What Do You Need to Have?

[Cind]

I always need the listen skill to some degree. Its so fun overhearing shit.

I always need a way to be an independent and to make a living without the assistance of others, whether I end up in a clan or not, because you never know.

[BadSkeelz]

Parry.

Docs to be inspired and motivated by, without being forced into a script.

[TheWanderer]

A southern accent.

[Malken]

RL time. A lot of it.

[Kismetic]

Invariably?  Direction sense.  I've played with and without it, and I always prefer having it.  I also tend to play characters with high strength, not necessarily because I like to hit like a truck, but so I can carry a lot of stuff around.

[whitt]

Some crafting skill.  Like ANY thing to fill down time with.

[Barzalene]

People to play with.

[HavokBlue]

Climb. I always regret not taking fucking climb.

[Semper]

The Right People to play with.

=)

[Kismetic]

Climb. I always regret not taking fucking climb.

So true.

The Right People to play with.

=)

Elitist!!!

[Jihelu]

Forage food.
Don't act like it isn't the best skill ever.
You just wait until you are stranded!

[Kismetic]

Forage food.
Don't act like it isn't the best skill ever.
You just wait until you are stranded!

The percentage of characters I've had that combine either Ranger or Scavenger is more than half, I think.  I'm inclined to agree with most of these posts.

Skills
All the stuff    (yessir)

[Refugee]

The potential to ride with my hands full.  I hate that thing were you forget to put away a weapon and get left behind.

[Cind]

I need something coded to do for downtime as well. A mastercraft, or a skill to work on, or something to make or do.

[Harmless]

Direction sense is an interesting one. If I don't have it, it usually means I am absolutely trying to restrict myself to city RP, or near-city activities. Though inevitably, I am GIVEN A QUEST to go to a ridiculously stormy area and find a thing, or to escort someone through the shittest weather imaginible. And dat pressure to give in to those requests means that I end up regretting the FUCK out of not having it.

So I usually try to get it too.

An example would be like a rinthi I made. Didn't have direction sense. Before long, "HELP US SMUGGLE SPICE IN FROM RED STORM." Died on the first trip taken to a beetle while stumbling about.

[RogueGunslinger]

Depends on the character type, not sure if I have something that sticks out across all characters.

My Rinthers must have climb. And unless I'm a warrior or a half-giant they must have sneak/hide

My Hunters/frequent travellers must have direction sense.

All my warriors that make trips outside have to have a riding subguild, for dual-wielded riding with riding gloves.

Any sort of character I plan on being good in melee combat has to have parry.



One skill I always seem to miss when I don't have it, and never use it when I have it maxed out: Shield-use.

Skill I'm always envious of other people havng but never use myself when I have it: Barter.


Generally though if I'm playing a ranger I wish I was playing an assassin. If I'm playing an assassin I wish I was playing a warrior. If I'm playing a warrior I wish I was playing a ranger. It's never just one skill I wish I had.

[Jihelu]

Whenever I don't have stealth I wished I had stealth.
Whenever I don't have parry or throw I wish I had parry or throw.

[Inks]

Stealth and climb.

[Quell]

For the longest time I refused to play a character without haggle. The idea of paying full price for something just made my skin crawl.

I've gotten over it though.

[Jeax]

Not having direction sense kills me. Close to direction sense is skinning.

I love having stealth skills.

[MeTekillot]

parry, slashing weapons, bash

[valeria]

Without listen, my life feels incomplete.

[FantasyWriter]

Scan and listen. I will only give them up in exchange for superpowers.

[solera]

Every non combat skill that rangers have/get.

[Dakota]

The awesomeness of the Northern Staffs team to continue into other aspects of the game. (they are/were the A-Team. The Avengers. The Beastie Boys in the Sabotage Video. The Wu-Tang Clan).

A clan of dedicated and staff-supported (officially clanned) antagonists in the vein of RF / Gith / Dune Stalkers / insert any-other-clan-that-filled-this-role-but-was-gradually-phased-out-due-to-actions-or-policy-shift-in-arm.

[Asmoth]

Ranger Quit, though most of the time I hardly ever use it.

[In Dreams]

Mudsex.

[CodeMaster]

Ranger Quit, though most of the time I hardly ever use it.

  But just having something like that can be such a comfort.  Kind of like the "amulet of lifesaving" in nethack.  Absolutely useless... until you need it.  (If you're wearing it and you die, you'll get a free resurrect and the amulet will crumble.)

Climb is also one of those "amulet" skills.

[HavokBlue]

Climb is a skill that should function like piloting, where everyone can develop it.

[FantasyWriter]

Climb is a skill that should function like piloting, where everyone can develop it.

I was told last week by staff that that is no longer the case with piloting.
I believe ride still works like that though.

I also agree with the climb sentiment.

[Talia]

I was told last week by staff that that is no longer the case with piloting.

I think your question was misunderstood. It appears that the staffer who responded thought you were asking if pilot branched from ride. As far as I know, pilot is still "branchable" by anyone, just by trying to do it.

[RogueGunslinger]

Climb is a skill that should function like piloting, where everyone can develop it.

I was told last week by staff that that is no longer the case with piloting.
I believe ride still works like that though.

I also agree with the climb sentiment.

Some peoples, dwarves for instance, should be awful at climbing.

[Saellyn]

Pilot is a skill you gain just by using it, period. EVERYONE can master pilot to my knowledge.

[Harmless]

Some peoples, dwarves for instance, should be awful at climbing.

Disagree that it should be any different as is. Dwarves have reduced agility and agility certainly factors into climb checks, so they are already a bit worse off as is.

Moreover, as a former rock climbing hobbyist I can assure you that short people make excellent climbers. Strong people make excellent climbers. There is a degree of nimbleness that helps, but some of the -best- climbers I saw were 5'1 or shorter. So I don't see where you're able to assert dwarves should be so awful at it, save for maybe blocky fingers (though they are strong as hell, and definitely rough and used to dealing with rocky surfaces).

[HavokBlue]

As a rock climbing hobbyist I will also verify dwarves should be fine.

I have seen 10 year olds scale routes that make me cry.

[Quell]

As a rock climbing hobbyist I will also verify dwarves should be fine.

I have seen 10 year olds scale routes that make me cry.

My niece is four, and she climbs the local rock wall just fine.

[Tuannon]

Dwarves are not short people, they're dwarves..

A dwarf weighs as much as a person two feet taller than them does.. in some cases more. And yes I'm sure a dwarf has a more solid grip than a human.

Comparing children to dwarves is also inaccurate, as children have climbing as a class skill.

[Armaddict]

Some peoples, dwarves for instance, should be awful at climbing.

Disagree that it should be any different as is. Dwarves have reduced agility and agility certainly factors into climb checks, so they are already a bit worse off as is.

Moreover, as a former rock climbing hobbyist I can assure you that short people make excellent climbers. Strong people make excellent climbers. There is a degree of nimbleness that helps, but some of the -best- climbers I saw were 5'1 or shorter. So I don't see where you're able to assert dwarves should be so awful at it, save for maybe blocky fingers (though they are strong as hell, and definitely rough and used to dealing with rocky surfaces).

I think maybe some of the assumption might come from reach.  There are those spaces where the next grip is far away.  Not everyone can do the whole 300 'for sparta' leap to see the oracles on top of the mountain, either.  Tradeoffs and whatnot, but I don't see any reason to penalize them.  Just empathizing with the idea.

[Harmless]

Well reach is a factor. But with enough strength and a center of mass close to your hands and feet you can propel yourself quite well. There are rarely situations where there is only one handhold to go for and its out of reach. Climbing is two dimensional so you can move across until a route shows. Being short is great for such moves because.. Physics.

Just trust me. The best climbers I saw were short and very strong and dense. They made it look easy. They could hold their entire weight with one handhold for minutes. Extra height has penalties such as more centrifugal forces when hanging. It isn't all about reach at all.

And besides, dorfs already have less agi so there's your climb penalty there. For dorfs I guess thats the reduced flexibility. I think that matters far more.

Moreover climbing is highly skill dependent in real life. Natural body shape matters so little. 9/10 untrained novice climbers of any build can't do a 10 point climb on their first try. 9/10 climbers after a few months of training and practice can do a 10 point climb every time with minimal effort if they put their mind to it. The point system I'm referring to is the Yosemite Decimal System (10 point = 5.10a-d) which as you can see is in the low middle range of difficulty. And this is with a harness, climbing shoes, and chalk.

I think climb should be branchable with a low cap of apprentice level to reflect the skill dependent aspect of it. In my own life thats how far I got before I hit a ceiling of skill, not even physical limitations. I basically could do 5.10's but never could do a 5.11 without a LOT of extra focus and concentration. 5.12's were a whole different level for me, I never succeeded at them. If you count slipping and needing the harness to stay on the wall then this is even more true. Only with 5.10's could I climb reliably without mistakes or slips, but 90% of all climbers with <1 yr of experience can do 5.10's fine too. That's how I justify my assertions. I am not an expert though.

[HavokBlue]

It took me about a day to top out all the 5.10s at my local climbing gym. 9 months later, I'm still struggling on 5.12s but I would attribute that to the fact that I have zero upper body strength and as I'm learning just now from my doctor, have lost a dangerous amount of weight due.

Moral of the story is that we should all get climb, at least with a low cap.

[Harmless]

I think it's also fun to add I started rock climbing with a bad fear of heights. I would get a little nauseous, definitely very sweaty, and have other anxiety symptoms at being a certain height off the ground (about 12+ ft and it'd kick in). That was a huge barrier for me, where at the start I had trouble with even 5.5 or 5.6 climbs because of the psychological aspect of it. In other words, i had no climb skill.

But some practice and repeated visits got me to doing 5.6-5.9 really comfortably. Before long I was doing 5.10's comfortably, and then not long after that 5.10's were a breeze, i would basically be climbing up them at about the pace of using a ladder when I was starting to learn the 5.11's.

The point is, that I started without the skill, but through forced repetition (it was uncomfortable) I actually overcame that fear and I "branched" it. Then I hit my ceiling not long after and that's where I am now, but I still enjoy bouldering and stuff, and I haven't had any fear of heights since then (not counting extremes I haven't run into).

So yeah,

Moral of the story is that we should all get climb, at least with a low cap.

this, with the caveat that you'd have to branch it through repeated attempts/failures if you don't start with it naturally, to kind of reflect the whole fear of heights thing, in my opinion.

[RogueGunslinger]

Dwarves are not just short and strong. They're fat, and rotund, and bulky. Comparing them to short stocky humans doesn't really work for me. I was thinking of the average, bigass dwarf with short legs and arms and a hard time raising their hands up to do a jumping-jack motion. I imagine it being very hard fort a dwarf to get close to the wall, due to the bulk in his chest and arms and belly, putting his center of gravity really far out.


Shot humans are LIGHT. Dwarves are heavy as fuck.

[HavokBlue]

I don't think that's really how that works. If a dwarf can't do a jumping jack, he certainly can't be a master warrior either.

[RogueGunslinger]

I said a hard time doing it. And I'm talking about the average dwarf. I'm sure there are skinny, athletic dwarves who'd make badass climbers, I guess. Desert-Dwarves.

The only reason I brought it up is people think anybody should be able to learn to climb.

[nauta]

In response to the title of the thread: And when do you need it?

Also, +1 to mudsex.

[Malken]

Also, +1 to mudsex.

pm me for details

[Tetra]

A soap opera-style character background.

[Zoan]

Also, +1 to mudsex.

pm me for details

RIP ur inbox

[TheWanderer]

oh, yeah, I wanna change mine to mudsex.

I mean, it really should go without saying, doe. You can't play a fulfilling character without at least banging one noble.

Gotta bang 'em all.

[MeTekillot]

How else do you get anything done? fuickong sponsor role staff pet every gdo what they want gotta penis them

[Revenant]

I would honestly like the option to replace my subguild with another guild, at no cgp cost, so I could have two guilds. I know that sounds crazy, but, it'd be interesting.

[Barsook]

You aren't the only one who wants that.

[HavokBlue]

That would uh... be neat, but I don't know why it wouldn't cost CGP.

[Barsook]

Okay, I missed that part.  But still cool idea.

[Jihelu]

Make it cost 2 Karma or whatev and that sounds sexy.

[aeglaeca]

Multiclassing would probably need to cost more (a lot more?) than ext. subguilds, not less, for balance reasons, unless everything got rebalanced. Unless I am mistaken as to ext. subguilds by themselves being less powerful than full guilds skill-list wise.

This is an impossible dream but it would be cool to see classes be a lot more flexible and being able to pick skill trees or something instead of being a static guild that can be sniffed out easily. I haven't even been playing the game that long and I can take a half decent guess at who is what.

[HavokBlue]

If an extended subguild costs 3+ I don't think there's any possibility you would get a full second guild for less than 5.

[Jihelu]

Maybe you could pull a D&D and have it so you can 'activate' your second class after a certain point. In which skills related to that guild can't be leveled ANYMORE AT ALL and the new ones start developing.
That being said, just grind until your first class is good then start your next.


Welp since we don't have levels that idea doesn't work.

[WarriorPoet]

Tor.

I need Tor.

[Nyr]

Tor.

I need Tor.

Granted.

[WarriorPoet]

Don't play with me.

Did I miss an announcement somewhere?

[Nyr]

Don't play with me.

Did I miss an announcement somewhere?

Yes.

[WarriorPoet]

I have been wasting my life.

[MeTekillot]

No scorpions, though.

[Rokal]

Multiclassing would probably need to cost more (a lot more?) than ext. subguilds, not less, for balance reasons, unless everything got rebalanced. Unless I am mistaken as to ext. subguilds by themselves being less powerful than full guilds skill-list wise.

This is an impossible dream but it would be cool to see classes be a lot more flexible and being able to pick skill trees or something instead of being a static guild that can be sniffed out easily. I haven't even been playing the game that long and I can take a half decent guess at who is what.

Got to agree with this. From what i've seen in game a lot of the main guilds are pretty versatile as is.

Allowing them to have a second main guild? its a bit of a stretch.

[WarriorPoet]

No scorpions, though.

YOU RUINED IT FOR ME.

Scorpions.

I need Scorpions.

[Bushranger]

Mundane guild.

I've played a few magickers, one successful as a family man and others less successful, but I always struggle in their headspace dealing with Magick. Mundane guild is totally the way to go for me!

Mercenary sub-guild.

I don't 'need' to have it but it sure is super nice when I do! Probably the most flavourful sub-guild there is.

[LauraMars]

I have been wasting my life.

HOW COULD YOU CHEAT US LIKE THIS

[LauraMars]

I need languages.  I hate not having them.  IT FUCKING SUCKS>

[Jihelu]

I need languages.  I hate not having them.  IT FUCKING SUCKS>

Communicating with the way is the only way to go.
See what I did there?
Ha..ha...god damnit.

[Tuannon]

The Scorpions will never be the same again. At least the ties between Tor and Borsail still exist, although I'm not a fan of Nu-Borsail.

[Revenant]

CHAAAAAAARGE! No-handed riding, d-sense, brew, poison, sneak, hide, climb and...

Parry. 

[Revenant]

You can't tell me it wouldn't be the shit to be ranger/warrior, ranger/assassin, nilazi/ranger, vivaduan/merchant or warrior/merchant... ranger/merchant...

Oh crap, duel elementalist. Nilazi/viv, opens a tavern that's wildly successful because ICE CUBES.

[Armaddict]

You can't tell me it wouldn't be the shit to be ranger/warrior, ranger/assassin, nilazi/ranger, vivaduan/merchant or warrior/merchant... ranger/merchant...

Oh crap, duel elementalist. Nilazi/viv, opens a tavern that's wildly successful because ICE CUBES.

Ice cubes of -death-.  It's a nilazi.  The patronage wouldn't last long.

[palomar]

You can't tell me it wouldn't be the shit to be ranger/warrior, ranger/assassin, nilazi/ranger, vivaduan/merchant or warrior/merchant... ranger/merchant...

Oh crap, duel elementalist. Nilazi/viv, opens a tavern that's wildly successful because ICE CUBES.

Ice cubes of -death-.  It's a nilazi.  The patronage wouldn't last long.

Or they'd last forever...

[Revenant]

You can't tell me it wouldn't be the shit to be ranger/warrior, ranger/assassin, nilazi/ranger, vivaduan/merchant or warrior/merchant... ranger/merchant...

Oh crap, duel elementalist. Nilazi/viv, opens a tavern that's wildly successful because ICE CUBES.

Ice cubes of -death-.  It's a nilazi.  The patronage wouldn't last long.

Damnit, Palomar beat me to it.