Additonal Subclasses

[Bogre]

I don't think subguilds have adverse effects on your character though.

[bloodfromstone]

I'm all for more subguilds, more guilds! The more customization the better.

(not helpful, I know)

[Cuusardo]

I always love how these are on the 'gimme' side of things, about about what they would be lacking in?  No I'm not grumpy, but if you want to balance it, balance it all around.

That is an interesting point.

[Manhattan]

potterer: ceramics, haggle, analyze, value

[Anael]

Pickpocket thief. bahh!
warrior Guard. bahh!

Some people actually like the idea of having higher skills from the beginning.

ranger archer bahh!
burglar thug Guhh!
assassin rebal Geesh.

Especially the last two are actually not bad concepts, as a (for example) rough and gritty mercenary/thug types. They both get quite a few skills they wouldn't get otherwise, I believe. Ranger/archer's pretty good, too.

I like how subguilds work now. They aren't balanced, but that's not their point, either.

Edit: pesky tag

[Angela Christine]

Spearman - spearmaking, throw, knifemaking (similar to Archer)

Savage - hunt, throw, skin  (similar to Hunter)

Tanner - skin, tan, leatherworking


The first two are both attempts to make it easier to be a more traditional spear-based hunter.  Bows are fairly sophisticated, complex weapons.  Cultures usually learn to throw things before they learn to construct bows, but as it is now the guilds most suited to being hunters don't start with throw, and the guilds that can throw lack other important hunting skills.  Throwing is also less expensive to learn, because your knives and spears much more likely to be recoverable than arrows, bolts or slingstones.  Or perhaps I simply envy the gith for volleys of spears they have rained down on me time and time again.   :twisted:


Angela Christine

[Foamy007]

I like AC, its simple, but I like it. I would like to see that.

[Manhattan]

Savage - hunt, throw, skin,  Eat PC Corpses (similar to Hunter)

[Foamy007]

I agree manhattan.... and have coded results and while we are at it throw in human and dwarf hides along with elves and how about craftables from those items as well... like a human skin belt. or dwarf skin backpack.... and how about a few strings of ears and possibly a human finger necklace or a nose....  :twisted:

[Nao]

I agree manhattan.... and have coded results and while we are at it throw in human and dwarf hides along with elves and how about craftables from those items as well... like a human skin belt. or dwarf skin backpack.... and how about a few strings of ears and possibly a human finger necklace or a nose....  :twisted:

Soooooo cool!

[Maybe42or54]

The elf skin backpack would always be stealing things though.


Ac. Wonderful addition. I like savage.

[Maybe42or54]

We need more subguilds that will benifit the RP instead of the player's skills.

When subguilds are good.
merchant reball?  OOOOooo
warrior linguist   oooooer
watermage hunter root!
assassin archer hmmm
buglar house servant !!!
pickpocket forester

Thunder Cat, It sounds like these are trying to get the most skills for their buck. Not for additional RP. Your first set of examples did that.

Slaver: Guard, subdue. Sap

Runaway: Flee, palm, knifemaking

Gladiator: Slight endurance bonus, low capped kick, LC disarm

Laborer: Slight strength bonus, higher endurance, (or a bonus to carrying weight)

Farmhand: Forage_food, polearms, bonus to strength (think pitchforks people!)

Brawler: Hand to hand bonus, subdue, low capped kick or charge, higher drinking ability

Spearman - spearmaking, throw, knifemaking (similar to Archer)

Savage - hunt, throw, skin (similar to Hunter)

Tanner - skin, tan, leatherworking

I don't like Runaway because.. Well.. Why would running away from being a slave teach you knifemaking and how to palm things?

[Jherlen]

Agree with Maybe42 above... subguilds probably benefit RP more when they -do- line up with the player's main guild. A pickpocket forester? Huh?

I like the idea of subguilds affecting your starting stats (if they don't already.)

I'm also surprised no one's suggested combatant subguilds yet, even something like:

Weaponsmaster - Piercing weapons, Slashing weapons, Chopping weapons, bludgeoning weapons.

If giving someone all four of these is too powerful it could always be trimmed, but a subguild to start someone a bit above green newbie level in combat would be nice.

[Maybe42or54]

That is an idea worth going after Jherlen.

Since I don't think people study combat IG. They learn through trial and error, or shown specific things. Weaponsmasters don't seem armageddon-ish to me.

Maybe these subguilds?

Tulukian- Bonus to shield use and piercing weapons, bonus to chopping weapons, disarm, bonus to dual_wielding

Allanaki- Bonus to dual_wielding, bash, bonus to slashing weapons, bonus to parry, bonus to Two_handed

Red Stormer- Bonus to fighting in the dark or extreme winds, while opponent gets a negative, bonus to dual_wielding

Spearman- Bonus to piercing weapons, bonus to two_handed, bonus to Archery, Throw, Spear_making

Shady- Bonus to piercing weapons, subdue, bonus to unarmed, climb, Knife_making

They would have to pick the mainguild to get the bonuses though.
Any thoughts to this side of the combat spectrum?

[Bogre]

Alright, my thoughts on a runaway. A slave that somehow garnered something precious, maybe a chipped blade of a dagger, would want to keep it secret. Thus palm. Knifemaking because it gives a bit of variety, and because a runaway without many resources would have to scrounge for his own weapons, and of course, the easiest to make would be a crude knife of some sort.

I think the problem with creating more RP and job based subclasses is that there is no crafting skill outside of what is already covered in the existing subguilds. If we had a alchoholic drink making skill, we could have a Brewer subguild. If we had isilt crafts, then we could have Isilt-carvers. (Actually, we do have Isilt crafts...so lets have an Isilt-carving subguild!)...but etc...If we had coded skills to give to subguilds, then we could have coded subguilds. If there is no coded skills, then there isn't a point in subguilds besides name...which you can do IC anyhow.

Just my thoughts.

[EvilRoeSlade]

I don't think any new subguild should offer a skill that isn't offered already.  Or listen, for that matter.

[House Rising Sun]

I put in an idea months ago for a cavalry subguild. Rangers are mostly the only folks that can charge or control a mount without hands, but they'd be hard-pressed to fill the role of heavy cavalry for a large military force. The idea would be to give soldiers the option of specializing in mounted fighting without going 100% redneck with their main guild. May not be a great idea, but I think it could be fun.

[WarriorPoet]

I put in an idea months ago for a cavalry subguild. Rangers are mostly the only folks that can charge or control a mount without hands, but they'd be hard-pressed to fill the role of heavy cavalry for a large military force. The idea would be to give soldiers the option of specializing in mounted fighting without going 100% redneck with their main guild. May not be a great idea, but I think it could be fun.

I love this idea.

AC's spearman guild is also another I would vote for, probably the Savage, as well. Wretched, primitive cave-man character would be great. Throw is crucial.

-WP

[Rhyden]

Knifey - knifemaking, throw, + stabbing weapons (maybe backstab)

Axey McAxe- axemaking, bash, + chopping weapons

Sword Specialist - swordmaking, parry, + slashing weapons

Clubey – clubmaking, sap, + bludgeoning weapons

Black Marketer - pickmaking, poison, value, haggle

Tentmaker – tentmaking, tanning

Wagon Constructor – wagon making, pilot (probably make good friends with forester)

Herbologist – floristry, brew

Rider/Cavalry – charge, ++ ride skill

Smuggler – sleight of hand, pilot, value, allundean

Just some more to consider. Some are a bit extreme, but I'm just putting these ones out there.

[Manhattan]

there should be a subguild that knows how to breed animals
there should be a pottery subguild totally. clay and ceramics is the shit
there should be a subguild that knows how to brew alcoholic drinks and make spirits like turn wine into brandy or ale into whiskey
there should be craftable items from PC corpses like the elven skin backpack

The body of a tall, green-eyed elf is here
>get body
You get the body of a tall, green-eyed elf
It is light
>drop body
>skin body

<worn on back>   a pale-blue leather strapped backback
>exam pack
This backpack seems to be made from the pale-blue skin of an elf.

omgomg

>distill wine
You work at altering the drink
You make a bottle of brandy from your skills
>drink brandy
You drink the brandy
You are extremely intoxicated
You trip over your feet and fall flat on your face

>pair kank 2.kank
You lead a yellow kank next to a mottled, purplish-brown kank
You breed the animals from your skill

>craft clay
You could make a porcelain jug from that
You could make a dark-brown clay flagon from that
You could make a tiny earthenware cup from that

[Rhyden]

>pair kank 2.kank
You lead a yellow kank next to a mottled, purplish-brown kank
You breed the animals from your skill

Heh.

You lead an gargantuan mekillot to a enormous bahamet.
You breed a mekamet.

[Maybe42or54]

Knifey - knifemaking, throw, + stabbing weapons (maybe backstab)

Tentmaker – tentmaking, tanning

Wagon Constructor – wagon making, pilot (probably make good friends with forester)

I'd shoot you if those were made into subguilds.

Some things should not be put into a subguild:
Poison, tent making, wagon making, backstab, disarm, etc..

[Rhyden]

Knifey - knifemaking, throw, + stabbing weapons (maybe backstab)

Tentmaker – tentmaking, tanning

Wagon Constructor – wagon making, pilot (probably make good friends with forester)

I'd shoot you if those were made into subguilds.

Some things should not be put into a subguild:
Poison, tent making, wagon making, backstab, disarm, etc..

Just ideas, as I said, I was just throwing them out there. Perhaps something similar to one of my ideas would be nice to have, perhaps not.

But as for wagonmaking and tentmaking, I thought maybe having a subguild with such skills might be good to have. I've never seen any character with wagonmaking or tentmaking and thought this might actually allow some players to use these skills. Of course, if this was implemented (which I hardly doubt, and I myself don't want to be), then the subguilds with the more powerful skills would be limited solely to that skill. Still, I was just throwing out top-of-my-head ideas.

[Whira's Luck]

The only few things that struck my interest here:

tentmaking - I don't think this should be in its own subclass. If it was going to be given out, I'd say it should go to (possibly) nomads and/or mercenaries. People who spend a lot of time camped out in the wastes, at any rate. I could definitely see nomads with this sort of a skill, since it seems like nomadic communities would be used to patching, sewing, erecting and dissembling tents. (I almost want to see a skill added for erecting and dissembling tents).

knifeworking: There's already at least two subguilds that have it. It's just not necessary to be added to another.

beast-taming: Be a ranger. I don't really see the feasibility of breeding one's own kanks or animals. If you really want to train an animal, there's always roleplaying. It's really not something that can be done all the time in either case since there's so many factors involved in animal husbandry and animal training that turning it into a skill would rob the game, imho. Most of the creatures in the game are wild beasts. If tame, it takes someone with a real gift and affinity to tame them to the point where they'd even be rideable without bucking you off.

wagon-making: Abso-positively-not. This should not be a subguild skill. At all. Wagons are probably one of the pinnacles of zalanthan engineering. To be able to design and build a wagon should be something that you don't just 'pick up' when you're a kid but something you spend most of your life planning to learn, from learning the properties of wood, to the properties of bone, to nearly every other kind of building material. Keep in mind that the wagons are made -without metal of any kind- so we're not just talking about knocking a few nails into a few planks. These wagons are lucky they're able to go over the terrain they do without falling apart, and believe me, for a huge wagon made without any metal reinforcement, it's quite a feat of engineering. Let me restate emphatically that this should not ever be added to a subclass.

Cavalry - Not feasible. These aren't horses people are riding on, they're gigantic omniverous/carniverous insects and lizards people are riding on, so just being able to ride one should be a feat in itself (and it is).

No 'bonus to fighting' subguilds. If you want a bonus to subguild, just make a warrior.

What I'm seeing is a lot of ideas being hashed out that are already perfectly playable in-game, and it almost seems like people are treating subguilds as a way to round out their PC's with skills that don't come with the main guild... you know, to be uberl33+.  Subguilds aren't meant to do that, as far as I've been aware. They're there to fit into a background, something your character did in the past or specialized in, even if it's redundant to your main choice of guild or even if it's something you'll never even use in your pc's life. (if you want to make a spearman, just make a warrior/weaponcrafter and use a spear. You'll be badass with a spear, and you'll know how to make spears besides. Or make a warrior/whatever subguild has spearmaking).

That being said, two things that would be kind of nice to see would be a potter's subguild, and maybe a weaver's one, if these crafts were ever implemented.

Finally, and this may sound radical, something I wouldn't mind seeing is the house-servant subguild removed. Wait! Wait, just hear me out here! Give listen to the guard subguild (what better use of your time when you're just hanging out being a bodyguard to your employer?) and change guard subguild to have these skills (if they don't already), maybe even change the name to bodyguard: guard, listen, scan. And then give floristry to physicians, since they'd likely be the ones who knew the most about processing and drying flowers. Then, maybe add a cook subguild, for those who really want to a pc to start off knowing how to cook (a vastly under-rated skill).

[Sir Diealot]

Maybe, just maybe, Whira.. people are tired of making a PC who's trained his whole life as a mercenary/nomadic hunter.. But, when he gets IC, he has to spam train his skills in order to be able to succeed 50% of the time.. Maybe some people would prefer focusing in on the things their character did in their background, as opposed to getting a broad range.. Especially for the older characters.. Who come in at 30, with the skills of a retarded ten year old.. Then magically, in 3 days, get to be able to take on raptors.


Yanno, just maybe.