Shoplifting

[Nile]

As far as I know this isn't IG, but I thought it would be cool to be able to steal items directly out of a shops inventory.

> The burly merchant has the following goods to trade:
01) Some pie
02) More pie


> steal #2

[insert sneaky message here]

Got it!


If you fail it could act the same as if you just failed on the actual NPC.

Yay or nay?

[psionic fungus]

Currently there are various methods of keeping shopkeepers immune to theft. Unfortunately, this is an issue of 'balance' with PC vs NPC interactions, but it is something I hope to see addressed in a different manner in 2.Arm.  

Ideally, shops would have an inventory that could stolen from.  Whether or not guard(s) or shopkeepers noticed a theft would be based on skll checks by all parties involved. Effects of noticing a theft might include raising prices, refusing to to business, alerting soldiers, or simply attacking.  These effects could even be based on the value of the item stolen vs the total worth of the shops goods (or the shopkeepers inventory).

So... in short, I'm all for some form of shoplifting.

[spawnloser]

It is currently possible to steal from shops.  I'm not sure I should give away the coded way to do so, though.

[mansa]

It is currently possible to steal from shops.  I'm not sure I should give away the coded way to do so, though.

steal pie merchant?

[Maybe42or54]

Some shop owners also carry a little bit of their inventory on themselves.

[GoodwinX]

Some shop owners also carry a little bit of their inventory on themselves.

"Some" and "a little bit" aren't exactly the right words.

[psionic fungus]

It is currently possible to steal from shops. I'm not sure I should give away the coded way to do so, though.

This may or may not be true...

But it is -certainly- true that there are various methods of making shops impossible to steal from that are currently employeed in the game.  Many shopkeepers are simply immune to theft.  Many vanish from the game if you attempt violence or theft against them.  Many shops simply do not allow you to attempt such activity at all.

These types of strict OOC barriers are what I would like to see done away with. NPCs should use the same skills and methods to catch thieves as PCs do.

[Cale_Knight]

Except we all know that once pickpockets reach a certain level of skill they can essentially steal no-fail from NPCs.

I don't want to go to the bazaar and see merchants with no inventory because they've been stolen from and no coin because they've had to buy back everything they used to have in inventory.

[Seeker]

Except we all know that once pickpockets reach a certain level of skill they can essentially steal no-fail from NPCs.

How did we all know this?  I didn't use to.

Regardless, I think a balance of possibility and playability should be maintained, and although things might be improved from where they stand now, I'm comfortable with not having every sticky-finger in the game hitting up the Kadius shop to pinch a 2,000 'sid evening dress from the shelves once a week.


Seeker

[Maso]

Except we all know that once pickpockets reach a certain level of skill they can essentially steal no-fail from NPCs.

I don't want to go to the bazaar and see merchants with no inventory because they've been stolen from and no coin because they've had to buy back everything they used to have in inventory.

I'd like to see SHOP items being stolen. From around the 'shop'. Not from the NPC's pockets. And NPC's shouldn't be so stupid that they would buy something back off the thief after just having it stolen from them.

That should help to not effect PC's using the shops too much.

[psionic fungus]

I don't want to go to the bazaar and see merchants with no inventory because they've been stolen from and no coin because they've had to buy back everything they used to have in inventory.

Nobody else wants to see that either, it's not realistic at all.  You'd have to be crazy or stupid to sell merchandise back to the shopkeeper you stole from. I assume 'reputation' will take care of that. I don't think anyone is suggesting that it be made easy to steal from shops, either.  Especially valuable items.  Any respectable shop is going to keep a closer eye on expensive merchandise than cheap crap.  All that is being suggested is that it is made possible to steal from stores.  That doesn't mean that a 100% steal skill means you will never fail stealing from a store.  The guard or merchant might have a 100% watch skill, and random chance is the only way to get away with pilfering something from his sight.  Perhaps store items could be marked with a difficulty level based on their price or rarity.  Improved code and scripting can make shoplifting possible and playable.  There are nearly endless possibilities... I'm sure one of them is better than completely preventing shops from being stolen from.