Capital Punishment Overused

[Melody]

Why are you guys shitting up a good thread?

Malken, Riev, Melody, Versu?  I'm looking in your direction.

Look away. I am just making a perfectly serious (serious!) comment on wagon makers' availability.

I agree with others. Killing is overused, because it is so much easier than thinking up creative tortures. And frankly, easier ic as well.

I don't see templar abusing their authority as much as criminal lords and such. After all, far easier to avoid templars than criminals.

[SMuz]

I've never actually seen templars kill anyone. I've seen lots and lots of threats from templars to sentence a person to death or chop off their limbs.. heck, I've heard they do that, but never seen it happen. It's how the law should be.. people avoid doing the crime in fear that they'll get killed. But nobody really gets killed.. it just feels that way.

The templars have been doing a damn good job!

[deviant storm]

  I miss Templar Hardnose.

I agree killing can be overused, but in some circumstances I do think templars should go with the moment. I mean if the guy's pretty much asking for being killed, do it.

And I can remember some instances where someone being killed was a real pivotal moment to rp I've been involved in. If there hadn't been that death, other events wouldn't have started. I know that's small comfort to the player whose character died, but let's face it, Zalanthas is all about these kind of things.

[Kiri]

Every time a templar or noble comes in the room, your asshole should pucker up a little.  Nobody should expect to get off the hook with a little slap on the wrist just because they can emote well and are "important" to some nebulous, vaguely-defined plot.  If you screw up, you pay for it with your life.  It's that simple.  If you don't like your odds, then don't play that kind of character.  There are plenty of things you can do that will keep you comfortable, safe, worry-free, and far from the cruel edge of justice (whoever happens to be wielding it).

qft.

Also, I would like to point out that there are times when death is the necessary and logical end result. There should be people and organizations that you are afraid of pissing off (not just templars and nobles), and you should -expect- death as a result of doing so.

It will certainly make trying to live without getting caught alone and in the dark a lot more interesting.

[Ampere]

The Underworld: Tips and Tricks.

1. Don't go around ganking npcs. They're generally protected by one faction or another.

2. Hang out in the tavern and familiarize yourself with the powerbase. Smile once and awhile.

3. Tourists generally aren't welcome.  You've been warned.

4. Don't get caught. If you do, expect to die.

There's a big difference between killing someone for being an idiot, and looking for an idiot to kill.

[Fathi]

The Underworld: Tips and Tricks.

1. Don't go around ganking npcs. They're generally protected by one faction or another.

2. Hang out in the tavern and familiarize yourself with the powerbase. Smile once and awhile.

3. Tourists generally aren't welcome.  You've been warned.

4. Don't get caught. If you do, expect to die.

There's a big difference between killing someone for being an idiot, and looking for an idiot to kill.

To add to #4:

If you get caught, don't play the tough guy and expect to still live. Favours, bribes, services, and groveling go a long way toward keeping yourself alive if you get caught. Sadly, the response I've usually witnessed is a combination of defiance, refusal to talk if talking is the goal of the scenario, spitting in faces, trying to escape, etc.

There are ways to stay alive even if you get caught, but don't expect to be shown any mercy if you mouth off to the people who caught you or if you don't cooperate.

[Only He Stands There]

What Fathi said times a thousand, heh.

Every time someone's been PKed by me - seriously, every single time, bar none - I've had every intent of letting them go with a roughing up, a mugging, or a stern warning. People tend to dig their own graves when faced with things like powerful raiders, powerful social PCs, and powerful criminal figures. If I had someone subdued to drag them off to my hideout and they DIDN'T spam escape and run off into unknown territory while shouting obscenities at me verbally as well as via the Way, I wouldn't have to end them. That, and I'd be completely shocked.

[Gimfalisette]

Conversely, I've had 2 PCs who were PKed despite massive quantities of begging, pleading, groveling, and a fervent intent to do whatever the other PC wanted if their life was spared. I also had another PC who was PKed completely without warning or any chance to avoid the death, in a situation where I know the other player knows I'm someone who can be trusted to roleplay.

I continue to believe that the responsibility mostly lies with those who are in the position of victimizer, rather than with the victim.

[Ampere]

Conversely, I've had 2 PCs who were PKed despite massive quantities of begging, pleading, groveling, and a fervent intent to do whatever the other PC wanted if their life was spared. I also had another PC who was PKed completely without warning or any chance to avoid the death, in a situation where I know the other player knows I'm someone who can be trusted to roleplay.

I continue to believe that the responsibility mostly lies with those who are in the position of victimizer, rather than with the victim.

I agree; but you must also agree that any promise made under duress is suspect. Unless someone can vouch to their character, and take responsibility should they renege, they're dead.  This does not apply to the little people, they're free to go, for a price.

[Rairen]

A recommendation to the leadership people who go into a scene knowing that they are going to do other RP-ish things rather than kill - as though you don't have enough backseat drivers on the boards, but bear with me - don't let me know that you're one of the people who wants to let me live.  Without a challenge, there's no game, and I quite like trying to ICly survive against all odds, even if they're already stacked in my favor. 

[Janna]

I don't really think its overused at all. If it was, there wouldn't be no less then 15 ridiculously long-lived PCs who constantly stir the shit still alive IG right now.

[Delstro]

Last time I was caught by a PC templar for being a pick pocket, the templar wanted an ungodly amount of coin, 2000, or he would kill me. He killed me.
I think it is overused on me. I try to squirm out of it, offer bribes, offer service, and they just want some ungodly amount.

He wanted 2000 and emoted looking at my stone axe that I could use to hack some 'sid, but I just stole it. I told him I stole it, but my 700 coin and service were not good enough.

Come to think of it, the last 3 times I have interacted, at all, with a templar, has gotten me killed.

Given, 2 PCs were to one templar in a 72 hour period. They were each doing completely different jobs, but hey, what do you know.

[a strange shadow]

It's good to see PCs living longer.

Enmities, friendships, and/or complicated relationships born of years of overt and/or hidden struggle (against or alongside each other) can actually form, last, and eventually, shatter...

Not to say you shouldn't off somebody when needed, but 9 out of 10, there's a more interesting, creative way to go about things.

[Jingo]

There have only been a few templars I've appreciated the overall roleplay of. But I do have to say that all the templars I've played with have actually shied away from capital punishment after enough groveling. Which I do appreciate, I guess.

[RogueGunslinger]

If a templar hadn't of killed one of my more recent players(and just played awesomely all together) I would have missed out on one of the best Arm experiences I've ever had.

I don't believe Capital Punishment is overused at all, honestly.

[Sephiroto]

There is a lot of advice in this thread.  Much of it is thought provoking.

One thing that I think few people should keep in mind is that just because someone else is playing a powerful criminal, raider, or political figure doesn't mean that they're 100% versed in the dealings with killing, capturing, or punishing PC's.  These things have to be learned just like we learn to rest our mounts while we skin a tandu and to carry extra antidoes when we go places where there are poisonous critters.

The code doesn't always work the way we think it will.  Sometimes a quirk in the mercy code sends someone to the mantis head on accident instead of critically injuring them for capture.  Sometimes things go bad with the incriminating of criminals and guards go ape-shit instead of hauling the person to jail.  Sometimes you're dragging your victim through the desert to your hideout and a raptor sneaks up and instakills the weakened PC with a brutal slash to the head, completely destroying your intents to RP out a good death scene or interrogation.

Things go wrong and there are lessons learned.  Hopefully the ones with the power doesn't make the same mistakes twice.

[Bogre]

People are angry at things being not hard enough, but really pissed when their characters are ended by the harsh arm of Armageddon law? What's the deal? Do you just want your characters -challenged- by beasties on the road so you can train on them then run away but to never actually be killed, or face death?

From what I've seen, those in power generally don't PK without good reasons. However, it can be really easy to have a good reason. If someone's killing off other PC's, or trying to kill soldiers, etc, etc, they'll usually be ended, for instance.

[Tisiphone]

People are angry at things being not hard enough, but really pissed when their characters are ended by the harsh arm of Armageddon law? What's the deal? Do you just want your characters -challenged- by beasties on the road so you can train on them then run away but to never actually be killed, or face death?

From what I've seen, those in power generally don't PK without good reasons. However, it can be really easy to have a good reason. If someone's killing off other PC's, or trying to kill soldiers, etc, etc, they'll usually be ended, for instance.

Nah. They want OTHER people's characters to die, to reinforce the harshness, and get close to it themselves a couple of times, but not actually do so.

[Yam]

I like being PKed.

PK more. Especially the crappy characters.

[Archbaron]

And I hear that the tribal accent gives you +5 to your crafting skills.

It's true! It also lets merchants branch component making and all the sorcerer spells.

[musashi]

Completely unrelated ... Archbaron's signature made me lol.

[deviant storm]

I really don't mind being PKed as part of a plot. Beats hell out of dying to some critter.

I like my characters, don't get me wrong. It's just I like looking back at past ones and knowing this character was a part of something more. If I've got to lose one, I'd rather it be for a good reason, helping drive plots along so on.

[Taven]

I would really, REALLY like one of my PCs to be tortured to death.

No, really. If the PC is GOING to die, I'd rather have a scene like that then a BLARGH-INSTA-KILL thing. Give me the hope that my pitaful pleas will be heard, and mercy will be granted. Take that hope and SQUASH it infront of me when the PC realizes that they aren't going to live... AND they aren't going to die fast.

Also, PLEASE don't be one of those people who goes "me too tough to scream, me is BRAVE" because that's lame. Part of the reason I want to have a PC tortured to death is just so I can have someone being tortured act right for ONCE.

Ahem. I'm not a sadist. Really. >.>

[Zoan]

I imagine everyone would scream at the admonitions of a Templar. They probably learn techniques in Templar Academy.

Haha...Templar Academy. Now I have an image of a zany cast of robed young troublemakers. Which one's the guy who does all the noises!?

[FightClub]

I'd like to pipe up and say, for once, most of the templarate I've met in game currently, are pretty cool, and are all about expanding rp.  Kudos to those of you I've played with.