Pre-Mudsex Dirty Talk

[Desertman]

Armageddon is a text-based game where what is read as an emote and what is read as 'dialogue' both appear the same outside of some minor formatting concerns.

If actions and words are interchangeable in the game medium then it's arguable that when words are indistinguishable from actions then the same rules should apply to both.

This depends heavily on context. As a rule of thumb I'd say the two become indistinguishable when instead of summarising/discussing/alluding to the act in question you are describing the acts themselves in a direct or mechanical way.

So, if you may as well be emoting - then yes, I'd say you should ask consent.

If the new guideline is, "If you would have to ask for consent to emote it, you should ask for consent to say it.", we just opened a new can of worms.

For example, I would have asked for consent every time to emote:

The tall, muscular man gropes your breasts roughly, flicking the nipples before sucking on them with vigor.

Now I have to ask for consent to say:

"I groped her breasts roughly, flicked that gals nipples, then sucked on'm with the vigor of a chalton calf!".

.......lol wut?

[Harmless]

Nobody replied to my question about sexy ldescs and my sexy pic was censored.

If you consent to being awesome then PM me for the image that was modded.

There was no penus in that pic btw so nsfw = not safe for wisconsin i guess

[Lizzie]

Armageddon is a text-based game where what is read as an emote and what is read as 'dialogue' both appear the same outside of some minor formatting concerns.

If actions and words are interchangeable in the game medium then it's arguable that when words are indistinguishable from actions then the same rules should apply to both.

This depends heavily on context. As a rule of thumb I'd say the two become indistinguishable when instead of summarising/discussing/alluding to the act in question you are describing the acts themselves in a direct or mechanical way.

So, if you may as well be emoting - then yes, I'd say you should ask consent.

If the new guideline is, "If you would have to ask for consent to emote it, you should ask for consent to say it.", we just opened a new can of worms.

For example, I would have asked for consent every time to emote:

The tall, muscular man gropes your breasts roughly, flicking the nipples before sucking on them with vigor.

Now I have to ask for consent to say:

"I groped her breasts roughly, flicked that gals nipples, then sucked on'm with the vigor of a chalton calf!".

.......lol wut?

No, Rathustra is saying you should ask consent for:

"I will grope your breasts roughly, flicking your nipples, then I will suck on them with vigor."

Also, I'm saying that rather than put yourself into a situation where consent isn't a definite yes or no, you might use your "description of what I did to someone else, that I'm telling a third party" rather than the less humorous, more "steamy" version. One constitutes humorous narrative. The other implies explicit erotica.

Honestly Dman, you're nitpicking and being pedantic. Anyone who is seriously not understanding the difference should do a google search on "erotica" and "third-person narrative" and just accept that if your text falls out of the fun-fade category and into the "erotica" category, they should either lighten it up, or accept that someone might complain if you don't ask for consent.

If you want to avoid the complaint - whether deserved or not - then pick a less erotic implementation, and something closer to your idea of the narrative. As I said, I personally found it humorous though others might not - but it's LESS LIKELY to garner complaint than if you went full-on erotica.

[Desertman]

I think I'll just play the same way I have for going on 20 years and see how that goes for me.

I think Rath was saying exactly what I said he was saying. I guess that is the problem when you have rules of thumb and guidelines that are open to interpretation and not just rules.

[Norcal]

Once again, use common sense. The less restraint you show from within, the more must be added from without.

"Men are qualified for civil liberty in exact proportion to their disposition to put moral chains upon their own appetites...in proportion as they are more disposed to listen to the counsels of the wise and good, in preference to the flattery of knaves. Society cannot exist, unless a controlling power upon will and appetite be placed somewhere; and the less of it there is within, the more there must be without. It is ordained in the eternal constitution of things, that men of intemperate minds cannot be free. Their passions forge their fetters."
Edmund Burke

[Nergal]

I think I'll just play the same way I have for going on 20 years and see how that goes for me.

I think Rath was saying exactly what I said he was saying. I guess that is the problem when you have rules of thumb and guidelines that are open to interpretation and not just rules.

But we have rules.

If you choose to roleplay adult situations, that is fine. However, before instigating such an act with another player, you need to OOC to make sure that the role play is consented to, in each scene it happens.

"Instigating such an act" would be a sexual act. Bragging to Amos that your PC did something to Tressy is fine without consent because Amos isn't being interacted with sexually. A "phone sex" sort of format to the says or psis to Tressy would be pushing it across the line of needing consent. Sexual emotes with Tressy clearly need consent.

If you want a list of specific situations where consent is required or not, well, that's not going to happen, because the possibilities are too numerous.

The distinguishing factor when asking for consent is: is/are the player(s) I'm interacting with the subject of my adult RP or not?

[Harmless]

cool, so i can be fellated in a bar all I damn please, especially if I'm not throwing too many emotes out, because no player is being subjected to the emotes directly. If someone who doesn't consent to seeing my shit shows up (boo) then they should OOC that they'd like me to tone it down then I can, of course

good to know. let the public fellating begin

[Rathustra]

I'd advise everyone to play how they've been playing for 15 years 20 years and we'll deal with any problems as they arise as adults.

[Rathustra]

cool, so i can be fellated in a bar all I damn please, especially if I'm not throwing too many emotes out, because no player is being subjected to the emotes directly. If someone who doesn't consent to seeing my shit shows up (boo) then they should OOC that they'd like me to tone it down then I can, of course

good to know. let the public fellating begin

Isn't this how the rules are read anyway? If you consent to mudsex in a back alley and someone turns up then surely this has always been the case? If you're somehow slightly out of phase of reality and in the middle of the gaj mudsexing - as long as you and the other ensign who was in the transporter accident with you is ok with it (through use of consent) then everyone who can perceive the mudsex has consented and bam, it's fine.

[Desertman]

I'd advise everyone to play how they've been playing for 15 years 20 years 17 years and we'll deal with any problems as they arise as adults.

Roger that.

[Rathustra]

I'd advise everyone to play how they've been playing for 15 years 20 years 17 years and we'll deal with any problems as they arise as adults.

Roger that.

To put a positive spin on what was perhaps an unfair play on my part - the 'we' who will be dealing with these problems is everyone. When we get a complaint we don't just read the log we're provided with by the accuser - we check our records, consider related reports and requests and try to get a better idea about what exactly happened. Hopefully the next step after that is contacting the person being accused and ask for clarification, or outline what rule we feel has been broken and ask for an explanation.

[Desertman]

I'd advise everyone to play how they've been playing for 15 years 20 years 17 years and we'll deal with any problems as they arise as adults.

Roger that.

To put a positive spin on what was perhaps an unfair play on my part - the 'we' who will be dealing with these problems is everyone. When we get a complaint we don't just read the log we're provided with by the accuser - we check our records, consider related reports and requests and try to get a better idea about what exactly happened. Hopefully the next step after that is contacting the person being accused and ask for clarification, or outline what rule we feel has been broken and ask for an explanation.

Yar yar. I'm not trying to be a poo poo head. I don't actually think staff would get bent out of shape over my example above if you saw it in a player complaint.

My concern is you guys will end up with fifty player complaints for silly things like that because the playerbase is going to have a bit more of a wide ranging ability to interpret that guideline within their own sensitivities.

[Fujikoma]

I'd advise everyone to play how they've been playing for 15 years 20 years 17 years and we'll deal with any problems as they arise as adults.

Roger that.

To put a positive spin on what was perhaps an unfair play on my part - the 'we' who will be dealing with these problems is everyone. When we get a complaint we don't just read the log we're provided with by the accuser - we check our records, consider related reports and requests and try to get a better idea about what exactly happened. Hopefully the next step after that is contacting the person being accused and ask for clarification, or outline what rule we feel has been broken and ask for an explanation.

Yar yar. I'm not trying to be a poo poo head. I don't actually think staff would get bent out of shape over my example above if you saw it in a player complaint.

My concern is you guys will end up with fifty player complaints for silly things like that because the playerbase is going to have a bit more of a wide ranging ability to interpret that guideline within their own sensitivities.

qfmft

[Nergal]

For what it's worth, player complaints make up about 1.5% of all requests in the request tool, which goes back to 2006. To put it in perspective, there are 5 times more player kudos requests than there are player complaints.

For the average player, the judgment of other players should not an overbearing concern, because 99.9% of the time, players are following the rules and bringing their best abilities to the table. Staff often catch complaint-worthy behavior before players do though, so that's something to consider.

[Harmless]

cool. i feel like now that the admins have weighed in that I have no lingering concerns about the OP. thanks staff!

[Fujikoma]

cool. i feel like now that the admins have weighed in that I have no lingering concerns about the OP. thanks staff!

Yeah, so hush! *attempts to slap you violently* stop dodging! Christ, at least let one go through before I start power-emoting!

Yep! Seems pretty well spelled out to me. Ask consent for dirty talk if you don't feel like being a turd. Being a large, brown puddle of waste myself, I only ask for consent during sexy things that actually happen. I will NOT ask consent every time I tell a dirty joke. As annoying as I found the whole concept, I felt the debate really brought a lot out into the open, not that it really needs to be discussed, but awareness, I think, is really important. While I will not be altering my playstyle, some might, which, does, uh, something?

Also, for the record, corpses are objects. Fun!