Zalanthan Sexism Confessional!

[ale six]

This has been argued so many times before that it just starts to get annoying.

I say let people play the way they want to play. If you want to label PCs based on their appearances, it's up to you. Your judgements might be right or wrong, that's the risk you take. I've seen a few PCs that have pulled it off with a fair degree of success (more than just Pearl). Admittedly I've also seen a lot more that think they're hot stuff and aren't - it all depends on how skilled they are at the strategy.

So I've come to terms with the fact that some players are going to judge PCs based on first impressions, descriptions, whatever. I guess we can't really change that. It might be okay to discount some PCs right off the bat, but with others, your knee-jerk judgement is just going to let your guard down to them, and the crafty players will know how to capitalize on it. Either way, I don't see what good debating this on the GDB ever does.

[Intrepid]

I'd also like to add that everyone here appears to be utterly obsessed with
this topic.  It comes up every two to four weeks in some way.  The imms
have already given their opinions on this.  All that's left is a broken record
playing over...and over...and over...

So there are attractive characters in the world.  Who cares?

[Medena]

I have dared to play two characters who were unabashedly feminine. I have also played "the burly gap-toothed woman" and some androgynous ones, and a male character who was very feminine.  Oh wait, that makes three characters who were unabashedly feminine then, it's just that only two were female AND feminine.

I've no doubt that my first character of any note was categorized in some people's minds as one of those "dainty, f-me aides".  Was she dainty? No, she was in the middle range for height and weight. Did she act dainty? Not particularly. She wasn't above acting dainty if it would suit her purposes to do so, but it didn't usually.  Was she good at combat? No, but she was a pickpocket by guild and an acrobat by profession before being employed by a noble house.  Did she have an f-me description? No. There was a huge scar running across her face, no mention of breasts or curves, no pouty lips. But she was undoubtedly quite feminine.

I doubt that my male character was ever categorized as a dainty, f-me aide. Maybe that's because he was in the upper-mid range for height and weight. Did he act dainty? Often! He constantly touched his hair and buffed at his perfect fingernails.  He had a flawless complexion, long perfectly ringletted hair, and he even wore makeup. He wasn't above using sexual attraction as a tool, flirting shamelessly with women who gave him gifts, even though he didn't even like women. This guy was a lot more than a pretty face though. But so was my female aide.

I agree with people who have remarked on how this subject gets beaten to death. But I think it's important for newer players to not feel they have to make their characters's descs bland and/or ugly or their female's personalities aggressive and combative else face being ostracized. I don't want newer players whose current characters are feminine to think they have made some horrible RP faux pas that will relegate them forever to the "I don't want to RP with this person again".

I just don't understand why people are so judgmental on this point and so quick to dismiss characters who   -appear- to be of a certain type, but who may or may not be.

[Nao]

Not every pretty face is JUST a pretty face. Sometimes that look, that smile, and that walk are just one more weapon in the armory. One step closer to that fatal knife in the ribs while you're still smiling over sniffing the perfume. When she can wriggle out of your attempts to subdue her slicker than kank shit, toss a knife in your eye from thirty paces, then kick your balls into your ears when you're down... should you discount her just because of what she looks like?

That would be awesome. I thought about a char like that before.

On the one hand, your post says no, you wouldn't. But on the other hand... it seems to say that your first reaction will always be "Oh, another one of THOSE" without really seeing if there's any depth to the character before you discount it. If that's not the case, I apologize to you. But I think that's the first reaction of a LOT of players.

I can't help it. Even if every single one of those characters really had some UBER-secret that they're just trying to hide behind the facade - there's jsut no room for my character (which isn't even the grittiest of grit) to interact with them outside of the clan. There just seems to be -no- room for interaction at all besides smalltalk, it's hard enough with the 'fancier' characters within the clan and it seems near impossible with everyone else. That leaves me with either no one to play with even when there's plenty of characters online or having to adapt to that level of smiles and laughs and pregnancy and drama. Or do ooc stuff otu of desperation and try and engage that one 'normal' character - jsut that that one happens to be a breed or whatever that my character wouldn't usually talk to - got to bend cour concept a little to have some fun. frustrating.

The thing is... you don't have to interact with any of them, really. And  you could say to yurself, "Why don't I see if I can encourage them to change their ways in an IC way? Like calling that merchant a pansy until she's encouraged to learn how to use a tomahawk and unmans me? Or enticing that Aide to do something incredibly dangerous and possibly stupid that gets her fired and ending up out grebbing salt?"

I don't have to, but there seems to be no one else every time I log on, like I said. And calling someone a pansy would just result in a lot of
talk (clasping their hand in front of their mouth) Oh what a horrible thing to say!
:evil:

Yea, griping won't do much but I have to blow off some steam that didn't even exist the last time I saw that topic come up.   you don't have to read it, alright?[/quote]

[Nao]

Not every pretty face is JUST a pretty face. Sometimes that look, that smile, and that walk are just one more weapon in the armory. One step closer to that fatal knife in the ribs while you're still smiling over sniffing the perfume. When she can wriggle out of your attempts to subdue her slicker than kank shit, toss a knife in your eye from thirty paces, then kick your balls into your ears when you're down... should you discount her just because of what she looks like?

That would be awesome. I thought about a char like that before.

On the one hand, your post says no, you wouldn't. But on the other hand... it seems to say that your first reaction will always be "Oh, another one of THOSE" without really seeing if there's any depth to the character before you discount it. If that's not the case, I apologize to you. But I think that's the first reaction of a LOT of players.

I can't help it. Even if every single one of those characters really had some UBER-secret that they're just trying to hide behind the facade - there's jsut no room for my character (which isn't even the grittiest of grit) to interact with them outside of the clan. There just seems to be -no- room for interaction at all besides smalltalk, it's hard enough with the 'fancier' characters within the clan and it seems near impossible with everyone else. That leaves me with either no one to play with even when there's plenty of characters online or having to adapt to that level of smiles and laughs and pregnancy and drama. Or do ooc stuff otu of desperation and try and engage that one 'normal' character - jsut that that one happens to be a breed or whatever that my character wouldn't usually talk to - got to bend cour concept a little to have some fun. frustrating.

The thing is... you don't have to interact with any of them, really. And  you could say to yurself, "Why don't I see if I can encourage them to change their ways in an IC way? Like calling that merchant a pansy until she's encouraged to learn how to use a tomahawk and unmans me? Or enticing that Aide to do something incredibly dangerous and possibly stupid that gets her fired and ending up out grebbing salt?"

I don't have to, but there seems to be no one else every time I log on, like I said. And calling someone a pansy would just result in a lot of
talk (clasping their hand in front of their mouth) Oh what a horrible thing to say!
:evil:

Yea, griping won't do much but I have to blow off some steam that didn't even exist the last time I saw that topic come up.   you don't have to read it, alright?

[FightClub]

I am often guilty of saying "you swing like a woman"

And "only a woman bleeds like that."

And "Babies are stds."

but that last one really had no relevance, it's just a fact -- so wrap it up kids.

I once, hit on a woman, with a moustache and big muscles, and laughed the entire time.

I'm sorry -- but if icly it was the shizzle to mudfuck a bahamet, people wouldn't do it, good rp or not, cause they still want to rock princess barbies sox, as do I...

[EvilRoeSlade]

Or do ooc stuff otu of desperation and try and engage that one 'normal' character - jsut that that one happens to be a breed or whatever that my character wouldn't usually talk to - got to bend cour concept a little to have some fun. frustrating.

Hey hey hey.  Just because it's a half-elf doesn't mean you can't use the say command in its presence.  Make fun of it.  Patronize it.  Bully it.  Whatever.  Just don't ignore it.  That isn't fun for anyone.

But on topic, I sympathize with you Nao.  What you are saying is the reason I won't play in Tuluk anymore.

[Nao]

Hey hey hey.  Just because it's a half-elf doesn't mean you can't use the say command in its presence.  Make fun of it.  Patronize it.  Bully it.  Whatever.  Just don't ignore it.  That isn't fun for anyone.

I meant that I'm very tempted to get WAY more involved with pc's like than I usually would if I didn't bend what's ic to do and what not a little for ooc reasons...

[Angela Christine]

I'm reminded of a family reunion I attended 18 years ago in northern Alberta where some old guy (a great uncle, I think) from a small town was talking about some other guy that lives in his town and said: "He's a nigger, but he's a pretty good guy."  The old guy really thought he was being nice and probably didn't even realize that what he was saying could be considered extremely offensive.  He thought this other person was a nigger, but he was a good nigger so that was ok.  :roll:  It wasn't particularily mean spirited, there aren't many black people in the far north so there isn't any real racially motivated -hate- towards them, they are more oddities than anything.  There could be trouble if a black man tried to date someone's white relative.


I'd like to see more of this unconcious kind of prejudice against half-elves, and others not of your character's race.  You can work with them.  You can sit and enjoy a drink with 'em, almost like they are real people, but you never forget what they are.  You'll drop 'em in an instant if something better comes along.


Angela Christine

[FightClub]

I'm reminded of a family reunion I attended 18 years ago in northern Alberta where some old guy (a great uncle, I think) from a small town was talking about some other guy that lives in his town and said: "He's a nigger, but he's a pretty good guy."  The old guy really thought he was being nice and probably didn't even realize that what he was saying could be considered extremely offensive.  He thought this other person was a nigger, but he was a good nigger so that was ok.  :roll:  It wasn't particularily mean spirited, there aren't many black people in the far north so there isn't any real racially motivated -hate- towards them, they are more oddities than anything.  There could be trouble if a black man tried to date someone's white relative.


I'd like to see more of this unconcious kind of prejudice against half-elves, and others not of your character's race.  You can work with them.  You can sit and enjoy a drink with 'em, almost like they are real people, but you never forget what they are.  You'll drop 'em in an instant if something better comes along.


Angela Christine

Isn't that how things should be?