Warrior Skill: Bull Rush

[musashi]

Yeah that's not how charge works. But yeah I think the abuse implications and virtual world factors make it a bad idea to implement.

My advice, if you wanna bull rush someone from 2 rooms away as a warrior, use this:

Code Select Expand


> run
> e
> e
> bash amos


[Fredd]

I don't think that's how charge works, Fredd.

I may have only read the first sentence, and thought it was like 5 others similar.

You caught me. I must be getting old in this game.

[lordcooper]

This would reduce roleplay opportunities.  Dude walks into room and confronts you, scene develops, fighting happens, mantishead.  Dude bumrushes you, mantishead.  I prefer the former.

[Vwest]

This would reduce roleplay opportunities.  Dude walks into room and confronts you, scene develops, fighting happens, mantishead.  Dude bumrushes you, mantishead.  I prefer the former.

How it really happens 99% of the time:

Dude walks in.
Dude attacks.
Dude spams kick.
Dude spams bash.
Dude spams disarm.
Mantis head (for someone).

Or the popular alternative:

Dude walks in.

>run
>e
>e
>e
>hide

Dude walks in.

Dude walks off.

>lolz

Sorry, but I just don't see a lot of scenes develop, just a lot of code spam to make sure X dies or X gets away. It is a code based system, after all.

I agree the skill idea is a little WAY over the top, but claiming it's going to reduce RP opportunities is a stretch at best.

[Bogre]

I think charge and bash adequately cover this proposed skill.

If you want to get to combat quickly you can 'run'.

[DustMight]

I think charge and bash adequately cover this proposed skill.

If you want to get to combat quickly you can 'run'.

This.  And carefully planning to corner the target, tire him out, run him into a nearby scavaging beetle whatev.  I speak from the experience of the target. Just sayin'.

[Morrolan]

I agree the skill idea is a little WAY over the top, but claiming it's going to reduce RP opportunities is a stretch at best.

My experience disagrees with yours. My characters have been raided many, many times over the years, with a variety of results. Even the ones that were killed almost always got some interaction first, unless the attacker was an NPC. In fact, I think the only one that was killed was the half-elf newbie who refused to back down to a half-giant, with predictable results (squish).

The "bull rush" skill would effectively endorse (and code advantages for!) "e;e;bash bob". I vastly prefer the following:

The cloaked raider has arrived from the east, whistling calmly through parched lips with an axe over his shoulder.

(The cloaked raider begins watching you.)
With a professional once-over, the cloaked raider looks at you, up and down.

The cloaked raider says, with a casual smile, nodding his head westward, "Hey. My buddy with the bow over there...he's a great frickin' shot. So, to avoid trouble, let's say you just leave your bracers on the ground and walk away."

I know that when I've been raided like that, I've always played along. Yeah, maybe codedly I could slugfest it out with the guy...maybe his buddy doesn't even have a bow. But my characters often aren't looking for a fight, unless that's their actual paid job. A couple of hundred 'sid is a small price to day. My characters might even counteroffer, "Here, I'll give you a hundred a week, but you feed me information on who's passing through.

[IssacF]

Yeah that's not how charge works. But yeah I think the abuse implications and virtual world factors make it a bad idea to implement.

My advice, if you wanna bull rush someone from 2 rooms away as a warrior, use this:

Code Select Expand


> run
> e
> e
> bash amos


I will probably just create an alias called rush or chrg and make it similar to that. Thanks everyone for the kind replies and making me see the skill is unnecessary.

[Vwest]

I agree the skill idea is a little WAY over the top, but claiming it's going to reduce RP opportunities is a stretch at best.

My experience disagrees with yours.

You must have vastly better luck with players then I do.

[InsertCleverNameHere]

Sounds like an easy-to-abuse skill.

It's Charge...For warriors.

Yeah no, Charge is much more like Bash... ie, must be in same room, only with the disadvantage of being unable to actually be engaged in combat when you attempt it. Where you CAN bash something you are fighting, you must be disengaged to charge it.

So... really, the proposed Bull Rush isn't like Charge at all except both initiate combat once used.

As far as the idea itself... ehh. I see what you mean. But it seems a little too much like an insta-teleport attack.

[X-D]

I do not know what experiences you have had Vwest, but remember, there is a diffrence between intent to raid and intent to murder.

Raiders/highwaymen don't want the mark dead...but there is also the PC who intends to kill...that is not a raider.

If I play a raider, I often do as has already said, emotes confidence etc, ask nicely for an item or two or a toll...whatever.

If I am playing a killer, be it somebody on an assassins contract, bounty, hates elves...whatever. Well, you might get an emote, but it will be followed directly with action...as I do not intend to let you get away.

Now sometimes a raider has the intent to kill...usually this is only when the mark has already shown they will run.

I wonder how many times I have raided Morrolan's PCs...seems they have at least survived...I often sent kudos to smart marks.

[evil_erdlu]

[rant]
Armageddon can be 'won', in a sense. When you have high karma, you proved to yourself and to the staff that you are dependable, active and three dimensional role player. I want to 'win' armageddon in that sense. Even with my first character, after reading the documents, my aim was to 'win' armageddon.

Once, my third character, a Tuluki met a magicker outdoors. She froze. No I did not, she did. I quickly started emoting how she froze, how she cowered with no willpower to fight back or even to flee etc. The other character played along pretty well. We enjoyed it. Then I ran, I spammed all the directions because that's what my character would do. Result: "Did a good job of roleplaying a scared-shitless Tuluki commoner (over magickers).", +1 karma.

I've never met an auto-fleer because I don't raid, but I've never met an autoattacker either. They come, emote, I respond, we RP, then most possibly the scene ends with me giving some coins and riding the f**k out of there. I will keep on doing the same because not only it's more fun, it also approaches me closer to 'winning'. I cannot understand why anyone would do otherwise.
[/rant]

Back to the topic; maybe we can reverse the logic? Let's say...

Code Select Expand


3987/3987hp 3611/3620mp 3966/3966st>l
The person you want dead is here.
3987/3987hp 3611/3620mp 3966/3966st>l n
Through a door, a deserted room is here.
[Near]
*A strange shadow is here*
3987/3987hp 3611/3620mp 3966/3966st>tell person (pointing northwards) Why don't we talk over there?
Pointing northwards, you say to the person you want dead, in Sirihish:
   "Why don't we talk over there?"
3987/3987hp 3611/3620mp 3966/3966st>
The person you want dead says, in southern-accented Sirihish:
   "Nah.. Here's fine..."
3987/3987hp 3611/3620mp 3966/3966st>think No you will, sirrah!
You think:
   "No you will, sirrah!"
3987/3987hp 3611/3620mp 3966/3966st>say (growling, then charging forward) GET... IN!
Growling, then charging forward, you exclaim, in Sirihish:
   "GET... IN!"
3987/3987hp 3611/3620mp 3966/3966st>bullrush person n
You succesfully bullrush the person you want dead northwards.
A deserted room [n quit]
This is a deserted room. It's really deserted.
The person you want killed is resting here.
*A strange shadow is here*
3987/3987hp 3589/3620mp 3966/3966st>close door
3987/3987hp 3589/3620mp 3966/3966st>
3987/3987hp 3589/3620mp 3966/3966st>close door
You close the southern door.
3987/3987hp 3589/3620mp 3966/3966st>
It's already closed.
3987/3987hp 3589/3620mp 3966/3966st>
The person you want killed coughs blood as someone stabs him between the ribs.
3987/3987hp 3589/3620mp 3966/3966st>hit person
....


A coded skill that makes you bullrush folks to another room. It branches from 'bash'. It triggers crimcode if either of the rooms is crimflagged. It doesn't initiate combat but NPCs become aggressive to your character as if attacked. Its delay is 'after' and based on your skill, you may remain delayed before the other person stands and runs away/gets the first hit. The other person also gets a delay based on your skill, but the combat is not initiated so you can't take advantage of it before 'hit'ting him. Failed attempt results in a light health loss and falling because the person you tried to bullrush tossed you away/tripped you.

Discuss?

[MeTekillot]

Rename it 'carru' and I'm in.

[Ktavialt]

To the OP, I do not know how new you are (10 posts, so assuming new) but this is not a PK strategy-focused mud.  I came from a PK strategy-focused mud (Carrionfields) and it was a little irritating at first.  I think the thing that got me most was that I could never pin down an enemy; bash in this game just isn't like it was in my other game and attack lag means that anybody who wants to get away from your melee class, gets away (there are some exceptions, of course).  I would suggest stuff kind of like this and it was generally shot down.  After playing this mud for a while (years and years) I came to enjoy its focus and I realized why they do not have skills like this.  It is such an awesome game without a flawless tactical combat focus.  You really have to re-align your thinking in order to not be disappointed, and when you finally do, its great.  There's more that I would write on that but I got to go to work in a second .

More specifically, to your skill idea:

(a) This would be imbalancing.  Warriors are powerful compared to the other mundane classes (and non-mundane, I suppose), the main thing being their potential for overall offense/defense skills, i.e. higher caps and quicker progression to an extent greater than other muds with similar classes (warrior/thief/ranger/etc.).  There is no reason to give them this and buff them, and not someone else.

(b) As they stated, the skill would inhibit RP.

- From another hack 'n slash PK mud refugee (though I've been playing Arm now for 10+ years, so I'm a looooong-term refugee).

[Desertman]

Right now with a ranger in the wilderness I can run circles around groups of warriors and kill them at will without much fear of actually being caught. No group of less than three would even begin to worry me in a fight in the wilderness. Why? Because I am a ranger. That is where I reign supreme. That is the way it should be.

Put me in the city, or on the battlefield, and one warrior with half of the time played on their PC that I have on my PC can wreck my ranger in melee with no effort. Literally, I likely won't land a single hit on them.

If you implement this skill this is what you will get;

A white-fletched arrow flies in from the north striking the warrior-man in his neck.

The warrior-man instantly bull rushes to the north, instantly engaging the unseen archer in combat before they can draw another arrow/hide/move.

This skill would make my rangers suddenly half as potent in the wilderness, and still not even worth considering in melee.

If warriors get instant engage bull rush, I want no delay hide for master rangers/assassins, and no delay after firing arrows/throwing weapons.

I don't like this idea. But then again, I don't play many warriors, so I am biased.

[hatchets]

I just felt compelled to come back her and say, think really hard about how overpowered and abusable it is, cause as much as those terms keep getting thrown around it is unrealistic to be either.

They charge in, with a suggested delay giving them NO CHANCE TO INSTOBASH YOU DOWN so you have time to FLEE they lose a large chunk of stamina, meaning they can use it MAYBE three times before they are completely tired.

Now let's all remember what happens if you are outdoors and tired, and someone in the area has a bow and you gotta sit down for the next 20 minutes to get 8 points of stamina to be able to move one room.

Same pretty much goes in city, you just gotta flee.

The best the ability does is cause the one being charged to panic a moment, giving a small chance to have others surround them in their slight moment of confusion. I still like the suggestion, changes things up a bit. But the terms overpowered or abusable neither fit the skill suggestion.

[InsertCleverNameHere]

Let's say...

Code Select Expand


3987/3987hp 3611/3620mp 3966/3966st>l
The person you want dead is here.
3987/3987hp 3611/3620mp 3966/3966st>l n
Through a door, a deserted room is here.
[Near]
*A strange shadow is here*
3987/3987hp 3611/3620mp 3966/3966st>tell person (pointing northwards) Why don't we talk over there?
Pointing northwards, you say to the person you want dead, in Sirihish:
   "Why don't we talk over there?"
3987/3987hp 3611/3620mp 3966/3966st>
The person you want dead says, in southern-accented Sirihish:
   "Nah.. Here's fine..."
3987/3987hp 3611/3620mp 3966/3966st>think No you will, sirrah!
You think:
   "No you will, sirrah!"
3987/3987hp 3611/3620mp 3966/3966st>say (growling, then charging forward) GET... IN!
Growling, then charging forward, you exclaim, in Sirihish:
   "GET... IN!"
3987/3987hp 3611/3620mp 3966/3966st>bullrush person n
You succesfully bullrush the person you want dead northwards.
A deserted room [n quit]
This is a deserted room. It's really deserted.
The person you want killed is resting here.
*A strange shadow is here*
3987/3987hp 3589/3620mp 3966/3966st>close door
3987/3987hp 3589/3620mp 3966/3966st>
3987/3987hp 3589/3620mp 3966/3966st>close door
You close the southern door.
3987/3987hp 3589/3620mp 3966/3966st>
It's already closed.
3987/3987hp 3589/3620mp 3966/3966st>
The person you want killed coughs blood as someone stabs him between the ribs.
3987/3987hp 3589/3620mp 3966/3966st>hit person
....


A coded skill that makes you bullrush folks to another room. It branches from 'bash'. It triggers crimcode if either of the rooms is crimflagged. It doesn't initiate combat but NPCs become aggressive to your character as if attacked. Its delay is 'after' and based on your skill, you may remain delayed before the other person stands and runs away/gets the first hit. The other person also gets a delay based on your skill, but the combat is not initiated so you can't take advantage of it before 'hit'ting him. Failed attempt results in a light health loss and falling because the person you tried to bullrush tossed you away/tripped you.

Discuss?

I like this much better.

[Riev]

I've been wanting a carru/gizhat bash script available to high end Warrior-bash for a while now.

[Potaje]

Well if warriors get bull-rush I want functional caltrops.

[Hot_Dancer]

A little confused by this one - seems like a good way to get yourself murdered.

Would you suffer stacked lag from moving X-number of rooms + lag for kill/initiating combat?

It would probably give your opponent six seconds of free evil stuff to do to you once they flee out of your initial attacks...

[evil_erdlu]

I've been wanting a carru/gizhat bash script available to high end Warrior-bash for a while now.

Damn.. I've yet to see a carru-gizhat bash... Everyone speaks about it. I guess I will play an outdoorsy warrior at last.

[musashi]

That's generally why we're not supposed to talk about things like scripts animals may or may not have., or anything not covered in the help files and public docs, really.

Newbies haven't experienced the joys of wildlife critters yet. Lets stop ruining the surprises.

[Morrolan]

We should totally give this superpower to gith. And meks.

[hyzhenhok]

We should totally give this superpower to gith. And meks.

Ooh, and give Silt Horrors a variant, only instead of them charging you from 2 rooms away, they can use a tentacle ability from 2 rooms away that pulls you into the silt!

[musashi]

And they need to scream the Scorpion "GET OVER HERE!!" from Mortal Kombat when they do it.