Something to Think about During the War

[mansa]

How does one make a character to join the war? I'm not familiar with special apps or any of that mojo.

You should have a character who wants to fight in a war for a citystate.  You should try and contact someone inside the army, and ask them how to join, in game.  They will inform you what to do, in game.

You don't need to special app anything.

[Angela Christine]

And to add: the War is far from over.

I cannot say I really like this comment. I am sure we are going to win in a matter of a few days, or at worst weeks.

I'm sure they said on the news that the boys will be home by Githmas!   :wink:

How does one make a character to join the war? I'm not familiar with special apps or any of that mojo.

You should have a character who wants to fight in a war for a citystate.  You should try and contact someone inside the army, and ask them how to join, in game.  They will inform you what to do, in game.

You don't need to special app anything.

This is probably obvious, but if you want to get involved in the war right away you'd probably be best off taking the Warrior guild.  The others could certainly be useful, but a warrior is pretty good at defending themself and useful offensively right from day one.  That makes it a little more likely that you will survive your first real battle.  Good luck.


AC

[Halaster]

LoD is right about the part about magick being feared as an ingrained part of the society.  In fact, the world.  Most people throughought the Known World fear it.  While people may not say it on a day to day basis, magick is the reason Zalanthas is a desert world and not a green lush world.

[Barzalene]

LoD is right about the part about magick being feared as an ingrained part of the society.  In fact, the world.  Most people throughought the Known World fear it.  While people may not say it on a day to day basis, magick is the reason Zalanthas is a desert world and not a green lush world.

How aware are people of that on a day to day basis? It happened a long time ago, and more people are illiterate. Even those who know probably can't envision a lush planet, so even knowing would people really "know?"

I hope that doesn't sound argumentative. I'm not disagreeing, I'm trying to wrap my head around the concept. Not the concept that magick is scary, but the concept that people are very consciously aware of the fact that magick devestated their world.

[Halaster]

Actually, I wouldn't say that people are consciously aware - not most of them at least.  More like fairy tales they're told as children.  "Don't do magick, kids, it's what made the desert!".  Some may not even believe that to be true, really.  Or may not care, because it's not like they can do much about it.

Also, considering that literacy is illegal, oral traditions and storytelling would be more common.  Sitting around the fire at night, telling an old story about how "once upon a time, the world was lush and green..".  It's more like it's one of those cultural subconscious beliefs.  But there are a few people who would actually know about it - the historians and storytellers.

[Morgenes]

Even if they can't directly invision a lush planet, they are aware of the concept of forests and plants.   Storytelling and oral tradition will have passed down the idea that the world was a much better place, and it was magick that destroyed it.  However, note that is mainly towards sorcerery, not elementalism.  Elementalism is scary in the same way that Gods or nature are scary in other worlds/games.  It's a matter of reverance and fear for something that is much more powerful than you.  You don't mess with something that could blick you out of existence with a thought.

[Yokunama]

No offense, but magickers are getting too common to be mysterious anymore.  Even then, they act like super powered humans, not mysterious monsters.

Several magickers do exist, if you take into the consideration of the VNPC population. Some whom have not yet discovered their magickal talents. They are not mysterious anymore, because we, the players, tend to let our knowledge of how dangerous magickers really are and what they are capable of bleed into our roleplay, and ignoring the documents explaining how the mundane should interact with them.

[jhunter]

No offense, but magickers are getting too common to be mysterious anymore.  Even then, they act like super powered humans, not mysterious monsters.

Several magickers do exist, if you take into the consideration of the VNPC population. Some whom have not yet discovered their magickal talents. They are not mysterious anymore, because we, the players, tend to let our knowledge of how dangerous magickers really are and what they are capable of bleed into our roleplay, and ignoring the documents explaining how the mundane should interact with them.

Yeah, ICly there really isn't any more magickers than any other time really. There just currently is a higher percentage of those that are pc magickers now than there was before. This shouldn't really change anyone's attitudes about magick since it's an OOC aspect of the game, not an IC change.

[Yokunama]

It seems to me sometimes that some people actively look for reasons not to fear magickers or reasons to get along with them.

Of course they are.  They want to interact because this is a MULTI-USER game.  Can you blame them?  The purpose of fear and hate is not to segregate the playerbase from interacting with one another in any way shape or form, it's to help define one's role and actually ENCOURAGE (the right kind of) interaction.

Hate and fear doesn't segregate the playerbase.
I can recall several situations where hate and fear create some of the best interaction. The HRPT is one example of this (Hate). Players do not need to get along with every single PC and NPC out there, because they want interaction - Interaction comes and goes.

[Angela Christine]

LoD is right about the part about magick being feared as an ingrained part of the society.  In fact, the world.  Most people throughought the Known World fear it.  While people may not say it on a day to day basis, magick is the reason Zalanthas is a desert world and not a green lush world.

But that was Sorcery, defiling sorcery.  I think people do know that there is a difference, and know that Sorcery is much, much worse than elemental magick.  And since they don't know the sorcerous nature of their kings, they probably believe that Templar powers are very different from Sorcery too.  Lumping elementalists in with sorcerers makes sorcerers less special, and less scary.  

There are dead places in the known world that bare the ash blasted scars of sorcery ages after the events that created them.  If you use your maximum level of fear and revulsion on an elementalist, then you have no where to go when you run into a Defiler.  Discovering the ash traces of a defiler should be one of the most gut wrenching things around, not just "ho hum, looks like there's another magicker."



If an Elementalist is a guy with a gun, a Sorcerer is a guy who farts radioactive waste.



Angela Christine

[Halaster]

But that was Sorcery, defiling sorcery.  I think people do know that there is a difference, and know that Sorcery is much, much worse than elemental magick.  And since they don't know the sorcerous nature of their kings, they probably believe that Templar powers are very different from Sorcery too.  Lumping elementalists in with sorcerers makes sorcerers less special, and less scary.  

Quite true.  A point I totally overlooked.

[LoD]

Several magickers do exist, if you take into the consideration of the VNPC population. Some whom have not yet discovered their magickal talents. They are not mysterious anymore, because we, the players, tend to let our knowledge of how dangerous magickers really are and what they are capable of bleed into our roleplay, and ignoring the documents explaining how the mundane should interact with them.

I don't think that the lack of mystery or belief of an increased presence is something to be blamed solely on a player's OOC knowledge and purposeful disregard for the documentation.  This can be a factor, but there are many.

IC events have changed some of the magicker distribution in the world.  When Tuluk was at least a tolerant home for elementalists, it kept many of them from travelling the wilds.  They had food, protection, homes, wives, children, perhaps careers, and many other benefits that came along with being a functioning member of that society.

Once the Cataclysm happened, all of these people were flushed out into the wilderness to die, or scrap out an existence.  This was a major center of civilization suddenly forced to purge a good portion of their population.  That relocation introduced a higher body count of magickal beings to the surrounding lands (i.e. grasslands, tablelands, grey forest, red desert, etc...) which many smaller tribes inhabit.

People from these tribes, and characters that travel these lands, could very well sense or notice an upward shift in the number of magickers from years past.  The increased exposure to magickal persons (sorcerous or elemental) could remove some of the sense of mystery about a previously rare creature/being that is now competing for resources such as water, food, and real estate.

The documentation isn't dynamic enough to outline what these IC events would do to the general perception of the many peoples of Zalanthas.  An Allanaki soldier, tablelands tribal elf, Luir's outpost mercenary and Tuluki citizen will all have very different levels of exposure to magick.  The documentation paints the picture with broad strokes, and I think it's perfectly acceptable for people to tailor their RP to their IC situation without it being a negative action.

-LoD

[LoD]

But that was Sorcery, defiling sorcery.  I think people do know that there is a difference, and know that Sorcery is much, much worse than elemental magick.  And since they don't know the sorcerous nature of their kings, they probably believe that Templar powers are very different from Sorcery too.  Lumping elementalists in with sorcerers makes sorcerers less special, and less scary.

Would your average non-magickal person really know?  The Dragon sucked the land try.  Tektolnes buried Steinal under sand.  Elemental magicks destroyed Tuluk (we assume, since Tuluk began killing them).  We've seen devastation and death from every source of magick in the game on a global level.

I'd be more inclined to believe that your average Joe Schmoe doesn't understand which magickers leave ash behind them or that elemental magickers cannot "use spell X".  Most people would know that magick, in many forms, has been the cause of some pretty catastrophic destruction and the people wielding it are dangerous.

Would you (the common person) know the difference between different kinds of guns?  Whether one had armor piercing rounds, or a faster rate of fire, or quicker reload time?  Or would you just recognize that it was dangerous because you've heard of guns killing people?  If I was walking toward my house and someone pulled me aside and said, "Don't go in there, there's a man with a gun inside."  I wouldn't ask, "Well, what kind of gun?  Is it dangerous or REALLY dangerous?"

-LoD

[Gimfalisette]

Several magickers do exist, if you take into the consideration of the VNPC population. Some whom have not yet discovered their magickal talents. They are not mysterious anymore, because we, the players, tend to let our knowledge of how dangerous magickers really are and what they are capable of bleed into our roleplay, and ignoring the documents explaining how the mundane should interact with them.

I don't think that the lack of mystery or belief of an increased presence is something to be blamed solely on a player's OOC knowledge and purposeful disregard for the documentation.  This can be a factor, but there are many.

I am new to the game, I have no experience playing a magick-user here, and since I'm not all that interested in the magickal side of the game I'm not hunting down info on it here on the forums. So OOCly I know almost nothing about magick. However, my character who is still quite inexperienced in the world has been exposed to a -ton- of IC talk about magick, threatening interaction with magickers, and news about magickers. She's fast becoming fairly savvy ICly about what magickers can and can't do, how to defend against them, etc. Magickers are less mysterious to her because every time I'm in game, the subject of magick is present. Every time. And this is in the heart of Tuluk.

So I think blaming OOC knowledge of magick bleeding into the gameworld really minimizes how much activity, talk, and so on there is about magick going on IC.

[Intrepid]

I think Tuluk does not care about the difference between elementalists and sorcs.  They're considered the same for their purposes.

In Allanak, they're a group of unnatural freaks taking up a low place in society.  They're scum who draw power from either elemental forces not of this world or, worse, from elemental beings with their own agenda...but at least they're not sorcs, so we tolerate their presence and existence.

[Yokunama]

Mages are not heroes no matter what they do in a war.  If they call down a giant column of flame with fiery blue lightning bolts that destroys -every- enemy in range, the hero is the templar who brought them and controlled them until they did this.  The mage was a tool, that's it, just like the sword in a bynner's hand.  No credit goes to mages...inflate their ego, and there's going to be problems.

I disagree with this comment.
Let us keep in mind, the armies and its soldiers are tools to the templars as well. If the unit of doom brings several victories to the forces of Allanak, more than likely both the templar and the unit will get the credit for the victiory. Also, the sorcerer kings will recieve some sort of credit. When it all comes down to it, everyone is a -tool- to the sorcerer kings and his templars.

[Cale_Knight]

Is the gemmer going to be a hero? No, not likely. The commoner sergeant of a unit that does particularly well is probably going to be publically lauded as an example of what commoners can achieve in the service of the Highlord.

A gemmer who does something fantastic for the military is going to be rewarded much more quietly, since the templarate is never going to glorify magehood like they'd glorify regular military service.

[Dre]

I think Tuluk does not care about the difference between elementalists and sorcs.  They're considered the same for their purposes.

In Allanak, they're a group of unnatural freaks taking up a low place in society.  They're scum who draw power from either elemental forces not of this world or, worse, from elemental beings with their own agenda...but at least they're not sorcs, so we tolerate their presence and existence.

From my humble perspective i am inclined to agree with this post.

[Armaddict]

Armaddict wrote:
Mages are not heroes no matter what they do in a war. If they call down a giant column of flame with fiery blue lightning bolts that destroys -every- enemy in range, the hero is the templar who brought them and controlled them until they did this. The mage was a tool, that's it, just like the sword in a bynner's hand. No credit goes to mages...inflate their ego, and there's going to be problems.


I disagree with this comment.
Let us keep in mind, the armies and its soldiers are tools to the templars as well. If the unit of doom brings several victories to the forces of Allanak, more than likely both the templar and the unit will get the credit for the victiory. Also, the sorcerer kings will recieve some sort of credit. When it all comes down to it, everyone is a -tool- to the sorcerer kings and his templars.

I disagree with your disagreement

The problem arises with the consequences of glorifying mages.  If mages come back and are treated as heroes, you have at least a significant portion of the populace who is not happy with it.  Templars may have absolute power over commoners, but making them very unhappy and dissatisfied makes their job more complicated, and may end up having less time to pursue their own goals because of those disgruntled commoners.

It goes to public relations, as I was talking about earlier.  You don't make someone the people hate, fear, distrust, or do not understand into a hero.

[Hot_Dancer]

How do you stop a class of people so far above and beyond the norm from becoming heroes to the groups they serve?

Hot Dancer

[Cegar]

By recognizing that they are freaks and subhuman at best.

[Gimfalisette]

My train of thought here from LoD's guns/armament analogy is:

Guns...gang members...drug dealers...rappers...idolized by the masses...

Yeah, there's no way that anything so dangerous and antisocial could ever come to be seen as heroic, or to be lauded as celebrities. Especially in a well-adjusted place like Allanak.

[Armaddict]

Someone is a magicker enthusiast, heh.

This is a flimsy analogy...but if someone fired all of the U.S.'s nukes at every single enemy they'd ever had, and successfully wiped them -all- out...would our allies consider us heroes, or would they be wary of getting wiped out themselves?

[Gimfalisette]

Someone is a magicker enthusiast, heh.

This is a flimsy analogy...but if someone fired all of the U.S.'s nukes at every single enemy they'd ever had, and successfully wiped them -all- out...would our allies consider us heroes, or would they be wary of getting wiped out themselves?

If the US fired nukes at every single enemy we've ever had, wouldn't uh...we not have any allies left? Since, you know...we were at war with most of them at one point in time...

And as to your question, probably Yes and Yes.

[Cegar]

My train of thought here from LoD's guns/armament analogy is:

Guns...gang members...drug dealers...rappers...idolized by the masses...

Yeah, there's no way that anything so dangerous and antisocial could ever come to be seen as heroic, or to be lauded as celebrities. Especially in a well-adjusted place like Allanak.

Not even the same at ALL. Those are all people. They have no weird abilities. Furthermore, our societies are completely and utterly different. We love individuals with interesting mindsets and abilities. Zalanthans don't. At the root, Zalanthans are extremely jealous of a magicker's ability. Sometimes conciously, often subconciously. That is the root of the hatred as well as fear of those powers. It isn't like someone is in a gang. It is like someone is an alien who has the abiltiy to melt your mind. And you cannot compare the two cultures - they are apples and oranges.