Re: The status of the Known World

[Candy Quackenbush]

Here's a direct link http://www.zalanthas.org/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=26283.

Now open for discussion.

I wouldn't want to see the mud closed and play a beta tester whose actions won't be an actual part of the finalized game's history. And I don't mind that bugs and typos aren't getting fixed right now. Why should they be? I also don't mind the abundance of mindbenders and magickers or the lower playerbase. None of it will matter pretty soon anyway so my philosophy is just have fun with what's remaining till Arm.2 opens up.

But maybe some of you disagree or liked one of mansa's many points raised so since I can't post a reply in Ask the Staff (and neither can you!) ...have at it here!

[Coat of Arms]

I've noticed that the world of Zalanthas hasn't been kept up for the past 6 months.

I've noticed that certain shops haven't rotated their styles in the past 6 months.

I've noticed that certain typos and certain bugs haven't been fixed in the past 6 months.

I've noticed that certain rooms have been saved with items that aren't supposed to be there. For example - some rooms spawn with boots, mugs, swords, backpacks. It's like the world 'saved' it, and they haven't undone their saving. And they are still there, for 6 months.

I've noticed certain NPCs have been duplicated and triplicated, and they haven't been removed, for 6 months.

All true in my experience, and things that seem like they could/should be easily fixed. Some of the things aren't game-breaking - I can live with the fact that a pair of boots seem to mysteriously spawn on the floor somewhere - but it does give the impression of a somewhat neglected game, and I think that's what mansa means. There are other more serious problems such as NPCs mysteriously vanishing from where they've always been (and not returning after a while as they would if killed).

It feels as though the world has not been taken care of. That the game is stagnant and it not changing, and is becoming a poor MMORPG without quests or items or fun. It's dwindled down to this. There's too many open spots in the world, for it to feel 'real' to live in, and all the plots feel too 'high fiction' or 'noble fiction' and not gritty or low anymore. It doesn't feel like Zalanthas -should- feel like, when I'm wandering around in it.

I too feel that the world is being sort of abandoned. On one hand it's understandable that the staff can't dedicate as much "janitor" time while working on arm2 as they normally could, but on the other hand it would also be a shame to let the weeds grow so tall that noone wants to visit the garden, as it were. We're starting to seriously struggle for numbers and this doesn't help.

've been considering the best course of action to take, to fix this problem. I believe there is two courses to take right now. One is to repair the problem. The other is to take the beast out to the back fields and shoot it.

I, however, do not think that repairing the world will work. We will have to close down some clans. Maybe even close a city down. With 30 people playing during peak hours, you don't even have enough players within one city to run.

Closing the game would be a drastical and possibly fatal movement. Right now I'm having a slightly negative feeling toward the game, although I continue to play (nowhere near as much as I did last time around) because there's still nothing better out there. If the game closed now and I left with a bad memory of it, I would be less inclined to return upon the new opening. I'd rather leave it open and hope that things improve. Closing the game shouldn't happen until there are no players to play it.

30 players is a bit of an exaggaration. It may be correct on bad days such as Friday night where there have never been many, but I've seen over 40 online at peak on several occasions in the past month. It's no lie that our numbers have dwindled and many areas of the game struggle because of it, though. It saddens me to log in 3-4 hours prior to peak and see 14 online, and I don't doubt that this is in part due to the neglected and imbalanced state of the game that we currently experience. The closing of clans is already happening, although I'd rather see some more strategic choices in that regard, namely the closing of completely isolated, non-contributing clans rather than what seemed like reasonably popular city-state clans.

I don't mean to sound spoiled or demanding, but we were promised an awesome time with lots of things happening, and it looks to me like we're getting a dull time with awesome things happening for a select few small groups of players, at least so far. I could just be down on luck and missing out on some obvious awesomeness, but I honestly have not seen anything but shortcomings yet.

If the MUD was to close it's doors tomorrow, I think it would be best for everyone. ArmageddonMUD has the email address of every player that has ever played the game, and they can certainly email out to everyone the status of the game and how it progresses. We can let the 30 people still playing become beta-testers in the new world. You can still post updates to the blog. You can create the 'excitement' and 'mystery' that has dwindled down in the past 6 months of delays and forgetfulness.

If the MUD was to close it's doors tomorrow, the end of the world as we know it can remain a mystery. It would create some plot points in the new world, to have players try and piece things together how it went down. It will create stories that people can write about in the times that lead up to the destroying. We can create our own fiction as to how the game was defeated.

I think many players stay just to see the ending. If they're cheated of that, the result (i.e. the amount of people showing up for arm2) may be disastrous. I'm personally not too interested in a blog-type mosh pit of stories where players all contribute their own fabricated versions of what's going on. If it doesn't happen in-game, or isn't written by the creators of the game, I'll have a hard time considering it canonical.

If the MUD was to close it's doors tomorrow, the end of the world as we know it can remain a mystery. It would create some plot points in the new world, to have players try and piece things together how it went down. It will create stories that people can write about in the times that lead up to the destroying. We can create our own fiction as to how the game was defeated.

If the MUD was to close it's doors tomorrow, the standard of the game will not be dragged down as it does every passing week that the Known World gets neglected and forgotten about. People won't be complaining that half of the 30 people playing are magickers or mindbenders, and people will still leave Armageddon with a good feeling when we think about it.

Again, I don't think the better solution is to close the game down and leave it up to creative storytelling to determine what goes down as possibly the most important event in the game's history, however long it may turn out to continue. Even a bad movie is unlikely to improve if you end it half-way through and let the audience finish the script. I'd rather try my luck and continue the game, hoping for something of actual quality and interest to happen before it's too late.

<some stuff about beta testing>

I'm not sure what I think about these ideas. Part of me is against leaving it up to a hand-picked group of players to refine the game the rest of us are to play, and I'd rather let the staff do it on their own or together with all of us. The other part of me realizes that something serious needs to happen if we don't want to take the risky chance of letting the game evolve (and, according to the opinions of some, degenerate) as it has so far.

All in all I agree with many of your views on the state of the game and your opinions regarding the reduced quality, but I'm not sure I like your suggested solutions. I don't have any better ideas myself though.

[mansa]

I would like to talk about the points I brought up at the end of my spew.

A high focus towards creative community.
http://www.armageddon.org/original/showType.php is a beautiful page.  It should be encouraged more to create original short stories and individual characters.  

Perhaps we should have an NPC creator page, where we can write up what they look like, and fill in a bio of them that's 15 pages long.  Perhaps then, we can create a storyline that multiple writers write in, and use these NPCs that we've created in the storyline.  Much like the Thieves' World novels - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thieves_World

Perhaps we should have item writing, as well.  Nessalin's blog post here. is a brilliant idea.  We should be able to view other objects people have created, and be encouraged to write our own.  The players should be able to scroll through the created content, as well.  Let the other players see what objects actually exist in the game.

Perhaps we should start requesting some of the writers who play ArmageddonMUD to write some backstories for the new world as well.  

This all requires a good editor as well, to make sure the stories of the world flow.

I'm debating for myself to write stories of Armageddon and submit them.  Background stories about some of the unknown noble houses in Allanak, or in Tuluk.
Stories that display political aspects of the game in Tuluk, of how it was supposed to be, and how it should of been.

I'd really love to see other people write fictional stories as well.  Please do.  I love them.

I want to start creating NPCs and Items and all kinds of junk, using a item / NPC creator website on ArmageddonMUD.  I'll totally make awesome NPCs and everybody would like them.

I want to see stories of other characters and what they've done.  I want to see stories of my characters I've played, in the eyes of other characters.

I'm going to write up a short story tonight and see what y'all think.

[V1agraKank]

I think his post was a bit much.

[mansa]

I think his post was a bit much.

tl;dr?

[Lovelace]

From reading these topics, it seems like some part of the concern is that there are too many special characters and not enough grunts to make the social hierarchy more workable.  As an inexperienced, but not 100% n00b player (maybe 97%?), what kinds of characters could I make that might help in filling out some of these plots?  I'd like to help out, if possible.

[ale six]

Pretty much anything mundane. You could be a fighter type... aka a Byn mercenary, a House guard, a soldier, etc. Warrior and ranger are good guilds for these. Or if you feel you can work independently, don't join a clan, but do contract jobs for nobles and templars as a hunter/scout/mercenary/explorer/forager, etc. If combat isn't your thing, you could try playing an aide instead... aides can flourish with nearly any skillset.

Really, just pick a concept you like with a skillset you like, and play a PC who's looking for work. Leader PCs will take just about anyone willing to do stuff. The shortage isn't so much of a particular type of role as it is of people willing to work.

[Dusky]

Ah, the game closed before for a very long time and it recovered.  I'm sure that if it closed now it would, again, recover.