Trap and Flashpowder

[Nyr]

Both of these have been removed from the game and both helpfiles have been modified.  We do have plans to revamp trap in the future, but its previous implementation relied on flash powder, which (in practice) did far more damage than the lore surrounding it indicated.  It was also somewhat confusing IC, since people could refer back to the history page and determine that flash powder had been used by the equivalent of ancient Tuluki terrorists to blow up at least two buildings--yet the helpfile indicated that the substance was not a high explosive.  After years of this, we have discussed it and we do not think that flash powder as implemented has a place in the game.

[BadSkeelz]

Are those files going to be /have been already changed to give the Tuluki terrorists some other means of blowing up buildings?

[HavokBlue]

Thanks for clearing this up. I know I had some confusion about this with past PCs wanting to use it for nefarious purposes. Appreciate it.

[Nyr]

Are those files going to be /have been already changed to give the Tuluki terrorists some other means of blowing up buildings?

Maybe so.  At present, I think it's enough to let everyone know what happened OOCly to both, then tweak things on the history page a later on.

[bcw81]

:C Flash powder was SO KHULE though!

[palomar]

Will existing objects transform into something useless (similar to what happened to the special attack pieces of armor)?

[Irathu]

Cool I am actually for one glad, having been a player that got to fiddle with the old flash powder it was indeed crazy awesome. But I always felt that trap was a bit wonky and am really excited about seeing it turn into something a bit more useful perhaps and different is always cool in my book as long as said different is not OMGWTF!. Though with you guys different is ALWAYS interesting and good.

Thanks for letting us know OOC. Awesome by the way.

[Harmless]

I would appreciate any implementation of the trap skill and therefore look forward to the future of this one.

[Fredd]

Across a few master burglers I never figured out how to make it. And I had so, so many goals...

Achievement Failed...

Why not just make it do less damage, corresponding more to what the docs says, instead?

Don't get me wrong, poison traps, knife traps, ect, will be awesome if you go that route. In fact, I was 100% surprised to find out that wasn't what trap did. So I really look forward to seeing improvements to the skill, making it much more useful. But that could be added onto the trap skill, making flashpowder a higher skill level required, like say...Advanced.

Edit: As I understand it, those buildings could not have been blown up, if the staff were not in on it as well.

[Barzalene]

Sorry. I fell behind in this conversation. Does it exist virtually?
(It meaning Flashpowder, not this conversation)

[shadeoux]

Both of these have been removed from the game and both helpfiles have been modified.  We do have plans to revamp trap in the future, but its previous implementation relied on flash powder, which (in practice) did far more damage than the lore surrounding it indicated.  It was also somewhat confusing IC, since people could refer back to the history page and determine that flash powder had been used by the equivalent of ancient Tuluki terrorists to blow up at least two buildings--yet the helpfile indicated that the substance was not a high explosive.  After years of this, we have discussed it and we do not think that flash powder as implemented has a place in the game.

The magic 8-Ball says no but I as usual could be wrong.

[Adhira]

No. Flashpowder does not exist any more in the game, even in a virtual sense.

[Fredd]

No. Flashpowder does not exist any more in the game, even in a virtual sense.

What was used to make all those blast marks where the north road used to be collapsed then?

[Sakra]

No. Flashpowder does not exist any more in the game, even in a virtual sense.

What was used to make all those blast marks where the north road used to be collapsed then?

Magick.

[Barzalene]

I don't object. I just worry about forgetting.

[Adhira]

No. Flashpowder does not exist any more in the game, even in a virtual sense.

What was used to make all those blast marks where the north road used to be collapsed then?

Not flashpowder.  We're not going to go in to IC details, but that's where it is.  Please, let's not get in to arguments over this.

[Nyr]

Why not just make it do less damage, corresponding more to what the docs says, instead?

We could've done that.  However, if it did less damage, we'd have to make it do something along the lines of the documentation.  Well, it makes light and makes a small amount of damage.  Hmm, is that explosive damage or not?  No, it's more of a deflagration rather than a detonation.  Well, can't deflagration seem a lot like a detonation in certain situations?  Hrm, that's still kind of confusing, and I'm not sure Zalanthans would know the difference between the two, and I'm not sure if players would research the differences except for Dalmeth who kindly pointed us to this sometime last year...well, if it's a small amount of damage and needs to be smaller, then what is the point of making a trap at all?  Kind of a lame "trap" if that's what it does.  We then looked at how often it had been used and what it was being used for exactly.  No one has really used trap in about two years, and most involvement with flash powder over the past six years has been using it as an illicit trade good.  Assassins haven't really been utilizing trap to great effect to actually assassinate their intended targets anyway, at least not notably in the past several years.  Given that scenario, it is a better idea to remove the skill, remove the substance, and revisit the skill at some time in the future.

Right.  So that's what we did instead!  We removed trap and flashpowder.

[Maso]

I never really understood the hows/what/whys of it when it was around...I just thought it was an RP tool...for, you know, black market trade, but didn't actually do anything. 0.o

[Rhyden]

No one has really used trap in about two years, and most involvement with flash powder over the past six years has been using it as an illicit trade good.  Assassins haven't really been utilizing trap to great effect to actually assassinate their intended targets anyway, at least not notably in the past several years.  Given that scenario, it is a better idea to remove the skill, remove the substance, and revisit the skill at some time in the future.

This part kind of seems like faulty logic. I can't explain why without getting into IC territory and arguing would be pointless anyways.

I'm glad staff have cleared this up and look forward to new trap possibilities in the future.

[Dalmeth]

This part kind of seems like faulty logic. I can't explain why without getting into IC territory and arguing would be pointless anyways.

I'm glad staff have cleared this up and look forward to new trap possibilities in the future.

It's pretty simple, what good is a damage-dealing trap that doesn't kill its target?

Pretty much, just trapping doors as you're running away from someone.  Damage them enough, and they don't heal anymore.  Then they have to turn back until they've slept it off.

How many places are you going to be running away from someone where there are doors?  Almost none.

It has no tactical value, just a fear of any random object exploding on you.

[Fredd]

Why not just make it do less damage, corresponding more to what the docs says, instead?

We could've done that.  However, if it did less damage, we'd have to make it do something along the lines of the documentation.  Well, it makes light and makes a small amount of damage.  Hmm, is that explosive damage or not?  No, it's more of a deflagration rather than a detonation.  Well, can't deflagration seem a lot like a detonation in certain situations?  Hrm, that's still kind of confusing, and I'm not sure Zalanthans would know the difference between the two, and I'm not sure if players would research the differences except for Dalmeth who kindly pointed us to this sometime last year...well, if it's a small amount of damage and needs to be smaller, then what is the point of making a trap at all?  Kind of a lame "trap" if that's what it does.  We then looked at how often it had been used and what it was being used for exactly.  No one has really used trap in about two years, and most involvement with flash powder over the past six years has been using it as an illicit trade good.  Assassins haven't really been utilizing trap to great effect to actually assassinate their intended targets anyway, at least not notably in the past several years.  Given that scenario, it is a better idea to remove the skill, remove the substance, and revisit the skill at some time in the future.

Right.  So that's what we did instead!  We removed trap and flashpowder.

Part of it's non-use is that a lot of us couldn't fgure out how to make it. But it's all good, i hope to see some awesome possibilities.

[Rhyden]

This part kind of seems like faulty logic. I can't explain why without getting into IC territory and arguing would be pointless anyways.

I'm glad staff have cleared this up and look forward to new trap possibilities in the future.

It's pretty simple, what good is a damage-dealing trap that doesn't kill its target?

Pretty much, just trapping doors as you're running away from someone.  Damage them enough, and they don't heal anymore.  Then they have to turn back until they've slept it off.

How many places are you going to be running away from someone where there are doors?  Almost none.

It has no tactical value, just a fear of any random object exploding on you.

That's not what I was talking about. That part makes complete sense.

I was referring to 'nobody having used trap and flash powder for the past few years' as a reason for its removal.

Because it's kind of difficult to use trap and flash when it was next to if not completely impossible to obtain in the first place.

Of course, I could always be wrong, but there's really no point debating semantics since it's gone now anyways.

Again, I appreciate the clarification and look forward to the possibilities of a reworked trap.

[Potaje]

Would have been cool to replace the hp damage with stun damage, and perhaps have the flash release be an overwhelming smoke that reels the senses and enough of it compassionate.

[Fredd]

Would have been cool to replace the hp damage with stun damage, and perhaps have the flash release be an overwhelming smoke that reels the senses and enough of it compassionate.

And now you see one of my goals. I was going to try and invent smoke traps.

[Nyr]

I was referring to 'nobody having used trap and flash powder for the past few years' as a reason for its removal.

Because it's kind of difficult to use trap and flash when it was next to if not completely impossible to obtain in the first place.

I won't say it was easy to get, but there was certainly enough of it around.  It took me about half an hour to remove it from every spot in the game, including removing it from an accessible shopkeeper that sold it.

Part of it's non-use is that a lot of us couldn't fgure out how to make it. But it's all good, i hope to see some awesome possibilities.

But you could figure out how to obtain it if you wanted to do so.  It was definitely in-game.

Would have been cool to replace the hp damage with stun damage, and perhaps have the flash release be an overwhelming smoke that reels the senses and enough of it compassionate.

...weed bomb?

And now you see one of my goals. I was going to try and invent smoke traps.

You'll want to keep staff apprised of stuff you want to invent with your PCs, particularly if it means new code and an assessment of its place in Zalanthas.