Map of Allanak.

[warforged32]

Alright, this thread is here because I am mapping out Allanak, and this will be a little thing I post in as I work on the map. The map will show shops that can be entered without the "enter" command, streets/alleys/etc, and the directions you can go from each location. There will be no names of -anything- on the map, as that would be no fun 

So far, I have mapped out the entire Main Bazaar.

[Pale Horse]

Log in.  Type "help map allanak"

It does not show individual shops, no, but such information is considered IC and discouraged from being shared on the GDB 

[Nyr]

I appreciate your enthusiasm about the game.  You can certainly use a mapping utility to map out the game as you'd wish to so that you can keep track of things.

However, your map needs to be your map, not everyone's map.  This is considered an example of something in-character (knowing where shops are and how to get around in a particular area) that should be found out in-character (by traveling, etc.) rather than on the discussion board.  Please do not post your map anywhere.

[Ampere]

I wonder what happened to this project?

[warforged32]

Well, then what's the point of the ANSI map that is in the help files?

[warforged32]

Log in.  Type "help map allanak"

It does not show individual shops, no, but such information is considered IC and discouraged from being shared on the GDB 

I know there is an ANSI map, but the map is inaccurate...

[warforged32]

I appreciate your enthusiasm about the game.  You can certainly use a mapping utility to map out the game as you'd wish to so that you can keep track of things.

However, your map needs to be your map, not everyone's map.  This is considered an example of something in-character (knowing where shops are and how to get around in a particular area) that should be found out in-character (by traveling, etc.) rather than on the discussion board.  Please do not post your map anywhere.

If I were to e-mail you or some other administrator the map, would you be able to tell me what would need to be removed to make it postable? Because the ANSI map in the help files is inaccurate... I actually got lost when I tried to follow it...

[Xeran Van Houten]

It's not inaccurate - it's "general", and old, but it's certainly usable.

Noone is saying you can't make your map - just that you can't give it to other people.

[Pale Horse]

I appreciate your enthusiasm about the game.  You can certainly use a mapping utility to map out the game as you'd wish to so that you can keep track of things.

However, your map needs to be your map, not everyone's map.  This is considered an example of something in-character (knowing where shops are and how to get around in a particular area) that should be found out in-character (by traveling, etc.) rather than on the discussion board.  Please do not post your map anywhere.

If I were to e-mail you or some other administrator the map, would you be able to tell me what would need to be removed to make it postable? Because the ANSI map in the help files is inaccurate... I actually got lost when I tried to follow it...

That's...sort of the point.  Not the getting lost part, but that it's not a to scale depiction of the city.  It's a broad and (very) general outline of the city.  Finding the specifics, and often the "right turns here" and "left turns around the stone slab to actually get into there" are part of the fun of learning the game.

Arm. has a steep learning curve, in case you haven't noticed    This has been discussed many times on the board, and so far it's remained on the difficult side for new players to get into.  I can't speak for all players, but many of us have expressed our feelings that this is a good thing.  Those that end up staying after fighting through the initial learning process are usually very dedicated to the game..which we all are, or we wouldn't be here.

[Pale Horse]

It's not inaccurate - it's "general", and old, but it's certainly usable.

Noone is saying you can't make your map - just that you can't give it to other people.

Exactly!  Go ahead and map out anything and everything to your heart's content..so long as it remains "for your eyes only."

On a side note, it's great that a new player is very eager to help out and jump into things.  Everyone likes seeing that, and you'll get more encouragement and help, if you keep in mind that we're not trying to shoot down your ideas, but explain some of the rules that you might not yet be totally familiar with.

[mansa]

My personal maps actually helped me memorize the cities better.

[warforged32]

It's not inaccurate - it's "general", and old, but it's certainly usable.

Noone is saying you can't make your map - just that you can't give it to other people.

Exactly!  Go ahead and map out anything and everything to your heart's content..so long as it remains "for your eyes only."

On a side note, it's great that a new player is very eager to help out and jump into things.  Everyone likes seeing that, and you'll get more encouragement and help, if you keep in mind that we're not trying to shoot down your ideas, but explain some of the rules that you might not yet be totally familiar with.

Dude... I know what you are saying, but I think you are missing my -point-. The main point was to make an accurate map that at the very least showed all the different roads. Whether or not it shows the names of said roads, shops, huts/tents/stalls/stands/buildings/etc is not really a big deal. I am making one like that for -myself-, but I was simply asking, "If I make a map that doesn't show any of the stuff you should learn on your own, can I submit it?"... That was the basic idea. I just wanna make an accurate map of the streets so people won't get lost. I was actually doing better -without- that ANSI map that I was with it.

I wanna make an accurate map that -CAN- be posted... ( meaning, it lacks the stuff that would make it un-postable )

[Zharal]

Alright, sorry to step in but the point is that all maps are for personal use only.  When I first started; long long time ago there was no help maps and it was great learning your way around for the first time.  I personally belive that to give away that info to all would take away from one of the main factors that makes the game so fun, exploring and learning on ones own. 
Just my two cents...

[warforged32]

Alright, sorry to step in but the point is that all maps are for personal use only.  When I first started; long long time ago there was no help maps and it was great learning your way around for the first time.  I personally belive that to give away that info to all would take away from one of the main factors that makes the game so fun, exploring and learning on ones own. 
Just my two cents...

Well considering the ANSI map of TULUK is accurate... I see no reason why the ANSI map of ALLANAK should be inaccurate...
and if all maps are for personal use only, why are there ANSI maps in the help files?

[Cutthroat]

I think warforged is trying to make a map that is more like the map of Tuluk that is in the helpfiles. It reveals nothing you wouldn't know as a person living in Tuluk, and is sized fairly accurately. The Allanaki one is far less detailed, though it's still serviceable.

To answer your question about submitting the map, warforged: likely, yes. Staff has said that if a helpfile is out of date or could be improved you could always submit a clearer version.

Edit: oh, and I think the best way to do this would be through using mud @ armageddon . org

[warforged32]

Thank you... At least -someone- gets it. xD
Unfortunately, the map is being made in a way that, well, I'm making it with Google SketchUp, then I just screenshot and crop the image. It makes it easy to replicate certain map-pieces. It won't be an ANSI map, but it is definitely clear.

[Cavaticus]

Yes, if you think that the map you make might be suitable for public consumption, send an email to the mud account and show them your work. Again, please do not disseminate IC information like a map in an OOC way without staff approval.

[warforged32]

Understood.

[FantasyWriter]

Thank you... At least -someone- gets it. xD
Unfortunately, the map is being made in a way that, well, I'm making it with Google SketchUp, then I just screenshot and crop the image. It makes it easy to replicate certain map-pieces. It won't be an ANSI map, but it is definitely clear.

One of the reasons I mentioned ANSI in the other thread was so that one would be able to look at it in-game using their client. (like the other maps we have)

[warforged32]

Yeah, I have issues with ANSI though, the main one being that the characters aren't as wide as they are high, meaning they aren't squares. So, the map ends up being stretched vertically, making it look weird.

[spawnloser]

Thing is, with an ANSI map that would be displayed for everyone to see, it shouldn't be perfect anyway.  It should show generally what's going on.  It shouldn't be just as many characters north-south as Allanak is.  It shouldn't be just as many characters east-west as Allanak is either.  Simply draw it out in ANSI so that it looks right and isn't exact with all things labeled and it is something that you could share with others or have replace the ANSI map we already have and that you find fault with.

[Vanth]

I wonder what happened to this project?

Hmm, I'm trying to remember.  I think the proposed Tuluki map was too big in some way, either character limits per line, or it scrolled too much, or something along those lines.

[warforged32]

Thing is, with an ANSI map that would be displayed for everyone to see, it shouldn't be perfect anyway.  It should show generally what's going on.  It shouldn't be just as many characters north-south as Allanak is.  It shouldn't be just as many characters east-west as Allanak is either.  Simply draw it out in ANSI so that it looks right and isn't exact with all things labeled and it is something that you could share with others or have replace the ANSI map we already have and that you find fault with.

I don't think you get what it is that I am doing...
I am making a non-ANSI map, that shows NO details, but instead, shows the roads. NOTHING is going to be labeled. This isn't to replace the map in-game, it's to replace the map on the site, (hopefully), because the one on the sit SHOULD be accurately scaled, but that one doesn't NEED to be ANSI... at least, I don't THINK it does...
If it does, I will remake the map using ANSI... either way...

[Nyr]

Can you point out what website map you are referring to?  I can't find it; the only maps I've seen are these:

Code Select Expand

                                 ALLANAK
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
X                                                                           X
X                             The Labyrinth                                 X
X                                                                           X
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
X                               TSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS6                        X
X                               T                  W        Merchants'      X
X  Elementalists' Quarter       T   Main Bazaar    W                        X
X                               T                  MMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMX
X                            #  T                  M                       MX
X    2         #             CCCC                 $M                       MX
1CCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCC7 CMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM         Quarter       MX
X       3*     O             CCCC4                                         M5
X  Commoners'  O                TAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX8X
X              O                T                  A                        X
X OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOT                  A                        X
X              OO               T    The Arena     A        Nobles'         X
X              9O               T                  A                        X
X               O               T                  A                        X
X IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIITXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX8        Quarter         X
X              O                T                                           X
X              O  Quarter       T                                           X
X              O                T                                           X
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX8XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
X                                                                           X
X                            Templars' Quarter                              X
X                                                                           X
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

Code Select Expand

         --LEGEND--                    GOL KRATHU AND THE CITY OF TULUK
Taverns and Inns:                                         U
  1 - The Sun King's Sanctuary   /=========================U=================\
  2 - The Firestorm Pub          |       8                |U                 |
  3 - The Tembo's Tooth Tavern   |   9GGGMMMMMMMTTT4PPPPPP|U                 |
  4 - The Anakore's Burrow       |    GGG      XTTTTPPPPPP|U                 |
  5 - The Lucky Ghatti Teahouse  |    GGG      XTTTTPP5PPP|U                 |
                                 |6MMMMMMM$    XXXXXXXXXXXAU                 |
Merchant House Estates:         | M  M  M     X/==========U=======\         |
  6 - Merchant House Nenyuk      |MMMMMMMM     X|                  |         |
  7 - Merchant House Salarr      |M MMM  M     X|                  |         |
  8 - Merchant House Kadius      | 2M M  M     X|                  |         |
  9 - Merchant House Kurac       |  MMMMMM7    X|   RUINS OF       |         |
                                 |XXXXXXXXXXXXXX|                  |         |
Roads and city sections:        |X     1X     X|                  |         |
  N - The North Road           NNSNNNNNNNX     X|   OLD TULUK      |         B
  U - Guar-Pandu Road            |X   RRRRRR*  X|                  |         |
  G - Gardens                    |X   RRRRRR   X|                  |         |
  C - Residential District       |XXXXRRRRRR   X|                  |         |
  T - Tribal Market              |X   RRRRRRXXXX|                  |         |
  P - Poet's Circle              |X   RRRRRR   X\==================/         |
  R - Red Sun Commons            |X   RRRRRR   X           U|                |
  M - Merchant District          |X     X@     X    The    U|                |
  W - Commoner Warrens           |XXXXXXXXXXXXXX  Templar  U|                |
  X - other roads                |    C3      X   District U|                |
                                 |    C       X            U|                |
Other places of note:           |    C       XXXXXXXXXXXXXU|                |
  A - Chaitya's Gate             |CCCCCCCCCC  X            U|                |
  B - Plain's Gate               |C   C    C  X            U|                |
  H - Harzen Gates               |C WWWWWW C  X    The     U|                |
  S - Scaien Gates               |C W  W W C  X   Noble    U|                |
  V - Reynolte vineyard          |C WWWW WWC  X  District  U|                |
  Z - Silverwood Estate          |CWW WWWW C  X            U|                |
  * - T'zai Byn Compound         |C W W  W C  X            U|                |
  @ - The A'jinn Academy         |C WWWWWW C  X            U|                |
  $ - Nenyuk Bank                |C     W  C  X            U|                |
  =, \, | represent city walls   |CCCCCCCCCC  XXXXXXXXXXXXXU|                |
                                 \=====C===================U=================/
                                      |VXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX|UHUUU
                                      \=                  |Z=  U
                                                          \=/  U


If it is an artistic depiction somewhere on the website, its intent is not to be specifically accurate:




If it is an ANSI in-game depiction via helpfiles (like help map allanak), its intent is to be generally accurate (to a point--showing what regions are where, like "this area is the noble's quarter, this area is the Rinth, this area is the Bazaar") rather than specifically accurate ( "this room is a shop, this other room is a shop also, this road is six squares of movement long," etc).  It would be best for you to contact staff at mud @ armageddon . org to discuss what you would like to do in detail.  It may be feasible; it may not.

[Ampere]

You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.

ANSI: A character set that defines 256 characters. The first 128 are ASCII, and the second 128 contain math and foreign language symbols.
vs
ASCII: An 8-bit character set defining alphanumeric characters.

[Jenred]

The Tuluk helpfile was updated when New Tuluk was added in. It was a cosmetic addition made by veteran players (or staff) to basically introduce a new "large area" that people would be playing in significant numbers. Allanak has not had a significant facelift, and most people that care enough to go about making a new helpfile are the same people that have their own, more detailed versions.

If Allanak changed significantly enough to affect a greater number of the playerbase, the helpfile would be altered almost immediately.

[mansa]

i made a map

[warforged32]

i made a map

Why are you posting a map here? Have you not read ANY of these posts?

[janeshephard]

I think he's trying to be funny with that map. It's hardly going to ruin the game for anyone.

[Akaramu]

But it has pretty colours. 

[buzz]

I particularly enjoy this map for its bright, vibrant colors, and that there are five "quarters."  And the speling erorr.  Epic map is in epic thread.

[AmandaGreathouse]

In complete and sincere seriousness, Mansa's map is better than the other map for me to tell where the hell I'm going IC.

[warforged32]

1.) This map that I am making is intended to possibly replace the website's ANSI map of Allanak.
2.) It is not going to be an artistic map, nor will it be
3.) I might not even be allowed to post the map after completion, because I would still have to submit it for inspection by the staff first.
4.) If they say the map is too detailed, I will remove detail and resubmit it.
5.) The map is NOT intended to be a replacement for the IN-GAME ASCI map of Allanak, because I am not making an ASCI map, and the only way to have a map be in the in-game help files, is for it to be an ASCI map. I do not want it to be used for the in-game help files.

[Cutthroat]

1.) This map that I am making is intended to possibly replace the website's ANSI map of Allanak.

I have been trying to find this map you intend to replace, but to no avail. I only found a drawn map of the Known World. Can you link it or something?

[warforged32]

The ANSI map of Allanak?

Seriously?

[MarshallDFX]

Mansa's map is accurate and aesthetically pleasing in many regards.

Can somebody make an ASCII version of Mansa's map to replace the one in the helpfiles?

[FuSoYa]

The ANSI map of Allanak?

Seriously?

Calm down man.  You come off as sounding very, very angry.

Your map idea is a good one and I hope to see it once it's gone through the proper channels.

Brandon

[Cutthroat]

The ANSI map of Allanak?

Seriously?

I really don't get what you're talking about. I know the ASCII map in the help file that you don't want to replace, but I don't know of any map - ANSI or otherwise - of Allanak, on the website, that you do want to replace. If you'd give a link of what you're talking about like I asked that would be greatly appreciated.

Maybe I'm just confused, but like Fusoya, your map idea is a good one and I hope to see it once it's gone through the proper channels.

Edit: Maybe if someone cleaned up Mansa's map and actually made it a square, and included the streets...

[Vanth]

You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.

ANSI: A character set that defines 256 characters. The first 128 are ASCII, and the second 128 contain math and foreign language symbols.
vs
ASCII: An 8-bit character set defining alphanumeric characters.

For those who don't wish to nit-pick, ANSI art and ASCII art are terms that might be used interchangeably to mean pictures made out of symbols.
http://word.tips.net/Pages/T001787_Understanding_ASCII_and_ANSI_Characters.html

[bardbard#4]

mansa's map is the best to ever be produced for the game.

warforged32 is, I think, the young delerak.  Except this time, he came across (read: stole) Bill & Ted's time traveling phone booth and travelled to the future in order to try and convince us to use his map.

[warforged32]

mansa's map is the best to ever be produced for the game.

warforged32 is, I think, the young delerak.  Except this time, he came across (read: stole) Bill & Ted's time traveling phone booth and travelled to the future in order to try and convince us to use his map.

I have no idea what any of that means...


If you go to the website, and click help files, then scroll to the map_allanak one, it shows the map. The problem is, I don't know if that is what the game links to for its help files, or if the game has them built in. If the game links to the help files on the site as opposed to having help files built into the game, then this map wouldn't replace -anything- I guess, it would just be a map on the site or in the forums for people to refer to if they get lost OOC, thus forcing their character to be lost. That has happened to -me- before, when I first started playing Crackageddon. I started out in Tuluk, and it was a sandstorm/late-at-night, and I was lost OOC, even though my character would have known where he was.

Q:     I have been trying to map out every single place I can go in Allanak, but, there are "places I -can't- go" and "places I didn't know I wasn't -supposed- to go"/"places I didn't realize I was in". Is there anyone who can help me solve this problem? I mapped out a huge chunk of the Elementalist's Quarter, but I couldn't get it all done before realizing I was -in- the Elementalist's Quarter.

As far as I can tell, I have every place that I can access mapped out. Now I need to modify some of the tiles, as they look ridiculous and make the map look less clean-cut and simple.

[Nyr]

The helpfiles on the site are the same help files in the game.  They are the same in both places so that people not logged in can see the same helpfiles.

I would recommend hooking up with a helper, that'd probably be your best bet overall.

[warforged32]

How would a helper accomplish this task of helping me? I am unfamiliar with what helpers are able to do in-game.

[Nyr]

From the helper website:

Player helpers are players like yourself who are experienced with the game. They can answer questions and tell you when a question should be directed to the mud account or submitted through the request tool.

[warforged32]

So, they would be able to get me the road/building layouts for the areas I cannot access?

(My apologies. I am very un-skilled when it comes to these types of things. I usually just play a game and figure things out as I go. But with this game, I really am trying to learn when I'm not playing to better myself for when I -am- playing.)

[Nyr]

Well, that's not exactly what I meant.  You can contact a player helper for a lot of things, but giving you exact mapping coordinates probably won't be one of those things.  If it doesn't make IC sense for your character to be somewhere, you probably should not be there.  If an area is off-limits to your character, then you as a player will also not be able to map it.  That is generally why the map in-game (and on the site) only lists a few key areas you should know about, with very general directions.  The rest is best found out IC (or avoided IC).

[warforged32]

Well, is there a way to find out where exactly the non-restricted-access areas start, so that I can remove those for the map?

[Nyr]

Coincidentally, the best place to go might be a look at the existing map.  The templar's quarter?  That's for templars.  The noble's quarter is for nobles.  The elementalist's quarter is for elementalists; though non-gemmers can walk around there to an extent, they probably wouldn't.  The merchant's quarter holds the merchant Estates which you can't enter without being a member of one of those Houses.

A helper can answer those kinds of questions though, and I'd recommend talking to one of them in general.

[warforged32]

Hmm... Alright.

Would you like me to send you a copy of the map so you have a better idea as to what I want it to be like? No biggy if you don't, I'm just curious.

[LoD]

Warforged --

A lot of people are subtly trying to funnel you down a path where you will either realize or be told (by a helper, Staff member, whomever) that despite your best intentions, the very aspect of the map you hope to improve is one that has been purposefully avoided in the maps currently available in-game and in the web site's helpfiles (same thing).  In many of your posts, you use words like accurate and accurately-scaled, which implies that you are hoping to create a map that players can more easily navigate as it corresponds to their literal movements (5 north, 2 east, 3 north) vs. relational movement (the labyrinth is north of the main bazaar).

The maps aren't meant to convey accurate distances or literal steps to players -- only to provide a bird's eye view of the city so that players can have a basic understanding of where things physically sit in relation to one another.  Using the current map of Allanak, one can see that if they are in the commoner's area and want to get to the bazaar, they need to travel roughly northeast.

It seems like you've been frustrated at a few events where you've gotten lost in a given city-state/area, and thought the map was going to help guide you to where you wanted to go -- but the map isn't there to serve as an OOC tour guide.  And that's why many players spend a fair amount of time walking around and mapping locations out for themselves.  Exploring is part of the fun of the game, in my opinion.  I even used to create little booklets of graph paper and create mini-tomes of areas I'd explored/visited.

That said, always feel free to send ideas for improvements and new materials to the Imm Staff.  I just wouldn't want you to put a ton of work into something you thought would be instantly picked up and used by the community only to be disappointed.

-LoD

[Booshay]

The first few times I tried to play Armageddon, I ended up linkdead because I got tired of being hopelessly lost. Each time, I gave it about a year before I tried again. I've introduced a few friends to Arm since I finally "got it", and they did the same.

Not being able to navigate your home city is in no way a "fun chance to find things out IC" when you're a newbie. It's nothing more than unnecessary OOC hurdle to jump over, and it's one that I imagine drives quite a few players away.

[warforged32]

While I agree with most of Booshay said, I do realize that you need to find things out in character. I just thought a very simple map of the roads would be useful.

I now have 2 different versions of the map, 1 for me, and 1 that ONLY has what the ANSI/ASCII map has, (the places defined below the ANSI/ASCII map in the help file).