Plot raffle.

[BadSkeelz]

The way I see it, without wanting to sound too complain-y, is that staff can not and certainly DO not watch people playing the game nearly as much as we want or hope.

The amount of things staff DON'T know, without someone reporting it, is genuinely spectacular. As much as I like to imagine the iDB having posts dedicated to each plotline going on right now, I'd be willing to bet there are maybe three about staff avatars causing a ruckus, and not about how Corporal Riev is kanking that Terashi all night.

I mean, at least this is an incentive program that isn't OUTWARDLY favorable to veterans, etc. There's maybe 9 players that really actively engage other players in their shit, for the 200+ we get every week. Maybe this will increase a bit?

The flipside is that Players are not reporting nearly as much as we could or should be. So hopefully we'll see more connection and in turn more resulting fun.

I'd still much rather get the rewards on my current PC. Running a five+ person plot with world-affecting scope to get a skill bump for my (probably long-lived and difficult to skill up) PC would be tempting.

[Molten Heart]

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[Feco]

OH WAIT I GET IT. GUYS I GET IT NOW.

I misunderstood.  I thought staff would more actively pursue plots that were picked in the raffle.

It's just an incentive to plot, and to let staff know what you're plotting.

That means those of us already plotting don't change anything, and we can win cool shit now.  Those who don't plot or don't report their plots are now encouraged to via some sweet, sweet raffle prizes.

I love this.

Gimme a little slack, please.  I'm still taking drugs from my wisdom teeth removal.  That's my defense.

[Malken]

How are winners decided? I mean... it seems clear that staff are still going to be judging which plots are okay and which plots aren't. What's changed? Is it that guidelines staff want players to follow are being published or is this also an announcement staff are moving to support player plots more than before? I guess I'm wondering what's new and how this is a change.

Half of Cayuga's post answers that.

[wizturbo]

Kinda face palming at this board's reading comprehension today.  Cayuga, I would recommend saving any announcements about cool shit you're doing for a Tuesday morning as I think people are brain dead on Monday.   

[Malken]

DO YOU PEOPLE NOT KNOW WHAT A GODDAMNED RAFFLE IS!!!!!!!!!!111



- Cayuga

[wizturbo]

Oh, suggestion #3.

Add a template for this on the request tool. 

[Akaramu]

Now that we've realized our collective reading comprehension failure...

...detailed guidelines for acceptable plots would still be awesome. 

[nauta]

Oh, suggestion #3.

Add a template for this on the request tool.

I was thinking this too.  Perhaps not a strict pulldown-style template, but a few 'stock' examples might help encourage ideas.

[BadSkeelz]

The only clarification I would like regarding the raffle itself is whether the Points you're awarded are the same or different from the Entries used to determine prizes:

Depending upon the scope, reach, and duration of your ongoing plot(s), you will have a number of one to three entries into the monthly raffle. The following are guidelines as to how these entries will be assessed:
One Point: Two to three characters involved, lasts only a few days, or the scope and impact is small.
Two Points: Three to five characters involved, lasts a week or more, or the scope and impact is medium.
Three Points: Five plus characters involved, lasts longer than a week, or scope and impact reaches far beyond your character's life.
Please keep in mind that plots that last longer than a month will need to be reviewed monthly: they will not be automatically considered if they're ongoing due to any circumstances.

If you win the raffle with one entry, you can have a small addition to a future character in way of a custom scar or tattoo.
If you win the raffle with two entries, you can have the above plus an additional vanity item.
If you win the raffle with three entries, you can have the above plus a skill bump for a future character.

Assuming they're the same, theoretically someone who runs a bunch of little plots involving their two friends (i.e. increasingly elaborate stagings of mudsex threesomes) could have a better chance of winning than someone who runs one big inclusive plot. Seems abusable.

also if you steal my threesome idea i will give your PC a reason to wear that reward scar o yes

[Fathi]

This is really neat, and while I understand the concerns of a few posters, I'm pretty optimistic.

This is an ideal situation for someone who creates a lot of plots and loves to play really fucked-up, ugly characters. AKA me.

[wizturbo]

Assuming they're the same, theoretically someone who runs a bunch of little plots involving their two friends (i.e. increasingly elaborate stagings of mudsex threesomes) could have a better chance of winning than someone who runs one big inclusive plot. Seems abusable.

I'd argue that little plots involving two friends are actually low hanging fruit to being livened up and made into cooler plots with a little staff involvement.  Your threesome example is probably not a great example of this...  (although my aforementioned example of senior nobles barging in during a game of strip kruth eludes that such things could be highly amusing).

Picture it this way.  Let's say your plot is a recurring kruth card game that you and 2 other PC's are going to have on Weds night.   You hold the game at the Salarri estate, as one of the PC's involved in a Salarri.  Because staff are aware of this fairly benign run of the mill plot, they could choose to spicen things up because they have advanced notice.  Before this raffle, there would be no reason to talk about having a basic kruth game. 

With that advanced notice, they could:

• animate another Salarri family member who shows up piss drunk and demands to join in the game.
• Have Grandma Salarr's pet Quirri get loose from her cage and start rampaging through the estate.
• Or they just make some entertaining echos about the Salarri family member whose into a little whips and leathers screaming in the room next door.

All of these things would make that run of the mill plot way more fun and memorable, and all they really needed to make it happen was knowledge of the event and an excuse to fuck with you.

[Delirium]

Maybe I'm just a snob but I really don't see what a kruth game adds to the game.

Not that it's not okay to sit around and play kruth and have fun. That's totally okay. It's just not... doing anything.

Now if it's a kruth game that's just a pretense to get together and scheme/politic that's something else entirely.

[Fathi]

Maybe I'm just a snob but I really don't see what a kruth game adds to the game.

Now if it's a kruth game that's just a pretense to get together and scheme/politic that's something else entirely.

I see it as kind of a stepping-off point. Stuff like that builds relationships between PCs and also congregates them in reliable places. If you're an assassin looking to shank one of the regulars who comes to Talia's Wednesday Night Strip Poker, then unbeknownst to Talia, she's helped you along a great deal.

Anything that gathers PCs reliably together or builds relationships between characters is a start, even if it isn't a full-fledged plot unto itself.

When I ran Salarr's Expansion Division a few years ago, we had a reliable knot of players who grouped together for what I OOCly called Sunday Night Hunts. We'd usually get together around 7-8pm on Sunday and strike it out to a new part of the world every week or couple of weeks. It was just hunting trips, no real "plot" behind them, but gathering PCs together in a consistent way really helped the clan maintain some cohesion and other PCs eventually picked up on it, too. They'd hang around or drop by the wagon on Sunday nights because that's when Salarris were often spotted. Sometimes we'd invite Bynners or Kuracis or whatever along and it became kind of A Thing despite not really being a plot all on its lonesome.

I'm all for anything that gets PCs together and creates patterns that other people can either build on or exploit. Even if it's just a Kruth game, it's a starting point.

[wizturbo]

Yeah, you're being a snob.  Love ya (and you know I do!) but you're being snobby about this.  Not everything needs to be some big, world changing, conflict generating explosion of blood and gore.  Those happen, and they're fun, but they're also fucking exhausting as hell for both players and staff alike. 

An innocuous kruth game that has some random stuff throw at it can create pure fun, without any of stress and work that comes with building a serious long term plot.  It could keep those three players logging in more regularly, and forming friendships or rivalries.  It's good for the game.

[wizturbo]

Fathi's post about creating predictable gatherings also applies.  Good point.

[Delirium]

I mean in terms of it being submitted as a plot.

I'm not asking for everything to be an explosion of blood and gore.. I just don't think your average kruth gathering (note I even said it wasn't a bad thing, just not necessarily "doing anything") constitutes a plot.

You suggested kruth games as something plot-worthy staff could/should support. I ... disagree.

Maybe I would see things differently if this game wasn't such a massive timesink already.

[650Booger]

I'll be the guy who submits an awesome plot, gets it started IG, gets staff involved, then promptly dies

[titansfan]

I like the idea.  Staff came up with the idea so they have prepared themselves for the work load.  This will help me format my plot ideas and look them over myself before submitting them.  I do think it will be hard to do with something like a half-giant, but otherwise this is a low risk, high reward thing for players. 

Thank you, Cayuga and Staff!

[wizturbo]

I just don't think your average kruth gathering (note I even said it wasn't a bad thing, just not necessarily "doing anything") constitutes a plot.

Why does just about every table top RPG campaign start in a tavern?  Because it's a convenient way for dungeon masters to bring all the necessary players together to get something started.  A weekly kruth game can easily serve the same purpose.  But it won't serve that purpose if the staff have no idea it's going to happen.

[Delirium]

I see what you're getting at, but I think we're going to have to agree to disagree, and that we're arguing over semantics.

Games/tavern sitting may build relationships and bring PCs together but they are not in and of themselves plots.

My argument is that I don't want staff to be inundated with "heeeey we're gonna have a kruth game enter me in the raffle' style submissions. Or really, to see an upswing in strip kruth games. My main reservation to these kind of fluff games is that they feel entirely too highschool and childish. They belong in the realm of the nobility and upperclass if they belong in the game at all.

Now if it's a few grizzled mercenaries sitting around playing kruth for a pot of 'sid over smokes and drinks, that's a lot more thematic and I can swing with that.

Even so, I wouldn't call that "a plot". That's a precursor or a buildup to a plot, by fostering relationships and interaction.

I don't want people thinking that just sitting around and interacting with someone is an actual plot. It can be super interesting and fun and done very well but unless it's actually moving a storyline forward it's not a plot. It's just describing, in occasionally overly detailed form, a scenario/setting/relationships between people.

Okay I'm putting way too much effort into trying to explain this.

[Fathi]

I'm happy to leave that judgment ball bouncing in the staff's court.

I'm sure it'll be pretty obvious from their end if someone is submitting every little thing their character does into the raffle ("had a beer with sarge" "talked to a Templar in the jails" "foraged some rocks" "played cards with Kurac" etc) or if someone is just somehow super confused as to what a plot even is. And if that's the case they can reply to correct course or just tell the player in question to chill.

As-is, if this somehow increases staff workload in a terrible way and inundates them with meaningless requests about meaningless crap, I'll trust them to let us know or establish clearer guidelines if they're necessary.

[Feco]

I'll be the guy who submits an awesome plot, gets it started IG, gets staff involved, then promptly dies

Story of my life, right here.

[wizturbo]

Picture it this way.  Let's say your plot is a recurring kruth card game that you and 2 other PC's are going to have on Weds nights.   You hold the game at the Salarri estate, as one of the PC's involved in a Salarri. 

Jesus Christ ©  Bad joke dies a bloody death...

Reading comprehension is bad today. 

No I'm not suggesting you submit every thing your character does with other people.  A recurring weekly 3+ person event is hardly that. 

Second, no,  I'm not talking about the Webster dictionary definition of 'plot', I'm using the language that Cayuga made in the original post about this raffle. 

"A plot is something that brings two or more characters beyond your own into the fold.  This can be a personal plot, a political plot, a party plot, really, any sort of plot." 

Under that definition, which was defined literally in the first sentence of Cayuga's post, I think a game of 3 people playing Kruth on a regular basis definitely qualifies. 

I love you guys, but omg, please read better.

And lastly, for those who didn't read the rest of Cayuga's post...  The raffle already accounts for small vs. large plots.  A kruth game is worth 1 point on the scale, or 1/3rd the value of a large scale plot.  Also, if you win with a 1 point plot, you don't win nearly as much as if you had a 3 point plot....

[Delirium]

Clearly I need to express myself better or people need to apply that reading comprehension to my posts as well.

I should probably use more emojis? 

Let's be clear.

I have never once said I disliked the intention of the idea.

I have reservations about some parts of the implementation:

• the blurriness of what constitutes a worthy plot
• the receipt IC-visible rewards for an OOC construct that are not attainable by any other means.

The first bullet point is ultimately in staff's court to solve.

The second bullet point is solvable by letting someone burn a custom craft submission on having a custom scar/tattoo. That way, winning the raffle is not the only way to possess one (and therefore be instantly marked IG as a raffle-winner).