Skills

[Sandor]

I'm wondering how one goes about getting skills he didn't start with.  I'm a warrior right now but think I should have backstab with the way I'm playing the character, is there anyway to go about getting backstab?  Like say I plan on never using shield use, (which I dont) then can I switch them?

-Sandor

[mansa]

I think, a warrior with Backstab would be -too- powerful.  You should of just chosen Assassin and played him like a 'warrior'

Certain skills define the Guild.

[Sandor]

Actually I am a warrior playing him like an assassin, I don't see what is so powerful about it, I'm willing to trade skills if that's what you mean.

[Carnage]

It doesn't matter, skill trades are rare if ever even being done. Backstab is a powerful skill. Incredibly powerful. Tie in that with the raw power of a warrior and you've got a killing machine.

If you still don't see what's too powerful about someone with the potential like Sujaal, Iakovitz, or Samar having backstab, I don't know what more to say.

[Sandor]

I have no idea what that is supposed to mean..Fine tone me down so I'm not a warrior, I'm wondering why there are even classes and you can't pick the skills you want.

[Carnage]

Let me spell it out for you-

You've got a snowball's chance in hell of having backstab granted to your warrior. That's what we've been trying to say, except with tact. If you're going to complain that class x doesn't get unbalancing skill y, maybe Arm's not the game for you, since you should be more concerned about the roleplaying.

I have no idea what that is supposed to mean..

It means that backstab is a potentially 1 hit kill in alot of cases, and that then with the possibilities of several weapon-skill raised attacks coming after that, and parry, its pretty much death in a round or two. -Also- one of the detriments to assassins with the skill is their lack of parrying ability, leaving them open for a walloping should they fail and not flee quick enough.

A warrior with backstab just will not happen, sorry.

Fine tone me down so I'm not a warrior,

-Or- you could just have picked an assassin to begin with and avoid all this confusion and 'toning down'.

I'm wondering why there are even classes and you can't pick the skills you want.

Because then people play unrealistically, and things are majorly unbalanced. Fighters will pick backstab, parry, weapon skills, maybe a few magick spells, a couple crafts to make and repair their own stuff, things like sneak, hunt, heck why not take everything and just practice what you need? Get the point yet? There are skill limitations for a reason, its to keep things fairly balanced, and  the gameplay of the game stable.

Anyways, want to backstab - play an assassin.

[Sandor]

Jeez, I was just wondering how one went about getting another skill.  And carnage, I am concerned about roleplay that's why I'd like the skill because I'm roleplaying this character as an assassin, yeah I shoulda picked the class assassin, but I didn't know that it was all classed based like that, so i'm screwed for this whole character.  But at least I'm focused on the roleplaying, right?

-Sandor

[Carnage]

so i'm screwed for this whole character.

Not really. Your character is what you make of it. 'Assassin' doesn't mean you're actually an assassin. It's just the title of a sneaky, combat-based skillset. You can be a tough assassin as a warrior, ranger, whatever. I don't quite understand what you mean by 'class based'. Arm isn't class based. Your warrior can be a servant, a guard, a hunter, an assassin, or, hell, even a merchant. It's whatever you want it to be, not the title of your class and subclass.

[Sandor]

Exactly, so why not be able to customize your skills to reflect on that roleplay?

-Sandor

[Carnage]

Because you don't need skills to roleplay.

[DrunkenSalarr]

Alright, Glad you are focused on roleplay.  I'm also sorry if some of the responces have been getting a little harsh.  A lot of skills will just appear when your ability increases enough in skills you already have (skill-branching).  However, there are certain skills you will never get.  Every guild has them.

I will tell you now, keep playing your character how you are.  Coded skills aren't everything.  Soon enough it won't matter that you don't have backstab.  I have seen several Assassins that weren't of the Assassin guild.  You will be amazed at what you can do without skills you -think- you need.

Don't get discouraged, keep playing.  And a point of advice, never play two similar characters in a row, it just makes the game more fun.

~Drunken Salarr

[Sandor]

Then why do muds have skills? You do need them to roleplay, there are many forms of roleplaying, if you are playing a combative type you HAVE to have combat skills, if you are playing a shady and mysterious mercenary it gets more complicated, which is why I chose warrior hoping to customize later, which I never got the chance to.  Your arguement can go both ways Carnage, saying you DONT need skills to roleplay on a mud like this is pretty stupid, let me just emote that I stole that bread and he will give it to me? No you need the steal skill....
Last time I checked this wasn't a MUSH.

-Sandor

Skills like that are not given to classes that dont get them.
You dont need backstab to play a 'shady type character'.

[Sandor]

That's nice, you don't need any skills to play a shady type character, you do need them to act on things he would do icly, such as being hired to kill someone in a quiet manner, right?

-Sandor

[Carnage]

Your views obviously aren't going to change. In fact, I think you posted this message up just to argue. Chances are high you aren't going to get backstab, so just deal with it and stop complaining.

I'm done with this thread.  :roll:

[mansa]

I've killed many people, in a 'quiet' manor, while being a -merchant-

In fact, it is easier to -kill- stuff, as a warrior.  You can do it.  You don't need the special 'backstab' in order to do it quietly.  You can always lead them down a path, take then out for a 'hunt' or anything like that.  Just be creative.

[Bestatte]

Well since you seem to be in an arguementative mood Sandor, I'll toss you a few things to chew on.

Did you bother taking the time to read the details about each guild before deciding which one you wanted? I ask this, because if you had, you'd have understood that warrior does -not- get backstab. Each guild description pretty nicely tells you many of the things that come with each one. The ability to aim attacks or imose critical damage is -not- among the warrior guild description. What made you think it might be?

As for an explanation of the whys and wherefores - there are hidden skills that everyone comes with, that don't show up on your skills list. Offense and defense are the two biggies when it comes to combat.

An assassin's defenses SUCK. I mean - we're talking, just blow on me and I'll fall on my ass kinda suck.

A warrior's defenses start out better, and improve faster. It is coded to be this way, and would take a LOT more than simply removing the skill or "capping" it for an IMM to "tone down" a warrior's defenses.

Now then we have you, who wants one of the most powerful attack types to be added to your arsenal, even though you already have one of the most powerful defensive abilities on the block. AND one of the most offensive abilities as well.

Do you really expect that an IMM is going to spend a few days working on code that will allow YOU to have this change?

The game is as it is. You knew about it when you got your account. If you didn't, it's only because you didn't bother to read the information READILY at your disposal. If you knew, and you're just bitching, then shame on you for wasting everyone's time. If you didn't know because you didn't pay attention to the information, then shame on you for not paying attention.

In either case, don't be whining "why can't the game be changed to allow me to do what I want!" because all that will produce is people like me who have very VERY little tolerance for that sort of thing, jumping down your throat.

[DrunkenSalarr]

That's nice, you don't need any skills to play a shady type character, you do need them to act on things he would do icly, such as being hired to kill someone in a quiet manner, right?

-Sandor

I will tell you now, you have all the skills you need to do that as you are now.  Put a little thought into it, have some fun, and enjoy.  Skills, while important, are not everything.  You do not need to know how to put a kinfe in just the right spot in order to kill someone un-observed and dispose of the body.

[Sandor]

I'm not trying to argue, I'm wondering why you all so adamant about customization of a characters skills?  And don't give me the whole, well everyone would pick the best skills, you'd have big uber strong warriors with backstab running around?  That's not the case, there are plenty of systems that work, I'm wondering why it's so taboo to state my opinion.

-Sandor

[Dan]

Its not that it is taboo... it is just that many people here feel strongly about the current system. The base classes have been done very well. There are unbalanced guilds and such, this is where the karma system comes in.

If you really feel strongly about having a beefed up assassin then try to work -with- the imms here and special app, correspond with them. They are extremely helpful. You may not get everything you want, but if they feel you can be trusted in a role such as the one you've explained, and you think you actually have a shot at it, send them an email.

Your tone came off argumentative is all. You catch more flies with honey than with vineger if you get my drift.

Seriosuly though, a (long lived) pc with warrior abilities -and- backstab would be nigh on unstobbale short of magic use and poisons.

Bottom line--- You -can- customize your skill-set. All it takes is special apping to the imms, keep a cival tone and propose good ideas instead of shooting down someone elses compromise.

[creeper386]

*sigh* If you want a sneaky, hiding, backstabbing combative type... Your going for an assassin. Which works quite well. With the right IC things you can be pretty scary.

Warriors are MUCH more scary, just all out in front. The ability to use weapons to attack and defend... They can toss out MANY attacks some even getting to the damage of a earlier backstabber, can be up to two at a time instead of just one and having to flee. Several ways to fairly easiely knock someone out... Can get one hit kills there... Can still use poisons as warriors... Although takes alittle more work can still easiely be done IC...

I'd still prefer the assassin class if I was going for a sneaky character... But... A warrior with backstab? Holy crap... Backstab and if you get skilled can crank out six responding hits probably all half the damage of the backstab to begin with? As well as being nigh untouchable? Yes, it does get VERY unbalancing... Heck, I've had a character I thought was alittle unbalanced as a human warrior and he still basically sucked compared to some of the people I've seen in the game...

You'd have troubles getting it... I'm guessing it MIGHT be possible... but probably going to have to be handled before hand and not after the character is made... And even then it's still really iffy... To take the disadvantages to balance out that skill... There's probably not any reason at all to try and go that route.

Armageddon's a class based MUD, but those classes are just skills sets, they aren't IC things... They really don't effect RP... I've had VERY successful characters, even with combative based skills and not use one of them... Ever. Even seen people in combative positions without any coded combative skills... Not grandly the norm, but quite possible.

Creeper who thinks, you just have to face the fact that people well disagree with you, and that most well disagree to the extreme.

[Sandor]

Ah, I didn't even know there was any special application thing, thanks.

[crymerci]

(EDIT: edited to be more constructive.)

Sandor, I think what people are trying to tell you is that none of us know where our characters' lives and jobs will lead them when we pick our guilds.  It's up to your own creativity to work around the code and figure out a way to make things happen.  

A few examples:
-One "assassin" character I played was actually a serving girl.
-My "pickpocket" was a spy and concubine.
-I played a "ranger" who was actually part bard, part merchant.
-I played a "physician" who was obsessed with poison.

Believe me that as a warrior, you are just as capable (perhaps even moreso in some cases) of killing as an assassin, if you are creative.

[Dan]

That would be correct crymerci, as well as unneccesary. No need to point things out like that, just try and be helpful instead of critical.


::::EDIT:::: - point taken