Mythology/Religion

[aeglaeca]

Certain entities are sometimes mentioned ICly (Whira and that other guy in regard to sandstorms, Drov as opposed to hell, etc.) but there isn't much of an explanation on the website as to who those guys are, or, at least not that I'm seeing. Are they essentially demigods? Are there known origin stories for them?

Is there any impact on day-to-day life as far as religious affiliation goes? Is there a 'devout' subset of the population per population type (Nak, Tuluk, delves, etc.) that goes through this and that ritual, observes holidays or anything? Do parents tell their kids stories about how Drov will come to eat you if you're bad, or whatever?

[MeTekillot]

Those are the names of the Elements. Type 'help magick element' in game.

[bcw81]

http://www.armageddonmud.org/help/view/magick%20element

That might be what you're looking for.

The use IC is more than not just slang that players created over the years.

[aeglaeca]

Oh, gotcha. Thanks

[BadSkeelz]

The "Nomad Roleplay" doc ask that you describe the Spirituality of your tribe, including gods.

http://www.armageddon.org/help/view/Nomad%20Roleplay

Which to me implies that there may be tribes out there that have spiritual entities other than the embodiments of the Elements.

[James de Monet]

In terms of the city-states, you are far more likely to see rituals and beliefs tied to the sorcerer-kings than to the elements.  In Nak, they do have "temples" devoted to the elements, but they are more like schools than centers of worship.  In all likelihood, any sign of outward worship of the elements that came at the preclusion of devotion to the respective kings would probably be punishable as heresy.

[HavokBlue]

The help files do refer to the magick moods like Echri, Inrof, Hurz and the like as psychic constructs or demispirits.

I think they also refer to  the spheres as elemental deities or djinn.

[Lizzie]

I don't know if it's IC lore, because I don't know if any books survived past the innumerable crashes since they might have been written - but there is/was lore about certain things that still exist in the game, whose history involves dieties.

I wish I could be sincere in saying find out iC but I honestly don't know if the IC information still exists IC. The docs were password-protected on the old website for clan members only, so I imagine those docs are long gone unless some staffer preserved them for prosperity.

[Erythil]

The state religion of the cities is the divinity cult of their rulers.  Allanak's white order of templar basically function as priests and you can see some ceremonies taking place in the city via npc scripts.

Tribes can have pretty much any gods you want, and the predefined clans have predefined beliefs.

The elements are often personified in a sort of folk belief, but this isn't really strongly defined.  Individual elemental spirits may be revered and supplicated and some of them might even answer as these spirits are real entities.

The impression I get is that traditional religions once existed in forms more recognizable to us in the real world, but have since been heavily suppressed to the point of extinction.

[Jihelu]

Remember kids.
Mentioning Whira/Drov/etc as sentient gods is kind of weird and templars/other people will think you are probably some dirt heretic unless being metaphorical.
I guess if you are a tribal or some shit it's k though.

[Barzalene]

Remember kids.
Mentioning Whira/Drov/etc as sentient gods is kind of weird and templars/other people will think you are probably some dirt heretic unless being metaphorical.
I guess if you are a tribal or some shit it's k though.

I'm not certain this is right.

[Jihelu]

Remember kids.
Mentioning Whira/Drov/etc as sentient gods is kind of weird and templars/other people will think you are probably some dirt heretic unless being metaphorical.
I guess if you are a tribal or some shit it's k though.

I'm not certain this is right.

It probably isn't but thats always what I would assume.

[Riev]

Except that Whira truly IS a bitch. I think Whira is kind of the only construct to have a male/female determination or any sort of personalization. Even a "Ruk take you" is still more of a "I hope the ground swallows you up". But Whira's Luck determines her to be a fickle mistress (perhaps because we often think of "lady luck"?)

[James de Monet]

I dunno. I think you can get away with fairly frequent mention of Whira or Krath or Drov.

The others you don't hear very much outside of gicker circles.

Again, though, there's a difference between saying "baby needs a new pair of shoes" and setting a giant pile of aces on fire while playing Russian roulette as an offering to Lady Luck. It's a question of intent and intensity.

[Jihelu]

I've always liked the idea of the phrase "Whira wills it" as the sort of "WELL SHIT I DON'T KNOW MAYBE THE WIND LIKES IT/LUCK" Sort of thing.
Though it doesn't work for most things, which is when I think the weird 'minor heresy hippy' thing starts showing up.

And if it goes too far you have the druid problem I suppose.

[HavokBlue]

You will probably not get Templar dunked for using personifications of Whira/Ruk/Drov/Krath/Viv in offhand conversation.

If you started trying to worship or glorify them, or went around talking about how you survived that scrab attack because Grol the Protector was watching out for you, expect trouble.

[Marauder Moe]

"Heresy" isn't really a thing in Zalanthas.  That's a Judeo-Christian concept, born out of novel the tenet that there is only one God and no others actually even exist.

Tek's templars don't preach that Muk Utep doesn't exists, or that he's not powerful; these things are undeniable.  Just that he's the enemy.  Likewise, the elemental forces are real, and they do[i/] influence the world on both a natural/superstitious level and overtly supernatural (magick) levels.  It's not heresy to invoke the name of an element.  (In Tuluk it's a gray area whether or not the elements are "enemies", but not heresy to admit they exist.)

[Beethoven]

Worshipers of the god-kings are not monotheists but monolatrists. I think the concept of heresy can still exist within a monolatrous system. I don't see a problem with borrowing words or concepts from Judeo-Christian history when it is appropriate, especially from the more oppressive side of things, since that's the feel we're trying to hammer in.

[Marauder Moe]

That's a good word.

So yeah, I guess you could have a heresy, but it would be like... if someone started preaching that Tek is a halfbreed or a defiler.  That would be heresy.

But templars/believers of the other god-king are not heretics.  Elementalists are not (necessarily) heretics.  People praising Whira for gambling wins are not heretics.

[Beethoven]

I think that if it is contrary to "correct doctrine" (aka "orthodoxy") then it would be considered a heresy, so yeah, those things would be heretical, but smaller things might also be declared heresies, too. (Like saying something weird like there's a secret teaching that Tektolnes is actually Quintus' father, etc.) The question would be whether or not the Templarate would bother making official declarations about the smaller stuff. Probably only if it got to be widespread for some reason.

[Beethoven]

And I agree with you; believers in the opposing God-King are not heretics. They are followers of a completely different religion.

[BadSkeelz]

The proper term is "Heathens"

[valeria]

If you're a southerner using heretic in the sense of one who dissents from established belief or doctrine/nonconformist, where your established belief in your locale is that Tek is the most powerful god king, not that poser Muk Utep, I think you're probably fine.

[Marauder Moe]

Heathens may be technically correct by some definitions, but the historic Christian usage had strong overtones of blatant superiority.

To be honest as players, and probably deep down honest as characters, Tektolnes and Muk Utep are on fairly even footing.  (I'm also not really a fan of "barbarians" as a term applying to opposite city-states either.)


Also, we really have a lot of great, flavorful, Arm-specific language with varying shades of derogatederogation (yay I learned a second new word today!) to describe the city-states and their denizens.  Let's favor those instead.

[Beethoven]

Wait, we're not allowed to use condescending language to attempt to present ourselves as superior to the enemy now? Perish the thought, HEATHEN!