Gemmed Treatment and Roleplay v.68468176981435

[spawnloser]

Okay, so if we agree, how come you seemed to suggest that people should show hatred to the gemmed?  You piss a gemmer off and your mate's milk might suddenly curdle and your baby goes hungry.  You piss a gemmer off and your 'mighty agafari' might turn into a 'pathetic sapling'.  Magickers can do anything.  You should be scared to piss them off.  You should be too scared to show them anything but fear unless you have a real number advantage, and 2 PCs-on-1 in the Gaj isn't a real number advantage, and since you can't count on the VNPCs to back you up, or even the NPCs, if two bynners are trying to start a fight with a gemmer in the bar, I'd be more inclined to believe that everyone else there would back off and leave room between them and the gemmer than support the person pissing off the gemmer.

You know what?  The player of the gemmer is sure to expect that, but expecting a bynner to start a brawl with the gemmer because the gemmer is in the bar?  I call bullshit.  The only thing saving the gemmer is that the player is too scared too lose a character over blasting the crap out of you.  The crim-code is unforgiving and brutal.  The gemmer is almost guaranteed to be roughly handled and probably killed for blasting you... but you getting in the gemmer's face?  You should be too scared too for fear of never having sex, having babies, seeing, peeing straight and from only one hole, having a shadow, being able to eat without vomiting up your spleen and etc etc etc, to pull the crap I see people pull against gemmers.

Gemmers and players of gemmers seek interaction, just like normal people, and they should be able to find both.  Treat them appropriately and they will act appropriately, in most cases.  This doesn't mean they shouldn't go to the Gaj or the Red's or any other location in the city.  Being a gemmer isn't an isolationist role.  It's a socially ostracized role.  There's a big difference.

[Gimfalisette]

If we let every topic be, particularly with regards to magick, the world would either be entirely out of line with the docs OR it'd be too much work for the staff.  "Shut up and let people play how they like" isn't the answer.

*sigh*

You apparently did not read what I posted. I will reiterate: Claiming that there are "too many" magickers in game (or too many of anything) is futile and a dumb argument, because in proportion to the actual virtual population of the game (original 500k population of Allanak including only about 10k gemmed, 2k nobles, 1k Bynners), we will always have too many magickers, as well as too many templars, too many nobles, and too many Bynners. Proportionally, there should only be about 3 PC gemmers, half of a noble, one-quarter of a Bynner, etc. Due to the fact that PCs are intentionally skewed by game design toward niche roles within the virtual environment, yes, there will always be too many magickers. It cannot be helped.

I am in favor of all players playing their own PCs according to the documentation and mindful of the virtual and PC environments. I am also very tired of hearing "you should / should not" applied to other people's play when those players are not violating the spirit or law of the documentation.

[hyzhenhok]

Okay, so if we agree, how come you seemed to suggest that people should show hatred to the gemmed?  You piss a gemmer off and your mate's milk might suddenly curdle and your baby goes hungry.  You piss a gemmer off and your 'mighty agafari' might turn into a 'pathetic sapling'.  Magickers can do anything.  You should be scared to piss them off.  You should be too scared to show them anything but fear unless you have a real number advantage, and 2 PCs-on-1 in the Gaj isn't a real number advantage, and since you can't count on the VNPCs to back you up, or even the NPCs, if two bynners are trying to start a fight with a gemmer in the bar, I'd be more inclined to believe that everyone else there would back off and leave room between them and the gemmer than support the person pissing off the gemmer.

You know what?  The player of the gemmer is sure to expect that, but expecting a bynner to start a brawl with the gemmer because the gemmer is in the bar?  I call bullshit.  The only thing saving the gemmer is that the player is too scared too lose a character over blasting the crap out of you.  The crim-code is unforgiving and brutal.  The gemmer is almost guaranteed to be roughly handled and probably killed for blasting you... but you getting in the gemmer's face?  You should be too scared too for fear of never having sex, having babies, seeing, peeing straight and from only one hole, having a shadow, being able to eat without vomiting up your spleen and etc etc etc, to pull the crap I see people pull against gemmers.

Gemmers and players of gemmers seek interaction, just like normal people, and they should be able to find both.  Treat them appropriately and they will act appropriately, in most cases.  This doesn't mean they shouldn't go to the Gaj or the Red's or any other location in the city.  Being a gemmer isn't an isolationist role.  It's a socially ostracized role.  There's a big difference.

You're not really being coherent. The division between "I'm too afraid of you" and "I'm too hateful of you" is not really that clear cut. There's a continuum, they're not mutually exclusive, etc. I think people should be more openly fearful of magickers, rather than ignoring them completely, and that would probably improve things. This was the point of the idea of putting some simple prejudicial scripts/echoes in public places: it would encourage people to be more open in their roleplay.

That said, I don't really think the magicker situation is a problem right now.

I never said gemmers shouldn't go to this or that tavern. I think that's an absurd expectation. Equally absurd is the apparently hostility against making the game world more accurately reflect the anti-magicker mindset in the documentation.

In all fairness, I don't think I've ever seen that arguement.

I am mostly talking about the following sentiment, which has been echoed (or a preference for such has at least been implied) by several others:

It's already plenty "uncomfortable" enough for gemmed to be in public anywhere within Allanak. Having played a gemmer, having played around gemmers a lot over the last 3 years, there is no need for further reinforcement to the current environment. Gemmed is about the most socially-isolated role one can play within a city.

It may very well be true that there's no need for players to increase their anti-magicker roleplay. I just don't think complaints about social isolation or lack of interaction are relevant. As much as I sympathize, one of the things that makes Arm so great is that it does not sacrifice roleplaying and the game world for OOC convenience or preference.

[Lizzie]

I meet a Vivaduan.
I make friends with the Vivaduan. Not romantic.

I should expect:

1. That my character will be surprised, herself, to find herself in good company, with a gemmer, and might even experience conflicting emotions about it.
2. That the gemmer will be surprised, himself, to find himself in good company, with a non-gemmer that actually enjoys his company, rather than barely tolerating it, and might experience conflicting emotions about it.
3. That the vast majority of people in the vicinity will totally NOT understand how, or why, a gemmer and a non-gemmer would be friends, some would find it repulsive enough to comment, a few might actually try to do something about it, and a rare one or two might attempt to turn the friendship into an opportunity to benefit in some way.

Same situation, but romantic:
1..definite conflicting emotions about it.
2..definite conflicting emotions about it.
3..far more people repulsed rather than simply flabbergasted, many more tempted to actually do something about it.

Same situation, but a strict, amiable trade relationship with no particular friendship:
1..little or no conflicting emotions about it.
2..little or no conflicting emotions about it.
3..the majority wouldn't even be confused, and would be tolerant. Some would still be repulsed, and the rare few would still want to benefit from it or do something about it.

I think there's room for all sorts of play styles and relationships, friendships, romance, business, etc. etc..I just think people need to remember how the world is -intended- to be, and bring into the game expectations that the world -will- be as intended. Even when you're playing the exception to the rule, or someone else treats your gemmer in a way that makes him the exception to the rule. In short, it's important to remember and respect what the rule -is-...not necessarily that you abide by it.

[jhunter]

If we let every topic be, particularly with regards to magick, the world would either be entirely out of line with the docs OR it'd be too much work for the staff.  "Shut up and let people play how they like" isn't the answer.

*sigh*

You apparently did not read what I posted. I will reiterate: Claiming that there are "too many" magickers in game (or too many of anything) is futile and a dumb argument, because in proportion to the actual virtual population of the game (original 500k population of Allanak including only about 10k gemmed, 2k nobles, 1k Bynners), we will always have too many magickers, as well as too many templars, too many nobles, and too many Bynners. Proportionally, there should only be about 3 PC gemmers, half of a noble, one-quarter of a Bynner, etc. Due to the fact that PCs are intentionally skewed by game design toward niche roles within the virtual environment, yes, there will always be too many magickers. It cannot be helped.

I am in favor of all players playing their own PCs according to the documentation and mindful of the virtual and PC environments. I am also very tired of hearing "you should / should not" applied to other people's play when those players are not violating the spirit or law of the documentation.

A-fucking-men/women.

[Salt Merchant]

Funny thing. The ones that -do- stick to their temples all of the time aren't noticed enough to be accused of sticking to their temples all of the time.

My sense is that, increasingly, gemmed are being created by casual players. That is the way players are coping with the isolation of the role; for the most part, they just don't log on much. If nothing's happening, they do something else. But they emerge everytime there's an RPT or so.

[Rhyden]

My sense is that, increasingly, gemmed are being created by casual players. That is the way players are coping with the isolation of the role; for the most part, they just don't log on much. If nothing's happening, they do something else. But they emerge everytime there's an RPT or so.

Seems like the gemmed role is perfect for casual players with the degree of isolation in the role; sort of like Templars or Nobles.

I am in favor of all players playing their own PCs according to the documentation and mindful of the virtual and PC environments. I am also very tired of hearing "you should / should not" applied to other people's play when those players are not violating the spirit or law of the documentation.

Yep - I'd love to see more players on the GDB worry less about "what your character should do" and more about "what -my- character should do". That said, Conspiracy Theory has a point. These threads make good reality checks for anyone reading them, though like all GDB threads, they should be taken with a grain of salt.

[Conspiracy Theory]

I understood your point Gimf, but mine stands. These threads are FOR pointing out the docs and making sure people ARE in line with them, even though these entire discussions have been replayed thousands of times in Arm's past. If we don't stick our fat noses in everyone's business, telling them how not to play, then it's piled entirely up to the staff to worry about how Chosen Lord Amos the selfless, beetle-riding, universally loved elven sorcerer just won the Grey Hunt.

Threads like this one can stop that from ever happening to begin with.

And Rhyden kind of stole my thunder but I'll post this anyway, so there.

[musashi]

I generally disagree with the slippery slope arguement as a means to justify jabbing fingers into other people's affairs.

I dislike these threads because they don't ever seem to be a simple renforcement of the docs, but rather, they seem to be someone trying to impose their narrow interpration of what they think the docs should be, onto the rest of the player base.

Trying to justify that kind of, well ... rude behavior with a "But if I don't do that the whole world will go in the toilet!" defense doesn't hold much water with me.

That said I agree with Lizzie's mentality on how the gemmed should be treated/reacted to. I think that's quite realistic.

[Niamh]

Magick is hated and feared, period, regardless of who they are, or who they work for.  Anyone who is friends with or sleeps with or nice to or defends a magicker should fully expect to be just as hated and feared for it, regardless of who they are or, or who they work for.  This is the norm of society.

[spawnloser]

There's a clearer cut line than you seem to think.  Hatred and fear are two separate emotions.  Just like anger and sadness.  They are distinct.  You can feel them at the same time.  You should be scared to show hatred to a magicker's face because they could curdle your semen without doing anything but breathing within 10' of you if they wanted.  Let them get into a lawless area or get powerful enough, and they can do things like make big enough explosions to leave a crater big enough that you can't see across it with the way the code works... and I'm not kidding, that actually happened in the history.  They caused the destruction of Tuluk.  They made a freaking volcano, sort of.  Why couldn't they do something smaller and much more personal and horrible to your character?  You should be too scared to give them a reason to be angry while paying attention to you for fear of the consequences.  Hell, you should be scared to even give them a reason to pay attention to you at all, for that matter, because who says they have to consciously want to do you harm for harm to happen?  Being blown a kiss by a vivaduan could leave you flaccid for a week.  Who knows?  Your mundane doesn't.  All of his/her mundane friends don't.  Noone can get past what they KNOW of a magicker character's limitations, though.  You know that the PC will have to actually use the code to cast to do anything to you and before they can do much, the crim-code's going to kick in.  You know what?  Stop knowing that.

Seriously, I'm going to come up with a suggestion to actually have things like this happen.  If you're in the same room as a magicker and that magicker starts keywording you for emotes or talks or something, for a script that runs on that magicker to set a script on your character that gives you echos for a few IC days about some ailment that is element-specific to that magicker.  I can think of no other way to get the dorks that ignore how afraid they should reacting more appropriately.

[Lizzie]

I see things -completely- opposite from Spawnloser. I see it, that if you're a commoner, you grew up in the vicinity of the entrance to the elemental quarter. You have been exposed to gemmers all your life. ALL YOUR LIFE. And you managed to live to be 22 years old, without having ever been cursed, you've already had 1 normal healthy baby so you know they never messed with your reproductive system. You know vivaduans can heal people because their temple is RIGHT PAST THE JUNCTION of the most travelled road in the entire city and you watch VNPCs travel in and out of that temple every time you pass it.

You have seen gemmers come and go peacefully without having ever caused any problems at all, and when you -do- see them cause problems, they are promptly destroyed as the mutated freakish abominations of nature that they are.

But if they're not actively doing anything to cause you to be afraid..if they're just sitting there having a drink, then you, as a commoner who grew up in their presence for at least 14 years, would know that chances are, as long as you don't go out of your way to piss one off, they won't bother you in the least.

[spawnloser]

Lizzie, you're thinking too much like a modern, western adult.  Think about it this way...

• You know that time you stubbed your toe and broke it?  A rukkian cursed you so that the ground wouldn't be right for you, causing the stumble into that step.
• How about that time you got Krath's Touch?  Well, obviously some krathi cursed you to be get it more easily since you didn't get it the 10 times before that when you were outside doing whatever you were doing.
• Then there was that time you got drunk and fell down the stairs.  A vivaduan obviously cursed you to get drunk too easily, and too drunk at that.
• All the storms in the streets?  Some whiran or elkrosian, or all of them just because they're there in the city, are the cause!  Better not accuse a whiran, though, as your breath might be harder to take in.  Better not accuse the elkrosians because you might never get to go outside again for fear of the storms!

Stop thinking like a modern person and think like a superstitious medievel dumbass.  That's more what your character would think like.

[jhunter]

Yeah, Spawnloser has a point. People with the lack of modern technological/medical knowledge (Zalanthans) would have all sorts of superstitions regarding what magickers can or can't do. People almost never play this aspect of life around them and it's kinda sad. People are using their OOC knowledge of what magickers can or can't do, or are thinking as themselves in the situation instead of how their pc being raised around such superstitions based on fear of magick would react.

[RogueGunslinger]

Magick is hated and feared, period, regardless of who they are, or who they work for.  Anyone who is friends with or sleeps with or nice to or defends a magicker should fully expect to be just as hated and feared for it, regardless of who they are or, or who they work for.  This is the norm of society.

This is, uh.. pretty definitive. The rest is kinda semantics, really. 


IAWSpawnloser.

[Semper]

A mundane raider will become feared through their reputation. People avoid them, fear them, so on, just knowing that they are in the location.

I just think there's too many instances of characters (and players) stumbling across, or experiencing magick which has not harmed them, probably even benefited them, and causes magick to be seen more placid than it really should be.

Solution? Give people a reason to fear magick again. Doesn't even have to be staff intervention needed for most of it, but I'm sure it would be a lot more effective.

Until there's a real threat which magick poses, and is a visible entity in the game, and with no real set boundaries and standards for which magickers to play to, players will continue to do as they want, and treat magickers as they want, even if they're suppose to be universally feared/hated/mistrusted, so on. We all want to play the exception to some degree.

[Ampere]

It's fine to play an exception to the rule, but Naimh is right in that others are bound to be distrustful if you're too cozy with a finger wiggler.  That said, regardless have how open you are to the arcane, you would understand that they're exceptionally dangerous people.

[Pale Horse]

A mundane raider will become feared through their reputation. People avoid them, fear them, so on, just knowing that they are in the location.

I just think there's too many instances of characters (and players) stumbling across, or experiencing magick which has not harmed them, probably even benefited them, and causes magick to be seen more placid than it really should be.

Solution? Give people a reason to fear magick again. Doesn't even have to be staff intervention needed for most of it, but I'm sure it would be a lot more effective.

Until there's a real threat which magick poses, and is a visible entity in the game, and with no real set boundaries and standards for which magickers to play to, players will continue to do as they want, and treat magickers as they want, even if they're suppose to be universally feared/hated/mistrusted, so on. We all want to play the exception to some degree.

Perhaps I'm being too cynical but I can't help but read this and think that the first time a magicker, gemmed or otherwise, tries to act this out and managed to accidentally (or not) kill the one they were intimidating, there will be a new thread/post about the "abuse of power from players of higher karma based guilds" on the GDB.

"The magicker didn't need to use coded power to be intimidating/scary?"  From my experience, often times yes, yes, you do.  "Excessive force" used by a magicker raider/scary person became the norm of the day for a period of time I can remember, because every time it happened, the mundane being threatened ended up attacking the gicker head on.    To curtail this and actual make people fear a magicker as has been pointed out they should, they started using more and more forceful means, which ended up outright killing several characters.  There were a number of unhappy posts about "magicker characters abusing their spells of doom" for a while.

And the magicker hate threads started up again..and people rose up to join in on them..then the counter arguments started, and the same tired cycle repeats it's self over again.

..Meh..Cynical post is cynical.  I'm up later than I try to be of late, having to watch the puppy until someone else gets in the house to take him off my hands and let me sleep.

[jhunter]

I find the last post to be very spot on. I've tried several times with magicker pcs to try and play up the: I'm a cursed babyeating, souless, shit-dispenser of doom role, only to have the other pc completely ignore it for OOC reasons. Then, to enforce the idea that you are a supernatural force of vile doom, you have to resort to more permanent force than would be fun for the recipient. Much like the situation templar players are put in from time to time. People will not respond realistically to the -threat- to their pc as much as they will to coded consequences. It's also much like the problem between potential raiders and raiding victims.

Have some realistic care for your pc's life for fuck's sake.

[LoD]

Magickers, especially the gemmed, are put into a pretty unfavorable position by the hard-line nature of the documentation and the current staff support for that mentality, that being the "all magick is feared and hated".

• If an elementalist lives up to the hype through code-heavy demonstrations of their power, mundanes cry foul because they think high-karma classes with coded power have an obligation to show more restraint.


• If an elementalist tries to integrate into the day-to-day social fabric of their environment, they're blamed for ignoring the virtual population that would be discouraging such actions through the omnipresent threat of mob mentality violence.


• If an elementalist befriends a mundane, then both characters are blamed for playing the exception to the rule rather than adhering to the documentation.

All of these situations are born of this universal fear and hatred serving as our documentation.  It's unfortunate that the game world doesn't aim for something more toward the middle (tolerated, but mistrusted) so that these situations would be largely diffused.  Deflating the intensity of the fear and hatred would allow for a wider variety of roles and relationships without both sides feeling as if they're constantly violating the spirit of the documentation.  It would also likely decrease the amount of attacks upon elementalists by mundanes, as it would become reasonable to have non-violent and cooperative relationships.

It's too bad that there aren't different stages/levels of elementalism that were visible measures of one's power, so that elementalists who chose a low-route to power were tolerated and mistrusted, where elementalists that pursued high degrees of power joined sorcerers and psionicists in the universally hated and feared category, creating a broader spectrum against which they were judged.

I have some friends that do drugs that I'm still friends with, because their lifestyle hasn't gotten to a point where they're a danger or negative influence on myself or the people around me.  However, I have other friends who gone deep enough down that road to fall into that category.  Both of these people do drugs, but I treat them very differently, and I wish we could have a similar notion when it came to magick in the game.

-LoD

[Qzzrbl]

Magick is hated and feared, period, regardless of who they are, or who they work for.  Anyone who is friends with or sleeps with or nice to or defends a magicker should fully expect to be just as hated and feared for it, regardless of who they are or, or who they work for.  This is the norm of society.

Magick is hated and feared, period, regardless of who they are, or who they work for.  Anyone who is friends with or sleeps with or nice to or defends a magicker should fully expect to be just as hated and feared for it, regardless of who they are or, or who they work for.  This is the norm of society.

Magick is hated and feared, period, regardless of who they are, or who they work for.  Anyone who is friends with or sleeps with or nice to or defends a magicker should fully expect to be just as hated and feared for it, regardless of who they are or, or who they work for.  This is the norm of society.

Magick is hated and feared, period, regardless of who they are, or who they work for.  Anyone who is friends with or sleeps with or nice to or defends a magicker should fully expect to be just as hated and feared for it, regardless of who they are or, or who they work for.  This is the norm of society.

Magick is hated and feared, period, regardless of who they are, or who they work for.  Anyone who is friends with or sleeps with or nice to or defends a magicker should fully expect to be just as hated and feared for it, regardless of who they are or, or who they work for.  This is the norm of society.

Magick is hated and feared, period, regardless of who they are, or who they work for.  Anyone who is friends with or sleeps with or nice to or defends a magicker should fully expect to be just as hated and feared for it, regardless of who they are or, or who they work for.  This is the norm of society.

[Qzzrbl]

Anywho.... The way I see it is this-- who here really cares -all that much- about how other players perceive their characters?

Honestly, just play your character.

If it's IC for your character to befriend a gemmer, than have him befriend a gemmer.

If it's IC for your gemmer to not act like an insane baby-fat drinking lunatic who will make people's dicks fall off, than have your gemmer not act like an insane baby-fat drinking lunatic who will make people's dicks fall off.

If you think someone is playing a character wrong-- then file a player complaint.

It's that easy.

If the player in question was doing anything wrong, the staff will take care of it.

It's so insanely easy!

I can't believe it myself! O:

You guys should seriously try it.

[Jenred]

What I find interesting is what parts of the Documentation people use to justify their treatment, or the treatment of others, towards magickers.

The helpfiles, indicate clearly that they are employed, with some regularity, by Houses, Independants, etc.
Alot of people are quick to say that the Helpfile take on magickers is "archaic" and "outdated". Yet - contrary to this - the helpfiles are updated regularly, and Magicker helpfiles were just edited the other week to remove "druidic" references. If the portions about hireability were incorrect, they would be removed. Which lends credence to the fact that magickers are employed and interacted with by different levels of society.

Hated and feared is mentioned twice in the documentation. It does not state "universal". And hate and feared are VERY VERY loose terms. We could have threads dedicated to the semantics of these words and appropriate application of attitude deemed suitable for each condition. Someone went through a lot of effort in a previous post about pointing out the "hated and feared" portion, posted by staff. No need to have it posted by staff, its in the Documentation. But all your great quoting still does nothing to explain what hated and feared means.

-To hate something does not mean you don't find it useful, or necessary, or acceptable.
-To fear something, likewise, does not mean it does not have a place, a use, a purpose.

This is how I feel on the matter. And if you couple my definitions with other portions of the Docs (below), I feel that the intention in all the documentation about Magickers is a rational fear. Not an irrational one. LoD posted it some time ago, a very well-phrased quote about irrational fear in regards to Magickers.

Another portion of the documentation, about living as an Elementalist in Allanak: And what about good wine, music, and comfortable clothing? There are people who will endure the prejudice of a city-state in return for having access to the lifestyle and culture it makes available to them. -- This implies that elementalists can, and do, achieve such higher levels of living.

HOW? - if they are to be hated, despised, thrown away and not interacted with? If all this is true, where do their residences, furniture, homes, clothing, etc come from?
The answer is the point I am making, they are not "hated and feared" to the point of excommunication from society. They are hated and feared to the point that they will never be quite welcome, or a noble, or a hero. They will be that menace that we accept.

Yet another portion: There are also undoubtably elementalists who are patriots of the city-state. For whatever reason they hold little or no animosity towards the social structure that brands them as nearly sub-human, and actually use their powers to aid it.

So again, I find it interesting what portions of the documentation people choose to cling onto. But there is nothing in the Magicker Documentation that would lead me to believe that if I played a gemmed Magicker in Allanak that I could not pursue any other set of goals or interactions that I would with a non-gemmed character. It would be unrealistic, yes, to assume that it wouldn't be difficult. But the outright "shunning" that some people call for is actually against what is documented. In the helpfiles, the Magicker Roleplay documentation, and the What You Know.

[a strange shadow]

LOD, Jenred, now, you fellas are trying to use reason in this here thread. They don't like that much 'round these parts.

[Qzzrbl]

Guild Wind Elementalist     

Wind elementalists are mages who follow the course of the ever-changing breezes of Zalanthas. Like the wind, they are often felt but not seen, and can typically travel great distances at will. Even less than sun mages, however, wind mages are not trusted; most average citizens have no ability to comprehend the aspect of a wind mage and his/her mysterious ways of moving and plane-shifting.

Wind mage spells often invoke the name of Whira, the elemental plane of air. Their magicks involve becoming unseen, traveling at high speeds or to places normally inaccessible, and crossing large distances in the blink of an eye.

Nearly as much as water mages, wind mages are able to sell their spells for a good profit, to those who would hire a mage in the first place. A powerful wind mage can be an absolutely invaluable ally, however, and so they may be sought out to aid in various assassinations, espionage (at which wind mages can be very good), or military operations.

As travelling companions, wind mages may be somewhat undependable-- they will typically become very tired of 'just walking,' and may abandon any party with which they are journeying.

Okay.... So a wind mage may be able to sell their services for a good profit, but only to those who would hire a mage in the first place..... What commoner in their right mind would hire a mage? I think Oash is pretty much the only people who hire these things anyhow. :/

Everyone else seems to have a healthy hatred and fear of magick, like the Staff say you should.

So using the docs there isn't a very strong argument, as they make it clear that only "those who would hire a mage in the first place" are the ones who hire mages. And there aren't many of those folk IG.

And if there -are- alot of people IG (other than Oash) that hire gemmed-- then they're doing it like they should be, out of sight.