Jail sentences

[chrisdcoulombe]

I don't know

Wanted and Jail sentences are too long as it is.

What makes you say this?  There are plenty of ways to get un-wanted (turning yourself in to NPCs, or contacting a Templar being two of the obvious ones). And jail sentences differ in length depending upon the crime committed. So, if you're shanking people in broad daylight...yeah, you should probably expect to do some hard time. I need more frame of reference to make me not disagree with this. What would you prefer to see happen when you're committing serious crimes and getting caught?

Yeah I'd say the jail times strike a good balance. Personally though I'd be for making them longer if it was acceptable that players could log out and still do their time.

Pick someone's pocket and get caught with no Templar or sergeant on you go to jail for an hour ooc logged in.  You have to be logged in and doing nothing. 

There is a glitch where if you light a torch they come in and subdue you.  Its a game and you shouldn't be OOC punished for something your Character did.  What balance?  Its a game.  Its boring to idle for an hour.  I just clean when my characters go to jail.   If I'm lucky I catch it when someone is letting me out and have a chance to rp.  If not it just lets me out on time and an npc carries me back to the gates.   Same if you are wanted it takes at least an hour ooc to be able to move out of your hiding spot.  I don't know what you mean by looking like an npc, but changing clothes doesn't work.  Now I guess I agree that the jail sentences could be longer if they passed when you logged, however I still think that is an ooc punishment for an ic thing.

What is unbalanced is one pickpocket in a huge city gets swarmed by 8 soldiers when they get caught attempting to steal some petty cash or a trinket.   It seems like an over the top reaction.   I still thing there are too many soldiers.  Way too many soldiers. 

I do understand why the Jail sentence time is the length it is. It needs to be long enough for the Templar/AOD sergeant to come kill you or release you.  It still doesn't change my position because far less time should be sufficient.

[Barzalene]

Tangentially, it would be nice if everyone in the AOD of sufficient rank got message when someone had been jailed. Yes, it stretches realism. But it would improve gameplay.

[ShaLeah]

Tangentially, it would be nice if everyone in the AOD of sufficient rank got message when someone had been jailed. Yes, it stretches realism. But it would improve gameplay.

I don't think it stretches realism, MAGICKS stretch realism, anything say Corporal and above being informed of a nicker/murderer wouldn't be stretching realism, it's called a chain of command. Someone has to be informed. Someone -should- be able to deal with the criminals at all times and while the virtual world -does- take care of them, it's not like you can take note of noteworthy criminals if they're filtering in and out while no one non-virtual is around.

[MeTekillot]

There are probably at least a few dozen thousand soldiers in each city. I don't think the, what, 50 non virtual soldiers who respond to crimes is excessive.

[chrisdcoulombe]

There are probably at least a few dozen thousand soldiers in each city. I don't think the, what, 50 non virtual soldiers who respond to crimes is excessive.

Probably so, but them being on you and knowing exactly who the criminal is and having them subdued in the blink of an eye is excessive. 

[RogueGunslinger]

If you think spending an hour in jail for pick pocketing is excessive I really just don't know what to say. It's not an ooc punishment for an ic action. It's an occ opportunity for roleplay for your IC mistake of getting caught. I'm sorry that you idle and go do other things while in jail, but I find it's a good time to get in and think "what would my character be doing right now?" and then do that.


What exactly do you think should happen when you go to jail in the game? What do you think would be both realistic and playable?

[TheBadSeed]

There are probably at least a few dozen thousand soldiers in each city. I don't think the, what, 50 non virtual soldiers who respond to crimes is excessive.

Probably so, but them being on you and knowing exactly who the criminal is and having them subdued in the blink of an eye is excessive. 

Real life police are pretty good at apprehending criminals quickly with the use of radios, cell phones, etc. Zalanthas is a world with the unseen way. I imagine word of description and location can spread pretty quickly.

[Potaje]

It would be cool to be able to bride the soldier dragging you to the cells to let you go and more realistic than once being in the cells. So much more to go through to get out from where they are.

Of coarse then you need a level of what is bribable and what is not. Like levels of murder and theft.

Low level commoners
Commoners
Greater house
Soldier
noble house
Noble
Templar
Highlord himself

[MeTekillot]

There are probably at least a few dozen thousand soldiers in each city. I don't think the, what, 50 non virtual soldiers who respond to crimes is excessive.

Probably so, but them being on you and knowing exactly who the criminal is and having them subdued in the blink of an eye is excessive. 

Real life police are pretty good at apprehending criminals quickly with the use of radios, cell phones, etc. Zalanthas is a world with the unseen way. I imagine word of description and location can spread pretty quickly.

You fuckin' know those asshole twink soldiers tell other soldiers your sdesc via the way instead of describing you. They don't even emote in combat or when they try to subdue you. I bet they have triggers set up. You see how they always say the same things when they do stuff?

[James de Monet]

I really have to disagree with you, Chris.  In a brutal society where they still have Arena Games and Templars hold all the power, you think it's an OOC punishment to be in jail for an RL hour for pickpocketing?  I would have to say the complete opposite.  ICly, you're lucky they don't chop off your hand for stealing.  They did that in the real world, in societies less harsh than Zalanthan ones.  One coin, whack.  No more dual wield, no more shield use.

And an RL hour?  That's less than an IC day.  One day, for getting caught stealing?  I'd take that over losing a hand.  One RL hour is an OOC mercy.  The jail times are so unrealistically short BECAUSE a lot of people hate being stuck in jail.

As to getting mobbed by eight soldiers anytime you get caught committing a crime, well...I suppose I would have to say that while I agree that the game may be unrealistically zealous when it comes to arresting criminals, it is also unrealistically FORGIVING of past crimes.  Those NPC guards don't remember arresting you yesterday for the same crime, and decide to decorate your face because of it.  If they fail to find you before your wanted flag expires, you are in no danger of one of them looking at you funny and going "Wait a minute...".  This is a two way street.  I hate to be harsh, but I really feel if you can't hack the jail times, don't play a criminal.  Lowering the jail times is just going to make being a bad criminal stupidly forgiving.  It shouldn't be.  Getting caught and being on the inside for a while is part of those character's lives.  Live it, love it, or maybe choose to play something else.  *shrug*


Edited to add: Oh, sorry, by "turning yourself in to NPCs" I didn't mean make yourself into an NPC, I meant turn yourself in, ie surrender.  If you're wanted, one way to get UN-wanted is to go get arrested.  Sure, it means you go to jail, but sometimes that's more fun than hiding out until the flag passes.

[RogueGunslinger]

The things I mean to say, James de Monet says better.

[James de Monet]

The things I mean to say, James de Monet says better.

<3 you too, RGS   

[chrisdcoulombe]

Edited to add: Oh, sorry, by "turning yourself in to NPCs" I didn't mean make yourself into an NPC, I meant turn yourself in, ie surrender.
LoL I took that wrong.  Haha

I would rather the punishment be harsher and have a chance to get away.  Right now the only real way is to flee and turn nosave arrest back on over and over.

I'm even fine with that.  Its too many guards still.  Being a criminal shouldn't be easy that is not what I am saying.  I am saying having to be logged in an ooc hour to wait for your characters sentence to be up is ooc punishment.   How is it not?   Why not put people in jail so long that they store their characters?  That would be a pretty harsh punishment. Things are already swayed very heavily in favor of the law.  I have played both sides of the coin.  If you are active there is plenty of time to get to the jail if you need to.  You could be there in 2-3 minutes.  Its not about being realistic its about being fun.  

Arm isn't realistic anyway.  If it was it would be really boring.  Its a low fantasy Rpg.  What is your actual motivation for keeping players characters locked in a room where they can't interact with all of the rest of the population?  How does that make the game more fun for you or the rest of the players?  How does it actually effect you?

[chrisdcoulombe]

There are probably at least a few dozen thousand soldiers in each city. I don't think the, what, 50 non virtual soldiers who respond to crimes is excessive.

Probably so, but them being on you and knowing exactly who the criminal is and having them subdued in the blink of an eye is excessive. 

Real life police are pretty good at apprehending criminals quickly with the use of radios, cell phones, etc. Zalanthas is a world with the unseen way. I imagine word of description and location can spread pretty quickly.

Real life police are incompetent. 

[MeTekillot]

i, for one, agree with chrisd. five minute jail sentences for everyone. ten minutes if it's murder.

Is that the point you're trying to make? What are you arguing in favor of, exactly?

[chrisdcoulombe]

It would be cool to be able to bride the soldier dragging you to the cells to let you go and more realistic than once being in the cells. So much more to go through to get out from where they are.

Of coarse then you need a level of what is bribable and what is not. Like levels of murder and theft.

Low level commoners
Commoners
Greater house
Soldier
noble house
Noble
Templar
Highlord himself

That is a cool idea.  It would be an interesting system.

[MeTekillot]

Samos the salter never goes to jail! Hahaha!

[chrisdcoulombe]

 

[RogueGunslinger]

I've had excellent experiences in the jails. All widely different and from both sides. I've also been stuck in them alone, bored. I would not give up the former to get rid of the latter.

[Case]

I have had some extraordinary fun in prison situations. If anything, sentences are far too short, short enough to abuse anyway.

[chrisdcoulombe]

I've had excellent experiences in the jails. All widely different and from both sides. I've also been stuck in them alone, bored. I would not give up the former to get rid of the latter.

I agree with you the climax is what jail scenes are all about.  Its tense for both sides because you could have to kill.   I'm not saying a trade.  Either the players are on or they aren't.  These scenes are possible or they are not.  It takes the players to make that scene or immortal animation is another possible outcome.  Being in there longer just makes the players on the militia end take their time. 10 minutes for stealing and 20 minutes for murder of commoners. This would not take the majority of those scenes away.   Or On a sliding scale.  Like Potaje brought up.  Not that my scale is accurate in all ways, but different punishment could be different depending on the severity of the crime.

                                          Theft/Murder
Low level commoners  5/10
Commoners                   5/10
Greater house                10/20
Soldier                             20/30
noble house                    30/till player or imm release or death
Noble                                35/till player or imm release or death
Templar                           Till release or death
Highlord himself             Death


Also addressing  how easy it is to be caught.   I already said it would be fine if hard coded crime didn't result in 8 soldiers jumping on you immediately in a crowded bazaar.   I don't think it adds to the game.  I think it takes away from it.  If you aren't playing one of the non-stealth classes then there is pretty much no getting away unless you dive into a tent or an apartment.   It has to be fast though.   Its not a problem with me if I choose to play one of my characters as a pickpocket, murderer, assassin, burglar or just a thug.  Those are conflict characters and add spice to the game.  Its supposed to be harsh, yes.  That is why I propose less guards out and about in the city, but when you do get caught lets increase the chances of getting thrown in the spike pit or put in the arena.  Or maybe in Tuluk you are let free to be dealt with discretely.   

[X-D]

I know this is a derail, but seeing the "highlord himself" part just tickles me.

After all, if you read up on the histories, what is the tried and true method of becoming the highlord himself? 

[racurtne]

If something like this were implemented, I seriously doubt attacking/killing soldiers would merit less of a penalty than noble house employees. They seem about on the same level, except you have to take into account that fellow soldiers and their Templarate employers would probably be even less lenient on someone attacking/stealing from one of their own.

Just my opinion on it.

[RogueGunslinger]

Meh. I honestly wouldn't' be opposed to lowering jail times. I could live with that.

[musashi]

FWIW Templar players are alerted that someone is in the jails. When they first log in, and when someone in the jail cells logs in, and when someone is first tossed in. So actually, shorter jail times would result in fewer scenes given that the system is designed to snag people's attention at log in.

If you've been sitting in the jail cell for 30 minutes and THEN a Templar comes in to see you, it's not because the militia characters were taking their sweet time. It's because the Templar just logged in, got notified, and hurried as fast as they could to come give you a scene.