Devil?

[Spud]

Ok, so I know that in Arm there's a god like guy, but what I want to know is if there is a devil like being. Earth have the devil or Satan, what does Arm have? :twisted:

[Agent_137]

there's no god-like guy in zalanthas.

krath is the sun, no one worships it but tribal freaks and some dirty magickers.

your god is the guy who runs your city. unless your a tribal freak. then things are different.

there's no devil figure, either, but most people agree magickers are devilish.

[Teleri]

Even though they're more....devilishious.

[Ghost]

Find out IC

Well, ICly I think I saw something that pretty much resembled devil but I have no idea if it is really the devil.

And by the way, devil is a relative term.  For my rinther, devil is the templar.  For my merchant, any rinther,  and for my travelers, gith/halfling/raider.

[Bestatte]

The Devil is a judeo-christian concept. It's a bastardization of a pagan goat-god-type-dood, who was -not- considered "evil" by his followers. Don't confuse modern religion with Armageddon fantasy. And don't compare it. It doesn't compare at all.

If you're a northerner, the south is evil. If you're a southerner, the north is evil. No matter which city you live in, mindbenders and defilers are evil.  If your character is a tribal character, your tribe's culture determines what is evil.

If anything, starvation and thirst are the Zalanthan equivalent of the Devil. That is all.

[Callisto]

There is no sense of popular religion on Zalanthas, other then people being hearded out the gates of Allanak to worship Tektolnes, I suppose.

With a lack of religion, there are no heavens or hells*, no angels or demons** and no God*** or Devil.

*- There are the "hell" pits of Suk-Krath, but has no connection to Hell in the traditional sense.

**- There are demons, but again they have no connection to demons in the traditional sense.

***- There are god-kings, but they're not seen in the same light as say a Christian god in our world. See game documentation for more information.

The closest thing to a "devil" there is on Zalanthas is the element of Drov. A lot of people associate death and evil with Drov, but it's vague enough that you can have your characters see it in many different ways.

I'd avoid referring to someone or something as a/the devil in-game, it just wouldn't suit the game world, in my opinion. A lot of people would find it breaks the fantasy setting for them.

Hope it helps.

[Trenidor]

Think of your city ruler as the god (like the pharoah in egypt)

and think of your opposing city as the devil (cuz he's the opposite of 'god')

That's just one character I had's pholosophy.

I'm sure it varries from character to character what they believe in. I had a character that was a commoner hunter, yet he belived in worshing the animals he killed.

A common religion is non-existant in arm.

I'm sure some drunkards would think that ale was god.

If you really want to believe in something go for whatever's most important in your characters life and think of it as something you'd worship.

[Tlaloc]

It should be noted that The Dragon (Not to be confused with the Highlord Tektolnes) is probably percieved as an "Evil" Force, bent on destruction and maliciousness. The Dragon is thought to not only be the most destructive force ever, but also may have introduced defiling magick to the World.

Heres the helpfile. Feel free to make your own interpretations of its implications:

DRAGON  (General)  


The Dragon is a pivotal figure in the history of Zalanthas. While what happened around the time that the Dragon was on Zalanthas is not always clear (historians have differing views on this), what is clear is that the world became a far worse place for the Dragon's presence. Legend has it that the Dragon was responsible for the destruction of much of the world, both directly and as a result of introducing defiling magick.

While on Zalanthas, the Dragon established an empire of terror that followed from the prosperous Empire of Man. For reasons unknown, however, the Dragon left the world after some years, and its empire decayed rapidly. Modern time is marked from the time of the Dragon's departure, with Year 0 marking the year that it left.

In 911, during the 12th King's Age, the Dragon returned to Zalanthas, destroying a quarter of the northern city of Tuluk upon its arrival. Muk Utep met with the Dragon, after which it disappeared again, and Muk Utep himself ceased appearing in public.

Many Ages later, Highlord Tektolnes of Allanak made an appearance as a dragon when he destroyed the dwarven forces that besieged Allanak, early in the 19th Age. Today, the only publicly viewable representation of a dragon is the steel dragon above Allanak's main gates, which represents the Highlord in his conquering splendor.

See also:


city_allanak, city_tuluk

[amoeba]

ok it's probably another thread, but what about life after death?  I've had a few comments that I wanted to make about the subject, but I didn't know what the general belief was, so I squelched the thought.  As a -very- wide spread rule, much of religion, both modern, and primitive are downright obsessive about what happens when you die.  Every religion -I- can think of has a significant area devoted to the subject.  It would seem that a place where death is so prevalant they would be thinking hard on the subject.  In short is there an afterlife? Reincarnation?

[Larrath]

This answer is required: Permadeath!

[marko]

Ok, so I know that in Arm there's a god like guy, but what I want to know is if there is a devil like being. Earth have the devil or Satan, what does Arm have? :twisted:

To further the other responses.

Many cultures in the game have the concept of "spirits" these spirits can be good, bad, or neutral.

Other cultures have a belief in demons.  These demons can be incredibly powerful or minor in ability.  Demons are not necessarily evil or good.

Yet other cultures talk about 'elementals' and the various elements taking form in one way or another.  

There is a wide variety of belief systems you can partake in without actually having the concept of the Devil.

As Tlaloc mentions, the closest thing to the Devil would be the Dragon.

[Krath]

krath is the sun, no one worships it but tribal freaks and some dirty magickers.

Alas I do have Followers

[sarahjc]

There is no guy with a red pitchfork and some horn's and a tail per say. But I am sure that people believe in some kind of demons, evil beings..  

There is the thing called "Drove" Which I personally equate to hell.. But what runs the pace I would think is up to interpretation.  I would think it's the opposing city's ruler.

[Cuusardo]

ok it's probably another thread, but what about life after death?  I've had a few comments that I wanted to make about the subject, but I didn't know what the general belief was, so I squelched the thought.  As a -very- wide spread rule, much of religion, both modern, and primitive are downright obsessive about what happens when you die.  Every religion -I- can think of has a significant area devoted to the subject.  It would seem that a place where death is so prevalant they would be thinking hard on the subject.  In short is there an afterlife? Reincarnation?

Nobody knows for sure.  Make something up IC according to your character's perspective and run with it.

[Anarchy]

Demon is an ok arm word IMO, i use it alot.
Angel isn't, however.

Devil, hmm, i wouldn't use that, i'd just use Demon.

[Gaare]

Strangely. there is ICly an answer to that post... If there is evil, demon or not... One must find out I presume.

[Myrdryn]

ok it's probably another thread, but what about life after death?  I've had a few comments that I wanted to make about the subject, but I didn't know what the general belief was, so I squelched the thought.  As a -very- wide spread rule, much of religion, both modern, and primitive are downright obsessive about what happens when you die.  Every religion -I- can think of has a significant area devoted to the subject.  It would seem that a place where death is so prevalant they would be thinking hard on the subject.  In short is there an afterlife? Reincarnation?

The quick answer is:  Nobody knows.

Surely there are people that say they know, but if they are right or no is not to be seen until you die (Much like real life).

As far as different ideas about what happens after death, I'm sure there are many differentiating theories shared among the populace.  Among the people of Tuluk and Allanak (and smaller outposts and villages), there is no one generally held belief about the the afterlife.  Though many people might believe differently about what happens.   Since there is no religion that is in the majority that dictates such believes, I don't think that people would think that any one persons beliefs about the afterlife would be predominant.

As far as what people believe happens after they die, this is really open to the player of each character to come up with.  There isn't really anything that is off limits as far as beliefs go.  Keep in mind there isn't one correct way that things are as far as the afterlife goes, it could be a mix of many, or not.  Only the dead would know.

-Myrdryn

[JollyGreenGiant]

Only the dead would know.

No one has bothered to ask them before?

[Delirium]

I did, but the bastard didn't answer me.

[Gaare]

I did, but the bastard didn't answer me.

Probably because it had no tongue.. Right?

[Marc]

The dragon help file has been written for sometime, or at least the history bit.  Anyone else find this wierd:

In 911, during the 12th King's Age, the Dragon returned to Zalanthas, destroying a quarter of the northern city of Tuluk upon its arrival. Muk Utep met with the Dragon, after which it disappeared again, and Muk Utep himself ceased appearing in public.

911?  Precognition by the immortals of old?

[sacac]

muk-utep and the dragon sitting in a tree
K-i-s-s-i-n-g


Yea.. uh-huh
Some Believe you die and go visit in the paradise with Stiniel(?)
Some believe you go to the other side of the chasm in the nroth
Some believe you visit the other side of the silt sea

Think of something and do it. It will probably be ok.

[fearwig]

The Devil is a judeo-christian concept.

Funny you should say that... a handful of religions have a devil-like character, not least among them Zoroastrianism (kind of passe now, though it is).

The thing everyone should probably consider is that religion seems to be an element central to humanity, and that gods don't have to be real in an objective sense to be real to a player. There's nothing in Zalanthas that indicates to me that its people should be excepted from this concept.

While the fact that no really strong organized religions exist in the game world kind of hinders concepts of 'true religion', there's nothing that should keep a character from having his or her own concept of creation, perhaps even a rather specific one, without being a total loony. I think you should be careful to borrow too much from our own modern concepts of religion in this way, though... but I think it could be a good way of fleshing out a character and his or her roleplay.

As for the Devil, who knows? As I said, the concept of a center of all evil isn't a new one, whatever Bestatte's religious learnings would tell you. Our -images- of the Devil derive somewhat from pagan gods, as rather the whole point of Christianity's good/evil mode is to discourage hedonism (didn't you ever think he looked a bit like Pan?). That doesn't mean the Devil is specific in concept to our prominent religions (Judaic-derived religions, specifically) or even to the older religions they probably borrowed such concepts from (Zoroastrianism and others). Be tasteful, but be inventive. That's the way I see it.

[Bestatte]

Demons, the concept of good/evil, devilish spirits are not of Judeo-Christian origin. "The Devil" [tm] is. That really big guy with the horns and red skin who breathes fire and runs that swingin joint called Hell - is a Judeo-Christian concept.

Now that we've got that cleared up:

There -is- religion in Zalanthas. It just isn't very prevalent in the city-states.
And that's all I'm gonna say about that. If you want to learn more, it really -is- one of those things you need to find out IC, if your character has any interest in it.

Edit:
prevAlent, damnit, not prevElent.

emote grumbles.

[fearwig]

Actually I was describing an existing (well, ancient, but still kind-of-existing) religion where the primary source of worldly evil is a kind of sub-god (angel), created by the Big Good God, who "fell from grace" in essentially the exact same way as old Lucy, except that he shared in some part of that religion's Creation. In all other ways... oh yeah, the Devil. Except he didn't look like he belonged in some bad TBN special, at least I don't imagine so. But, hey, what-ever!

Not so much here to nitpick as I am keen on passing along interesting facts. Not many people know Their Favourite Religion (no matter what it was) had some origins in a predecessor, from which it was mixed, contorted, and reformed with other beliefs in the mixture.


Except for Wicca... I'm pretty sure some silly hippies just made that up as a joke, and it caught on by accident.