Social structure, a reminder

[Gargath]

http://www.armageddon.org/general/ranktable.html

[mansa]

I've always felt that the merchant side of things are out of wack.  A senior agent or merchant should have more political sway than a bastard noble.

[My 2 sids]

No way, mansa:!:  According to the docs, everything is run by noble's blood and commoner status is directly related to how close the commoner is to that noble blood.  If merchants are to continue to have such a drastic change and influence in the world (by status, power of money, or as in the other thread fads and politics themselves) then I hope that some of the nobility feels threatened by this could-be upset to power.

[A Social Kank]

Clearly this was pointed out for a reason.  Now, while I wouldn't expect much detail to be given, for the sake of protecting IC events, but what exactly isn't being followed?

I suppose also I'm a little unclear about how the chart applies to the lower half.  What exactly does being of a higher social status (but not a noble) mean?  Should great house merchants be sucking up to noble house aides?  Should house guard captains be able to order about militia privates?  And as for bastard nobles, aren't they more or less commoners that are born into house employment (with a little extre preferential treatment)?  I would think that a noble bastard would still have to earn their status within the house employ.

Also, where does the Atrium and the Byn fit in on this chart?

[FiveDisgruntledMonkeysWit]

Also, where does the Atrium and the Byn fit in on this chart?

As commoners, 'cause that's what they are.

[Angela Christine]

What does it mean to have social status?

* The person with the highest social status is the person that other people will defer to - think of it as the person who, when entering a room in a group, would get bowed to first.

* The person with the highest social status is the one whose story gets believed or credited the most highly - in a dispute, they are the one who would get listened to by the Templarate first.

Bootlicking and bowing are unnecessary, except for nobles and templars.  

You generally don't mess with people two ranks above you, and treat them with at least token respect.

You generally don't want to start something with a person within two ranks of you, at least not in public.  When the dung hits the wind you don't know if you'll really have enough influence to come out on top.  Generally you will treat your peers with courtesy.

People more than two ranks below you are meat.  Ok, maybe not meat, but you expect them to treat you with at least token respect, and you feel free to snub or ignore them if you have something more interesting going on.


So a militia member usually will not harrass a Senior merchant without orders, but he may shake down an unaffilliated commoner.  Likewise a senior merchant may decline to deal with unaffiliated commoners at all, even when she has nothing better to do, insisting that they seek out a junior merchant because she only deals with "important" clients.


As for the Byn and the Atrium, I'd treat them just like merchant houses, they simply sell labour instead of merchandise.  The heads of the Byn and Atrium would be like senior merchants.  

Context has a place as well.  In the Gaj the Captain of the Byn might have more prestige than the head of the Atrium, but the situation might be reversed in the Trader's in.  On the Fale estate, people that the Fale's like may have higher temporary status than people they dislike, even if their chart status is the same.  In Allanak in particular, a Salaar or Kadian merchant might have higher status than a Kurac merchant, even if they are the same place on the chart, because Kurac has a history of trouble with the 'nak government.  The chart is just a guideline.

AC

[wizturbo]

Also note, this is -social- status.  A noble will always have a higher social status then a merchant house high official.  However, if you think for a second that some bastard noble would have more political and economic power then a high ranking merchant house member, your crazy.

Even the Heads of a noble houses would be polite to a senior ranking merchant house member.  Think in the real world, how enormously powerful political leaders treat the controlling shareholders of say...a massive oil company.  Or a major weapons manufacturer.  And thats in a world with competition.  Try imagining how they'd be treated if there was no competition.

[FiveDisgruntledMonkeysWit]

wizturbo wrote:

Think in the real world, how enormously powerful political leaders treat the controlling shareholders of say...a massive oil company. Or a major weapons manufacturer.

Oh, hohoho! Zing!
But seriously. Good comparison. I concur.

[Cuusardo]

So where is the rank table for Tuluk?

[Bestatte]

Rank table for Tuluk:

Winrothol and Tenneshi nobles - important. Be nice, expect to pay a lot of sids to arrange their assassination.

Templars - very important. Be even nicer, but be careful not to piss off the Winrothol or Tenneshi nobles if you agree with a templar that disagrees with the noble about anything.

Merchant house family members - if you want something from them, be nicer to them than you would be to even a templar in a bad mood. If you don't want something from them, be civilized but don't blow a gasket if one of them doesn't like your character much.

Legionairres - just stay out of their way. Don't bother them and they won't bother you. Hopefully.

Clanned guards - try to pretend they're not there. If you have to acknowledge their existence, smile at them. They like that.

Everyone else - just keep on keepin on and don't sweat the small stuff.

How's that for a rank table for Tuluk?

[Anonymous]

Also note, this is -social- status.  A noble will always have a higher social status then a merchant house high official.  However, if you think for a second that some bastard noble would have more political and economic power then a high ranking merchant house member, your crazy.

I agree here.  Behind the scenes power is one thing and something that needs to be earned.  What is shown to the public is another.

[Cuusardo]

I meant an official rank table for Tuluk.

[Bogre]

If I had excel on my computer I'd etch one out.

[My 2 sids]

My guess is Tuluk's status is the same.  The only difference would be bastard children and concubines.

Once again, until the game changes ICly or the helpfiles themselves change I don't think we should really play that differently.