(Dis)similarities between Dune and Armageddon.

[Marauder Moe]

On a side note: am I the only one who doesn't believe/agree/like it when people equate Armageddon to Dune?  Other than both involving a desert world (Arrakis is WAY harsher than Zalanthan wilderness, though) there aren't THAT many similarities.

The whole spice and house thing is strikingly similar as well, though.

Other than the words "House" and "Spice" I disagree.  But perhaps we should take this to another thread...

And here it is.

[Dracul]

I like Dune...Ive started reading the books. But Zalanthas is not Arrakis...well...unless we're in a section of the deep desert shielded somehow from the harsh weather...err....naaa. (anyways...magic? hell no)

Gith...dwarves...halflings...FORESTS!...not arrakis at all.

Just hitting myself up on that side.  But Dune is an incredible book...and an incredible movie.

[Cuusardo]

Spice (read: melange) is also quite a bit different in the world of Dune.  It is a drug that basically gives the user some sort of psychic abilities, visions, truthsense, etc. and is highly addictive.  It only comes in one variety, unlike Zalanthan spice.  And as far as I know, spice on Arrakis has a drastically different origin than spice on Zalanthas.

p.s. I am over 3/4 of the way through Dune Messiah, and will be starting Children of Dune very soon.  Great story!

[Angela Christine]

It is useful as a reference, because it is a desert setting that isn't in Africa, Arabia or Death Valley.  Zalanthans aren't Arabs, and they aren't !Kung, they are something distinct from earth.  They aren't from Dune either, but at least that is a non-earth setting.


AC

[Ghost]

Shield wall is a similarity between Dune and Zalanthas as well.

Worms..Worms?  Salt worms and Dune's Sand Woms are not the same as well.

The issue of houses can be counted as a similarity.

And perhaps Desert elves can be related to Fremen?  They are not the same of course, but they can be related.

[Trenidor]

Actually Forests are in Arrakis...or will be. That's why they have all those water deposits in the desert and the Ecologist guy.

They're trying to build a Planet with Trees and plants, the only problem is that it destroys the spice when you do that, so the houses that go to Arrakis to mine Spice highly object to freemen going about doing things that would destroy their spice industry.

So basically you've got 5 major things from dune that Armageddon has:

1. Houses control organizations
2. Spice brings effects when you smoke it
3. Desert planet with harsh storms and harsh heat
4. Freemen people (tribal people) who roam the desert.
5. People don't use guns or lasers there, they use Kylori knives swords and the like

ok so maybe there's no coinsidence

[Marauder Moe]

The only things that Dune-universe Houses have in common with Zalanthan Houses are the word "House", the family lineage, and somewhat specialized economies.  In Dune, the government was mosty Feudal (I consider this the key difference).  Houses would openly fight/kill/assassinate eachother and the Emperor had only a very loose control over them.  The royal families in Dune were also much smaller, probably no more than a dozen full-blooded family members per house, if that.

The Spice Melange was not smoked.  Also it was good for you, had no down-side when the immediate effects wore off, gave people psychic powers in large doses, and turned your eyes blue if you used it a lot.

Arrakis is WAY harsher than Zalanthas, and the Fremen reflect that.  No tribal group (not even Blackwing) can even come close to competing with the badassness of the Fremen.


The reason I point out these difference is that when people say "Armageddon is like Dune" and such it could lead someone to false assumptions.  They might assume that the noble houses fight with eachother (as in, all out war) a lot.  They might assume that the desert is so harsh that nothing can live in it.  They might assume that anyone who DOES live in it (tribals) are going to be ruthlessly effecient warriors and highly xenophobic.  Armageddon is a rich and UNIQUE world and I think drawing loose comparisons like that does it injustice.[/quote]

[Anonymous]

There are concepts that are similar between Dune and Armageddon, but not cloned.  Sure, the roles and locations of houses are not the same, but a house controlling all the spice is similar.  Sure Dune spice is different than Arm spice, but the idea that spice taken from the sands of a desert world messes with you is strikingly similar.

If you are going to discount those similarities because they aren't exactly alike then I guess that ends the discussion.  To me it's the same as the similarities between the Last Starfighter and Star Wars.

[Delirium]

There are a few clans ingame that are remarkably similar to certain organizations in Dune; I'll refrain from saying more as it'd be delving into documentation that isn't readily available.

[Spoon]

There's no Sting on Zalanthas. Bonus.

The similarities between Dune and Armageddon are more than the ones people are
listing, which are actually between Arrakis and Zalanthas.  It's not so much
about being on a desert planet, spice, worms, or tribal humans that have shared
qualities with the Fremen.  The overlap is much the same as what they both share
with the Cyberpunk theme.

Namely that they describe a closed system of resources with only small degrees
of shift in control between a few organizations.  Things are so codified that
even recognized society as strict rules, the Faufreluches, outside of which a
small population exists.  Societies like the Fremen who have what most readers
consider adventure as a result of adversity. Or the lives that the characters
of most players live, non-noble/templar/merchants who have no inherent power or
recognition from society and have to either live off of the system or compete
for the limited bits of power too minute for the system to control.

Dune describes that system, but the story of it is how the system becomes so
rigid in its need to control the power driving it that it can be held hostage
and manipulated.  The story of Dune isn't so much sci-fi as it is about the
enviroment for revolution stemming from economic reliance on a finite supply.
The sci-fi is when the story is told, not what it is. The same as the Time
Machine is only superficially about travelling through time.  You could easily
replace Spice with Oil and draw comparisons between DUne and modern day Earth.

Obviously the spice on Zalanthas is not the single resource that drives
civilization the way it does on Arrakis.  It's also not the obsidian which is
so plentiful that people use it for everything from money, to weapons and
armor, to artwork.  And it isn't the water, which any starting Vivaduan can
conjure up in abundance. It's the magick, the resource the Sorcerer Kings used
to fuel their rise to power, found their cities, and conquer their enemies.

Not so easy for someone to threaten as destroying the cycle that makes spice on
Arrakis.  But that's what everyone thought in Dune until the secret of spice
was figured out and with it the means to end it all.  In Cyberpunk the common
resource that drives everything is information, and anyone who can manipulate
it has power.

All three also generate the anti-hero.  The mostly amoral character who can,
and often does, commit acts that people would consider evil and dastardly in
the persuit of some goal that at its heart is entirely personal in nature but
results in a greater good.  These characters usually settle the cosmic balance,
delivering bad people their comeupance and rewarding good people in an indirect
fashion.  Along the way good people are often destroyed and evil people
made powerful to illustrate the indifferent nature of the universe.  Much the
way a powerful sandstorm will gobble up clean living desert folk in the blink
of an eye but leave that shriveled up defiler in his tower alone.  The universe
rewards circumstance not motive while the anti-hero does exactly the
opposite.

See also: Any character played by Clint Eastwood in any western he made up to,
and including, Unforgiven.

Anyway, that's what I think.

[Agent_137]

Also see the Fallout series of single player computer RPGs.

[Dracul]

Oooohh...Fallout.

*shiver*

Fallout Tactics was nothing like the rpgs though. Ive played the first games through too many times I think.