In Game Time

[Malken]

I wince at the use of barrier to dodge chores because you're essentially using an IC tool to convince someone you're OOCly unavailable.

I re-read that a few time and I'm not sure I understand.. What's wrong with using barrier to convince someone ICly that you aren't around or available? I mean, if you don't get someone's mind, you know OOCly that they are probably not logged on, but what about it ICly? What happens if you don't find someone's mind ICly? Are they automatically barrier'ed up? Asleep? Dead?

So technically if you aren't doing what you're supposed to be doing schedule-wise then you are either ICly asleep or dead, which is both a bad thing.. So one has to assume that if you aren't doing your job or following your schedule, then you are OOCly logged out, because ICly, if you aren't present, you are automatically slacking off (again, if you aren't present, then you are assumed, ICly, to be either dead or asleep, whether you are barrier'ed up or not, you're fucking up).



Ouch, now my mind hurts..

[Delirium]

If they can't find your mind (while you are logged in) it could be due to any number of factors, up to and including the simple vagaries of the Way, but you are still available to roleplay and are not considered a part of the "virtual backdrop" - if you are not seen in the training hall it is because you are actually not IN the training hall.

If they can't find your mind (while you are logged out) you are part of the virtual crowd and could very well be in that training hall at that moment. But the player behind the Sergeant/Authority figure has no way of telling the difference between you being training like a good boy virtually, or schlepping off to bang your half-breed lover codedly.

It's a grey area and I can see arguments for both sides, which is why I don't necessary condone it, but I don't necessarily love it either.

[Saellyn]

not my fault barrier is mastered and i snuck out to bang that nobles aide am i right?

[Malken]

not my fault barrier is mastered and i snuck out to bang that nobles aide am i right?

Yeah but you can't really explain why you aren't in the building ICly, since if someone is looking for you and can't find your mind they must assume that you are either dead or asleep somewhere, or passed out.. Which all mean, ICly, that you aren't present doing the job or following your schedule that you are supposed to!

Thanks a lot Delirium, this is just like thinking about what was before nothing and how the galaxy was formed if there was nothing before something

[RogueGunslinger]

This is one of those weird ares of arm that everyone just sort of ignores in-game because it's not easy to explain. You can't exactly log in one day, and tell everyone ICly that you were around last week on the day you didn't log in. They didn't see you and couldn't interact with you, how could you have been there?

[Desertman]

I get what Delirium is saying, if you are using barrier to make them not look for you and you are online....you are basically trying to fool them into thinking you aren't online.

The only reason you don't get crap about not being where you are supposed to be is because they OOC'ly are being OOC'ly considerate of your feelings and the fact not everyone can be online 100% of the time.

It is basically taking advantage of an OOC consideration on an IC level.

Then again, how else are you supposed to dodge the fact we all have instant access messenger systems in our brains that work without fail across the entire world.

Another thing to go into the "Changes for The Way" thread I think. For now, there isn't much else you can do.

[TheWanderer]

i have my barrier up for two reasons

ONE: i don't like listening to the voices in my head.

TWO: 'cause fuck you, that's why.

[nauta]

i have my barrier up for two reasons

ONE: i don't like listening to the voices in my head.

TWO: 'cause fuck you, that's why.

I wish you could barrier individuals and not everyone.  A whitelist for the mistresses and a blacklist for the bosses.

[slvrmoontiger]

Just because you have barrier up and are not reachable, people shouldn't automatically assume you aren't logged in. That's mixing IC with OOC and that's not correct. If my PC can't reach another PC then it's simply for some reason my PC can't reach the other PC. This doesn't automatically mean that the other PC isn't logged in and I never assume that because that's OOC and it doesn't matter to my PC.

[CodeMaster]

Just because you have barrier up and are not reachable, people shouldn't automatically assume you aren't logged in. That's mixing IC with OOC and that's not correct. If my PC can't reach another PC then it's simply for some reason my PC can't reach the other PC. This doesn't automatically mean that the other PC isn't logged in and I never assume that because that's OOC and it doesn't matter to my PC.

There's no choice but to mix up IC and OOC in this situation.

There are only a couple of coded reasons someone might not be reachable: (a) they have a barrier up, (b) they are frickin dead.  To deal with the "that PC's player is offline" case, it's up to us, OOC, to make up a plausible IC excuse.

Remedies?

It would be cool if you could send Way messages to people who were offline.  They'll get them when they come online (unless they are dead, and you're just sending messages to an afterimage).

[edit: UNLESS they put up a barrier.  If they have a barrier AND they are offline, then you get the normal fail message.  Then you can tell, ICly, that this person was using a barrier, as opposed to wasn't just logging in]


Alternatively, it might be interesting if the Way truly was fickle in a coded way.  Like you and your target had to be in mutually compatible rooms to be able to reach other (both in rooms with odd-numbered identifiers, as a really simple example).

[nauta]

Just because you have barrier up and are not reachable, people shouldn't automatically assume you aren't logged in. That's mixing IC with OOC and that's not correct. If my PC can't reach another PC then it's simply for some reason my PC can't reach the other PC. This doesn't automatically mean that the other PC isn't logged in and I never assume that because that's OOC and it doesn't matter to my PC.

Has this ever been discussed?

1. Have way respond differently

(a) when you reach out to the mind of someone dead, e.g.:

That mind feels real dead, sorry.

(b) when the person is far away, e.g.:

That mind feels pretty far away.

(c) when the person is asleep / barried / chilling in those no-way zones, e.g.:

That mind feels asleep, or at least something is blocking it.

(d) when you fail because you suck at the way, e.g.:

That mind might be there but you stink.

(e) when someone is offline, e.g.:

That mind might be asleep or far away, but OOCly it feels like it is offline.  

I know right now it does (c) only, and (e) might be silly, but (a) could really be handy when you aren't sure if they are just not logging in or dead/stored.  This happens a lot and (i) it sucks since you can't really mourn for the dead since you don't know they are dead dead until much much later and (ii)  clans already get around this with the roll-call thing.
(Maybe have it come around after a month or something to leave the mystery.)  And with the current climate of secrecy about these things (maybe that's a permanent thing) it honestly is a bummer to never know if someone died or just stopped playing.

2. Also, related, sometimes I reach out to someone and I get: "That mind is too foreign to you"  (or something weird like that) rather than "you are unable to reach their mind" when the PC is offline.  What's up with that?

[Talia]

This thread is skirting the line of IC information and may already have gone over. Please be careful.