinked as soon as you > rent beetle.

help alias

Alias                                                               (Control)

   This command allows you to create mnemonics which will be expanded into
full commands when typed. Arguments following the mnemonic will be inserted
into the command, but replaceable parameters and substitutions are not
implemented. You can have a maximum of 100 aliases. Using the alias command
by itself will list your current aliases.

   To delete an alias, use the alias command with the name of the alias
you wish to delete, as in "alias spoo".

Syntax:
   alias <mnemonic> <text>
alias

Example:
   > alias ds draw sword   - Creates ds alias and assigns 'draw sword' to it
> alias ds              - Deletes the ds alias
> alias fb cast 'wek un suk-krath divan hekro'
> fb gith
(This will have the same effect as typing "cast 'wek un suk-krath divan

hekro' gith", except that from now on, you will just need to type "fb
<target>" instead of the whole spell.)

So simply create the following alias.

Alias ht hold ticket

ensure you're secondary hand is free before you rent your beetle and type Rent beetle and immediately type ht right after

They have about a second to sneak in their steal command before you're holding the ticket in your hand and it's unstealable.  If they time the delay on steal that well, then bless them they deserve the ticket.

And this us why the GDB cant have discussions on pickpockets and burglars. The GDB does do some good for the game, but it is largely filled stupid toxic crap like this.

[Synthesis]

Yo dawg, if I see you stashing your 0-stone valuables inside a pouch inside a bag inside a pack...

> mercy off

[Cerelum]

Actually, not sure if it's always been this way, but you can't hold a ticket (anymore)?

Sucks, well you can always alias putting shit away inside things very quickly and closing your pack.

[oggotale]

Reminder that just because someone isn't directly involved in a plot or roleplay situation, it doesn't mean it didn't happen.

You being stolen from can trickle in to interactions in the criminal underbelly, the fact that your character has realistic ignorance of these events does not stop this.

[Tekky]

Hey.

I have very little to complain about pick-pockets. I rarely notice when I have been stolen from, because most people are smart enough to steal something you'd easily miss. (I mean my character, my OCD knows I have fifteen feathers in my bag.)

The only real lesson I would want to give to pick-pockets is to perhaps just use common sense. If a noble is sitting down reading a book, and for some reason might not be codedly using "hold" for whatever reason, I don't know, they're holding a candle to illuminate the pages or whatever. And you pickpocket that book, while they're reading it. That's some stupid shit.

Same with all the scenes of Bynners and Soldiers I have seen who enter a place, take their helmet off "emote puts helmet under arm and salutes" and before they can think to "hold" the helmet, someone yanked it. Obviously they are saluting, drawing massive attention to themselves.

There are a myriad of those sort of instances that I feel are annoying. But if you see a grebber hauling in a bag and you yoink a scrab steak out of his bag while he wanders over to the roasting pits. Or a trader hauling a bag of shiny rings he just made. Etc. That is great, that is what it was intended for I think?

This is again the discussion of how much fun does stealing bring to the game. Same with PKing. You take something, you give something back. Hopefully your character provides fun for others because of their stealing. And not just to 'grief' people by yanking mount tickets for giggles. (Unless of course, that was what the pickpocket was hired to do. Thus creating fun for some other character as well.)

With great power comes responsibility. And I feel playing a criminal is very hard in that regard! Especially if you are a highly skilled one.

I never felt that pick-pocket was for stealing Lord Samos' bronze sword off his belt, but that is just me.

[Dar]

Some random thievery is needed to create the atmosphere of rampant crime. As it should be in Zalanthas. Mission achieved. If you genuinely want to go through all that hassle that Cerelum described to guarantee your personal invulnerability, it's your choice. But I can say that when I play thieves, I occasionally do some harmless thievery that's outside of plotwork. But when I see someone go to the extremes Cerelum describes, I'll admit, I'd go an extra mile as well.

Unfortunately, it is an allure of the game. Being stolen from. The stealth and the silent/hidden emotes. In truth, what should be changed is not the code, but the players and their expectations. Needless to say, stealing 500 off of newly created character is lame. And it is sad that this happens. I would've filed a player complaint about it. But with those people, we also have people who loot a corpse of a newbie, pick up the noobie coins, and then buy a piece of bone for 900 coins, just to get rid of it. Just because it's lame to use noob coins. Some players are awesome. Alas, some are not. But it is overall, fringe cases. Very fringe.

I honestly like the way thievery works. It's powerful and much like many other aspects in the game, can be game breaking if abused. So dont abuse it. Dont cheese things, and make the game better with your actions, not worse.

But if you fall victim to thievery. Dont take it as a personal insult. It is literally a way for a thief to interact with you in a way that the role and situation allows. If it really injured you so much, play with it. What can you do to regain the lost item, or prevent from being stolen from again. 'That' creates content and interactivity to the game. Seeing the emote of how you got stolen from is genuinely irrelevant.

[The Lonely Hunter]

This guy is being bashed for asking for more RP...something is wrong with that. Some of you have gotten way too meta.

[Mr.B]

Thieves should roleplay their theft.

Even if you don't think they must emote their thieving actions specifically, it's a requirement of playing Armageddon to roleplay. Arm's emotes/thinks/feels and modes of communication make up our roleplaying tools so whether before, during or after there should be roleplaying done using those tools. You can bet that staff do take notice if someone regularly isn't doing their due diligence and steals abusively. This really goes for all sorts of abuse and poor play.

Please do use the request tool if you believe that abuse is going on, this way it can be investigated by staff and addressed if it's found to be so.

[MeTekillot]

It's actually valid to steal without emotes. I emote when I fail steal checks. Just don't spam peek.

[MeTekillot]

The superior theft strategy is bashing with an etwo'd mace while they have those juicy unarmed defense penalties. If they walk around armed they look goofy so nobody will take their plots seriously. Either way you win.

[Synthesis]

This guy is being bashed for asking for more RP...something is wrong with that. Some of you have gotten way too meta.

Not really.

I'm in disagreement because it seems like he's asking for thieves to be held to a higher standard than everyone else.  See:  my long list of stupid shit that we also put up with.

For example:  everyone is like, "haha, go on X-D with your bad self" when he says something like "I'll give you one chance to play fair when I raid you, but after that, it's straight to the code,"  but when a pickpocket player says "if you hide your shit like a bitch, I'm going to grief you" it's META.

[John]

This guy is being bashed for asking for more RP...something is wrong with that. Some of you have gotten way too meta.

If you actually read my reaction to his post, you'll see what I was responding to. Also: It's rare that I agree with Synthesis. But the post directly above mine? I actually agree with that.

I do feel this game has gotten too soft. I see people making a concerted effort to push back on that and I welcome their efforts.

[Rumor]

Just as thieves are not trusted to RP appropriately (apparently), I don't trust the masses to appropriately RP and react(or specifically not react) to me flavoring emotes with me attempting to steal from people. So I, as I always have, will continue to use thinks/feels and the like while I do things assuming my character is hidden and not use actions the code forces me out of a hidden state when I'm trying to ambush someone or steal from them.

If something is missing, follow up in game. Talk to AOD or Guild and have people try to locate the item. Try to get it back through ransom and then attempt revenge. If your character wouldn't do those things, then don't. If you think you've been unrealistically stolen from, submit a player complaint and allow the staff to weigh in and appropriately correct behavior if necessary. But requesting someone who cannot be seen, as it being hidden or invisible is intended, act in a way that reveals them to you and you get to react is absurd. If you're not asking that people emote out things, what roleplay specifically are you looking for from someone your character cannot observe?

[Krath]

I do feel this game has gotten too soft. I see people making a concerted effort to push back on that and I welcome their efforts.

This.

[Nile]

This guy is being bashed for asking for more RP...something is wrong with that. Some of you have gotten way too meta.

Heh, I've explained my position explicitly a few times and even apologised and edited my post to qualify and negate the silly assumptions people seem to make with regards to any sort of commentary regarding theft RP; that being, 'you're just mad'. This is such a poor argument it hardly warrants a response. I've played the game for 15 years. Acquiring items isn't an issue, it's just that it doesn't feel like interaction in a RP environment with actual players. You just assume some vNPC stole it, which is also fair enough, but I personally find it quite boring. If that's your thing. Go for it. I'll stick to playing the game in my own style. For me it's a plot over a line of code on a make believe character any day.

[oggotale]

Just to clarify, do you wish for subtle emotes during most thievery while hidden, or unhidden emotes?

In the first case, it would add a sprinkle of flavor perhaps but it wont really drive plots right, since they'd still be a hidden "someone" in the emotes, whan can you do that you didn't before, emote out how pissed you are earlier instead of later? it would cut down how much theft can occur though.

Or do you wish for unhidden emotes, wherein your thief reveals himself fully? (Reveals himself with the command that is they might still RP thinking they're being subtley smooth)

Only the last case would drive plots, potentially.

[PriestlySiren]

Someone with a high enough watch skill might catch hemotes, as far as I know. If you are a thief sitting next to someone, you can easily emote something about being near, and hemote your actions - but GASP you run the risk of people seeing you.

[Synthesis]

You can already detect the theft with watch.

If you didn't see it, you didn't fucking see it.

Fuck giving people extra chances to see it.

End of story.

[John]

Someone with a high enough watch skill might catch hemotes, as far as I know. If you are a thief sitting next to someone, you can easily emote something about being near, and hemote your actions - but GASP you run the risk of people seeing you.

Steal let's you add in a description of how  your stealing. Doing any additional emotes is simply asking to give people extra chances to detect a theft which isnt really realistic.

[Riev]

Stealth is just the next thing on the Hate-Cycle, but its been there for years.

Even if someone gloriously semotes the scene, thinks, has been planning it for weeks, the simple fact is, it comes down to the roll they get on their attempt to steal. If they succeed, you will never know about it.

Everything else is just fluff. Extra chances to catch them. Asking them to 'flaunt' their theft, so you know who to target. Some people may do that, most people are not going to show themselves off as a thief. Thievery is ILLEGAL, because this isn't Tuluk anymore. Someone knows you're a thief and you'll get backstabbed just because Inventory Elementalists are more feared than defilers.

I... just can't get behind "give victims more chances" in this situation. There are already super-meta ways to avoid being stolen from, and thieves can't just steal the broadsword off your back.

[oggotale]

Someone knows you're a thief and you'll get backstabbed just because Inventory Elementalists are more feared than defilers.

Quiet a eery thought.

Although what I'd rather have is them both getting instakilled.

Stealth is just the next thing on the Hate-Cycle, but its been there for years.

Even if someone gloriously semotes the scene, thinks, has been planning it for weeks, the simple fact is, it comes down to the roll they get on their attempt to steal. If they succeed, you will never know about it.

Everything else is just fluff. Extra chances to catch them. Asking them to 'flaunt' their theft, so you know who to target. Some people may do that, most people are not going to show themselves off as a thief. Thievery is ILLEGAL, because this isn't Tuluk anymore. Someone knows you're a thief and you'll get backstabbed just because Inventory Elementalists are more feared than defilers.

I... just can't get behind "give victims more chances" in this situation. There are already super-meta ways to avoid being stolen from, and thieves can't just steal the broadsword off your back.