Elves: The Thread

[Lizzie]

This is made worse by the 'rinth having a death squad of a few half-giants guarding its entrance. How that doesn't devolve into three stooge level stupidity is beyond me.

I thought that was deemed a bug, and they were removed? Did they get replaced at some point?

I haven't seen any in the past few days.

ONCE IN AWHILE soldiers will gang up on, and chase crim-coded criminals to the entry(ies) of the rinth. Then, they'll stop since they're out of their zone. They stay there until/unless they have some reason to move (such as - chasing a criminal from the spot they're stuck in, to somewhere NOT in the rinth), or until game reset. So sometimes you'll see a few HG soldiers stuck at the entry. But it's only because someone got chased there. They don't normally hang out there.

[Patuk]

This is made worse by the 'rinth having a death squad of a few half-giants guarding its entrance. How that doesn't devolve into three stooge level stupidity is beyond me.

I thought that was deemed a bug, and they were removed? Did they get replaced at some point?

I haven't seen any in the past few days.

ONCE IN AWHILE soldiers will gang up on, and chase crim-coded criminals to the entry(ies) of the rinth. Then, they'll stop since they're out of their zone. They stay there until/unless they have some reason to move (such as - chasing a criminal from the spot they're stuck in, to somewhere NOT in the rinth), or until game reset. So sometimes you'll see a few HG soldiers stuck at the entry. But it's only because someone got chased there. They don't normally hang out there.

Ooh, this is a good point. I went and checked; no half-giants over there, now. Awesome.

Still.. This does mean that one person running to the 'rinth will make going there for anyone who's wanted a deathtrap. Has anyone ever tried wishing up for them to move away?

[yousuff]

This is made worse by the 'rinth having a death squad of a few half-giants guarding its entrance. How that doesn't devolve into three stooge level stupidity is beyond me.

I thought that was deemed a bug, and they were removed? Did they get replaced at some point?

The fact there were about 12 of them was deemed a bug. There is supposed to be 3. Which is still a deathsquad.

[Delirium]

I mean, one half-giant is a death squad. I don't know about the NPCs, but I've seen PC half-giants do terrifying things.

[yousuff]

I mean, one half-giant is a death squad. I don't know about the NPCs, but I've seen PC half-giants do terrifying things.

Going off on a tangent, but NPC half giant soldiers should be confined strictly to the main city gates, and the entrance to the noble's quarter. They suck the fun out of crime, because once you're wanted, they basically become instakill rooms.

Anyway I've nothing more to contribute to the actual topic so I'll leave it at that

[Dar]

I always found running in the cities to be stupid. Try to go to downtown of whatever city you're in  and run. It doesnt matter if you get tired, or not, you'll be ping ponging from one person of the crowd to another.  I'd much prefer Celves be able to parkour the rooftops Ie ... cliiiiiimb.

We're riding giant bugs around slaying shelled beasts with glass swords and fireballs, and this dude is over here worrying about how realistic it is to run in a crowd.

Yes, I am worried about that. I'm also worried about people entering shops mounted, or racing full speed through the crowds on an inix without really spending a moment to think how exactly that would look like.  This isn't about realism versus fantasy. It's about acknowledging virtual aspects of every day zalanthan life.

[Dar]

Returning to the topic.


What do you mean insta kill rooms? I mean they're trying to arrest you. If you dont resist, they dont kill you.

None of them have scan either, so the moment you have a passable amount of sneak/hide, the whole concept of crime code becomes ... something a lot less scary.  Admittedly if you're playing a merchant, or warrior celf, you wont have sneak/hide, but ... well. Umh. You really should.

Only reason why I dont think giving sneak/hide to celves as a racial skill to be a good idea, is because most elves get it from their main subguild anyway. Simply due to the nature of their shifty dishonest selves.

[Patuk]

What do you mean insta kill rooms? I mean they're trying to arrest you. If you dont resist, they dont kill you.

[little chicken woman]

The thing about that--- if you're an independent human and you get caught stealing, and you get sent to jail, and god forbid -pcs- come to see you, they're not going to let you off easy. They'll terrify you, maybe cut off a finger, or threaten to do so if you get caught again (something career criminals will then have to worry about: my whole hand got threatened once) they'll try to way Salaari or Kadian people if you stole from those shops, they'll beat you up. They're not disinterested career politicians looking to get power in a dictatorship, they're thugs looking for people to track and spy on and beat up in jails so that they don't commit crimes again. The total powerlessness of most people sent to jail solidifies this relationship. The only reason witches get off for accidentally casting a harmful weave on themselves is because the player behind the keyboard did not actually want to cause harm and the Templars know that and are aware they may be killing off a special app for an OOC mistake.

Now what if you were an elf instead?

Even expert pickpockets will occasionally fail, especially if they rely on stealing as their sole source of income, which some elves will do.

So you know--- an elf who gets sent to jail is an elf who will probably either die in the cell or get killed a few days later just to give the Arm's newest assassin some work. Its just a damn elf, no one will miss it. What tribe? Elves don't have -real- tribes that can come after the assassin and make them disappear. Private Amos's spice addiction isn't going to come out of the closet as a nasty rumor because his tribe supplied him.

That is my take on it, anyway. I could be wrong, and I don't have more than maybe five short-lived characters' experience playing a criminal.

[Beethoven]

The docs also suggest that if you are a non-citizen, you will be dealt with far more unforgivingly.

[little chicken woman]

Don't linger at the gates when they let you go, either. The soldiers could come up and take your money.

[Patuk]

The docs also suggest that if you are a non-citizen, you will be dealt with far more unforgivingly.

Well, technically, celves are all citizens just fine. Despite that, I'll take my chances as a jailed tribal/stormer over even a southside celf anyday.

[Beethoven]

I'm not arguing about c-elves being citizens. I'm just suggesting a possible reason why some people might get randomly ganked and other people might get taken to jail.

[RogueGunslinger]

I've never run into an issue with being murdered by crim-code, so am mostly on the side of "Don't resist". In fact I've made escapes before that were kind of silly even after resisting. But apparently you can still be murdered in certain situations(unless people are just complaining about something that happened years ago?), and I think those situations should be made known.

Crimcode is very binary. There's too many giants, Templars and soldiers. I would be cool with just being beat down and knocked out in the street over risking the eye of the templarate at times, as outing yourself as a sneak can be very bad for your character.

[Patuk]

It's not the NPCs you should be scared of. Barring the interplay between nosave subdue and nosave arrest occasionally being stupid, the NPCs geeeeenerally won't kill you, though even there accidents happen. It's the PC soldiers you'll end up dealing with that are scary.

[yousuff]

I'm not arguing about c-elves being citizens. I'm just suggesting a possible reason why some people might get randomly ganked and other people might get taken to jail.

I'm talking about being ganked by halfgiant soldiers. The issue is that against normal human soldiers you stand a fighting chance if you do want to resist arrest, but with a load of half giants that simply is not an option. It limits crime roleplay because it means a load of ubermobs can get sicced on you at a moment's notice and the only choice you have is to surrender. Sure, about surrendering to overwhelming odds (several soldiers surround you), but it's not fair to have something so vastly overpowered confront you, because no matter what level you're at it's an absolutely enormous threat. As well as the fact that giants, which as per the docs are meant to be a scarce resource are almost as abundant as normal human soldiers.