Freelance assassin.

[fearwig]

I'm a bit lost on how to approach the playing of a freelancer thug/assassin, an Allanaki to be specific. While the roleplay seems solid, especially in the rinth and even to some degree for pay in the Commoner's Quarters, I'm finding it hard to personally legitimize any sort of acts that would lead to my proper training. Hunting animals is right out, and killing kids and grampas in the 'rinth seems a bit out of character. Any advice? Should I abandon the loner approach and try to go Byn, or push for house guard work?

[Dracul]

For assasination. You brought it up...so..Backstab...a -very- hard skill to train.  OOCly..sure, you can just use it, but the way you wrote it seems you'll want to not do that twinkishly.

It -is- hard to train backstab though, very hard. My suggestion though would be to go ahead and join the byn, as a regulard merc though, no refrence of assasination.  Nothing non-freelance about that.

Some outpayment, and you get food and training for...well..how long? *shrug*  You can always get out of the byn.

[Marc]

How many trained killers start out as trained killers?

They've got to learn the basics somewhere like a gang, the byn (there I go repeat myself), or in House service.

[Akaramu]

You'll learn combat in the Byn, but it really isnt a backstab school either.

If Zalanthas was a realistic world, what could you do?

You could maybe try and be a house guard / aide, and when you have earned a good degree of trust, hint towards your superior about sneakier skills. They'll either kick out out, kill you, or give you an opportunity to train those skills. Either way, you'll have fun.

You could find some dead bodies and dissect them, and find out where to strike to hit the most vital organs. (Would require some realistic solo rp to be logged and sent to imms for a skill boost).

You could find a teacher among the shady population.

You could attach some sort of target marker to one of your buddies and ask him to try and turn away / evade while you practice sneaking up to them with a harmless toy dagger. And practice trying to hit the target. All with emotes. Again, this would require logs to be sent to imms for skill adjustment after some sessions. Unless you REALLY want to use the coded backstab skill on your poor buddy.  

:twisted:

I dont ever play assassins. Really. I just pretend. Stop looking at me!

:me moves stealthily to the south.

[EvilRoeSlade]

Don't join the Byn.  You'll regret it.

You're already a 'Rinther, so be a 'Rinther.  Not the desperate, struggling-to-survive kind of 'Rinther, although they're all that to a degree.  Be a thuggish bully.  Pick fights.  Decide you don't like how people are looking at you.  Don't go as far as to kill them.  Just messing them up will be enough to prove your point and enhance your skills.

You could also try to join the Guild.  I imagine that couldn't be a bad idea.

[Ghost]

You could find a teacher among the shady population.

Do that.

EDIT:

You could also try to join the Guild.  I imagine that couldn't be a bad idea.

You can do that as well.

Freelance assassin is a hard role.  Really.  You will bleed.  Suffer.. And cry desperately.

I had some ideas in my head about this issue for sometime.  I will return to it, once I list them down in a more clear way.

[fearwig]

Don't join the Byn.  You'll regret it.

You're already a 'Rinther, so be a 'Rinther.  Not the desperate, struggling-to-survive kind of 'Rinther, although they're all that to a degree.  Be a thuggish bully.  Pick fights.  Decide you don't like how people are looking at you.  Don't go as far as to kill them.  Just messing them up will be enough to prove your point and enhance your skills.

You could also try to join the Guild.  I imagine that couldn't be a bad idea.

This is how I've been pushing it so far. Pushing old folks and elves around, telling them how much I like their shoes and such. I've been trying to steer this character more toward the rinther side than the skilled, military-calibre assassin side, so I think this may be the way to continue for now, unless some opportunities present themselves.

And yes, I'm learning that I will bleed.

[Marc]

Don't join the Byn. You'll regret it.

Don't listen to that, expecially if you want to be a professional level killer.  Learning to fight is learning to fight, whether it's the byn, the streets or the army.

And think anyone is gonna care if your backstab is cruddyif your next four stabs kill the target?

Don't listen to the hype about an assassin not being able to stand up against a warrior toe to toe.  That might be true equally trained, so just don't be equally trained.  Be better, even if you take more beatings getting there.  It's all background story once you've done it.

That's the beauty (if that's the right term) of armags skill advancement.  It's so tedious for the raw combat stuff that to get anywhere you have to spend a truly astronomical amount of time doing it.

Once you have a reason to kill people, you'll get better at it.  No need to create reasons, just create opportunity for interaction and let your characters personality take over.

[House Rising Sun]

One real life assassin told of how he got into the job while doing an interview from prison. The 'union' of sorts wanted to make sure he was the real deal, so they took him to a street corner, pointed someone out, and told him to kill the guy. It may have been a real target, or just some unlucky random sucker. Either way, he walked up to the fella and shot him.

If you're going to be playing the type of person who can kill without hesitation, then there's nothing twinkish about killing without hesitation. There are many ways a character can go that will lead to actual coded combat and backstabbing opportunities, and those are the types that should end up being hardened and threatening anyway. In Zalanthas, however, it might be a good idea to make sure a character is toughened up enough to handle failing a backstab, because he probably will for a while. Think of it this way: You really want to hurt that son of a bitch, fairness be damned. So ambush him in the alley. Backstab is the coded version of playing dirty.

The RL reflections of the assassin guild on Armageddon are mostly unstable individuals that got their abilities and techniques independently, by being unnerving psychopaths. The rest, we can imagine, are formally trained, though every fictional archetype we see ends up falling towards the unstable end eventually. Those, to me, would be the Guild employees or agents of any other clan.

[Anael]

Just to add to what others said here - a whole lot of good ideas - I believe there are other ways to get your skills better without using them. At the basic level, teach would be one of them (alright, it'd be pretty hard to find a teacher and AFAIK, this is really only for basics). Perhaps I'd try find some non-coded way to learn - talking to some medic-type about where  the vital organs are and learning about anatomy, discussing weak points of different types of armor with an armorer... stuff like that. I imagine it could cause some nice RP interaction, and perhaps the Immortals would like it enough to boost the skill a little... or not. :twisted:

[Crashloft]

The best way to become a brutish nasty killer is to start out that way.  Choose your friends and choose you enemies.  Be loyal to your friends and attempt to kill your enemies.  It's simple.  The point being, you have to start out somewhere.  Pick a point and run with it.

[Assassin]

Fearwig:

If there is something I can say about a "freelance assassin", it is:

Never ever give up.

Through my own experience, I tell you you will have your hard time as you try to become the ideal "assassin".  And those hard times sometimes get real nasty and bring the idea of giving up.  I myself, have thought about retiring the character at least four times.  And now, I am glad, that I did not do it.

Most of the suggestions by other people are solid.  Keep them in mind.  But one thing to highlight:  Finding someone to teach you some of what you need to learn.  It is -not- a fairy tale.  It is always possible to find someone, higher in skill than you, in the area you want to learn.  
Again, from my experience:  I have had more than just a few aprentices.  And one of them made it long enough to be a -partner-, not an aprentice.  
Just make sure, you have something to offer your so said teacher.  Be it coins, or some precious service.

I can also say, you cant count yourself as an assassin from the beginning.  You have to improve.  And it is a long and slow process.  So, either start as something else, but not assassin, or do like a dwarf:  Focus.  Focus to the longterm.  Both of these are good enough to carry you to the realm you want to get into.

Byn, or any other military related organization is not going to make you a master assassin.  Maybe a master fighter.  But that is not a step in the wrong direction.

If you make it long, you will have a lot of fun.  Believe me.
But until then, it is a test of your patience.

[FiveDisgruntledMonkeysWit]

One thing I will add (though my experience with the assassin guild is limited) is that if you start off in the 'Rinth, and spend most of your time there, the chance to use your stealth and combat skills will present itself. You can live for a reasonably long time in the 'Rinth by simply defending yourself, and retreating when neccesary. And your combat skills will improve at a satisfactory rate by doing so.

[Dracul]

One thing I will add (though my experience with the assassin guild is limited) is that if you start off in the 'Rinth, and spend most of your time there, the chance to use your stealth and combat skills will present itself. You can live for a reasonably long time in the 'Rinth by simply defending yourself, and retreating when neccesary. And your combat skills will improve at a satisfactory rate by doing so.

Hmm. Another thing, I remember someone to quote long long ago, bu tI agree with completely.

In the Rinth: "attempts to move stealthy west" ...is better than walking. Even if youre a warrior or a merchant, -trying- to be a little sneaky and failing is better than walking boldly down the alleys.

[fearwig]

My problem in approaching this is that killing kids and grampas for their clothes, while RP acceptable, almost seems... unacceptable, because invariably you wind up doing "runs" through known locations of the "same" kid, the same grampa, and so forth.

How much personal leniency would you give yourself, in this regard? Is there any other good way to make subsistence money?

[Nidhogg]

Fearwig, yes. That's absolutely true. Even in the rinth killing npcs just to kill npcs is just killing npcs to kill npcs.

However, in the rinth it may be easier to find people interested in engaging in violence with you.

[deinol]

In my mind, money isn't all that necassary. Getting food and water is. So if you are desperate and in the 'rinth, look for some rats or other vermin. They may not taste good, but you can eat them. Try and remember how desperately poor you are, and do what it takes to survive. The longer you live, the better you will inevitably become.

And to emphasize Anonymous Assassin's point, just because you have the class assassin, it doesn't mean your occupation has to be one to start out with. It's a long road, but if you try to rush it, that's how you end up dead quickly.

[Player99]

Try and remember how desperately poor you are, and do what it takes to survive.

I've always wanted to comment on this. Now, it has been a while since I have had a rinth character, but do they still start with the same 1000 give or take coins? I always got pissed when I got the money because I didn't know what to do with it, and I certainly wasn't poor with a grand in my pocket, and you certainly can't give it to an npc upon starting. So my suggestion is (if this already isn't in!?) to lower a rinther's starting cash to 200-400, max.

[wizturbo]

Try and remember how desperately poor you are, and do what it takes to survive.

I've always wanted to comment on this. Now, it has been a while since I have had a rinth character, but do they still start with the same 1000 give or take coins? I always got pissed when I got the money because I didn't know what to do with it, and I certainly wasn't poor with a grand in my pocket, and you certainly can't give it to an npc upon starting. So my suggestion is (if this already isn't in!?) to lower a rinther's starting cash to 200-400, max.

A 'rinthi can easily spend 1,000 coins on IC related materials for their profession.  Shady professions have rather expensive tools for their trade.  You can always pick up a spice addiction too, if you have excess coin, that'll drain your sid real quick.

[WarriorPoet]

I always got pissed when I got the money because I didn't know what to do with it.

Simple.

Type: junk coins

[Dracul]

I always got pissed when I got the money because I didn't know what to do with it.

Simple.

Type: junk coins

And...since when does that work?
(Unless it's new code, that doesn't work)



Sugestion as to the original topic though...tatoos...or give it to the bartender oocly.

[Player99]

I guess I always assumed you couldn't junk them because there's a number, and you can't type junk '999 coins', and its infisable to junk them one by one.. but my point is that the typical rinther won't have a thousand coin rainy day fund. I realize the starting money is to get your character basic stuff to indicate background, but they shouldn't have that much to their name if the background is the rinth.

[joyofdiscord]

Newbie coins are OOC.  The background of a char from Allanak proper may call for much more than 1000 coins of stuff, but I don't think anyone here is about to say we should just hand out more whenever someone thinks they need it.  Plus 1000 coins just isn't as much as it seems, especially when it may represent an lifetime of accumulated tattoos and belongings, plus certain other things about the nature of the rinth that are too IC to mention.  And for that matter, not every rinther is dirt poor.  Some people aren't stuck in the rinth because of economics.  There are cultural factors as well.  There is much more to the rinth than is dreamt of in your philosophy, Horatio.

[fearwig]

Gotcha, re: the NPC killing. I felt terrible doing it, but I couldn't figure out any other way to survive, frankly. Waiting around for that random person to kill isn't going to get you far when you can't survive long enough to train.

See, I was fortunate enough (as you might say) to be relieved of my unrealistic cash early on. I'm enjoying it a bit more, in some ways, but making ends meet is not easy, where food and drink go, because as best I understood you had to buy these things unless you were, say, a ranger.

I wasn't aware until now that you -could- eat vermin, frankly. I tried, to little success. Do you have to be starving, first? Can they be cooked? Will you extract liquid from that, as well?

Newbie, remember, even if I'm becoming less of one each day.

[Bestatte]

Syntax for getting useable meat from a rat:

skin rat

Note, if you don't have the skin skill, your chance of success is marginal at best. But now at least you know it's possible, and the syntax to make it happen

[Agent_137]

Also, I think sensible rinthi's would purchase food and cook food from the grocer in town. The food sold in the rinth is absurdly expensive.  Find your way into town and find the place that sells in bulk. Buy from there, cook. Just like you do in real life if you want to live on the cheap.

travel cakes = ramen

[Northlander]

I don't think the average 'rinther would be allowed into the outside grocer.

I don't think he would try, either. The 'rinth is what home these people have, it is what they know and what they feel secure in. Whether it's fear of law, of  the unknown or of rejection, there are reasons other than the obvious that not many born in the 'rinth ever leave it.

This is why the prices of the inside and the outside can vary so wildly while both side's businesses still stay afloat.
It's not Allanak anymore.

[fearwig]

Sadly, it's not really possible to live in the 'rinth and only the 'rinth in Arm, as best I can tell. I'm to the point of considering retiring this character if I can't find an RP-reasonable way of supporting him, given my current knowledge of the game. Less than 20 hours on him, so I'm not too worried about the loss.

Skinning isn't a skill I have, needless to say, so I don't think getting meat off rats and whatnot is very practical. I would think, really, that in destitute circumstances, -anyone- could get edible meat off a rat. There's some degree to which any mud seems to deny practical, basic skills to all characters in favor of skill speciation, if you see what I mean. Skinning a rat for meat isn't really rocket science--even your average Wall Street broker could do it, if trapped and starving. And I guarantee you they'd get -something- off it they could cook and eat, even on the first try.

Without finances, a 'rinther, especially a noncrafter, can't survive without getting a really lucky player kill. I don't think that's specific to 'rinthers, either, at least not particularly.

I would think there would be some more 'general' ways of making subsistence money--not easy ways, but practical ones.


Don't view this as a gripe--this is just my assessment, as per my understanding of the situation. I thought I was missing out on some details or alternatives, but it's looking like there aren't that many, judging from the info I've found here. I like the character, and the idea in general, but I don't think the numbers work themselves out without resorting to twinkishness.

Is there something I'm missing? Is there a generic, non-assassin way to survive this period of the character's life? Will the skin skill become usable in a reasonable period, such that he can nab his own food, even without an appropriate subguild to lend the skill? What about water, then? I realize a lot of this is IC, but there are IC factors that don't really translate to the game perfectly, as I see it, so I don't feel that it's inappropriate to ask this.

[Nidhogg]

Fearwig, if you are frustrated by the rinth but reluctant to give up on it, you are welcome to write to me or Daigon. If you play an elf you might want to contact Bhagharva. We can't give you a steel katana of doom, but we can give you some advice.
-Nidhogg

[Nidhogg]

Oh, please remember to cc the mud and other rinth imms.

[Northlander]

I agree, you should idea giving the skin skill at a low cap to everyone. Nobles  and Kadians would get it too, but since the skill hasn't a passive use it wouldn't really affect anything.

Eh, nevermind. I just did it :oops:

[fearwig]

Fearwig, if you are frustrated by the rinth but reluctant to give up on it, you are welcome to write to me or Daigon. If you play an elf you might want to contact Bhagharva. We can't give you a steel katana of doom, but we can give you some advice.
-Nidhogg

I'm consistently impressed and amazed by the level of interaction present here. Thanks a million, I might take you up on that.

I hope my posts haven't come across as bellyaching. I'm not so much even frustrated, per se, as trying to work out possibilities and alternatives, if you understand--I feel I've hit a wall, but I'm starting to see cracks in it, possibly. I am one of those oddballs who gets as much enjoyment out of talking about something as he does from doing it.

Thanks again.

[halfhuman]

Thank the Highlord for this post! As I've mentioned in a couple other posts in different topics, I LOOVE assassins.  But, I have the same EXACT problem and questions as fearwig!  The best way I've been able to ICly train was once when I made it look like I was an uber assassin, and so my character was obsessed with practicing the trade because not being able to back the appearance up would lead to a world of hurt.:shock:

The hard parts about training in the rinth are that the only people you could find any IC proffit from are the well armed.  Sure little kids and old men are easy targets, but you wouldn't expect them to have any sid, and unless it was a young or old elf...

Best way to practice your backstab in my eyes would be: Find a large friend. Say to your friend: Hey, lets go kill an elf, and use the sids to buy an ale!
Since, as the assassin, your character has a natural affinity for sneaking, make this plan:

Big guy goes in and does a little shoving, and picks a fight.  While them two are busy exchanging blows, sneak up from behind and get that feckin necker in his over-sized neck!  You can use backstab on fighting targets.

[Xamminy]

I don't want to say how, but it is possible to make ridiculous amounts of cash in the Rinth.  Existing solely off a non-crafting trade in the Rinth, I've assembled a remarkeable amount of 'sid.  You can figure these things out, I'm sure, but you'll have to stick with it.  The Rinth is a wonderful environment and often has some great PCs in there to interact with, so I'd suggest trying to stick it out, fearwig.  You'll appreciate it once you get really moving.

[The7DeadlyVenomz]

I'd mention here that I think backstab is a skill that should come to an assassin later, and be much deadlier upon inception.

Maybe when your assassin gets to 90% max effectiveness with a dagger, or maybe upon mastery of parry...in any case, I think backstab should be a skill which is deadly from the bat, and much more isolated in possession. Maybe start out backstab at 90% max, and the rest is trainable. But you would only get it after XXX days of play.

*shrug*

[Incognito]

I'll take a shot at answering:

For starters, I agree with EvilRoeSlade, if you're already a rinther, dont join the byn, stay in the rinth - over the long run, you'll learn faster in the rinth.

2 basic principles you should follow: The first is to try and make friends who will watch your back, and the second is to pick fights. Picture yourself as a hungry and poor homeless bastard who every once in a while gets overwhelmed to steal a bread roll from the next guy. Often the result will be a scuffle, which will allow you to raise your assassin skills, in a realistic manner.

[fearwig]

(Edit.)