Fear of the wilds

[Forty Winks]

Do you as a player think the wilds are dangerous enough to give the Zalanthas wilds credit as a harsh world?

If so, what are some of the general things that make you hesitate to leave the protection of walls?

If not, what are some improvements that could add to zalanthan harshness?

And finally, what is your expectations of what the wilds should inspire in you as a player?

[jstorrie]

I've been playing for a fairly long time now, and honestly, stepping off the main roads scares the shit out of me.

Even travelling on the main roads themselves is dangerous enough to keep me on edge.

[Dalmeth]

You need to add another option : is out in the wilds alot and is still scared out of his/her mind.

It's a natural state.  The desire for profit overcomes fear.

[Arabian Nights]

Used to be. Now...not so much. Mostly because before the dangerous npcs were toned down a bit and thinned out I was -actually- terrified and it was -actually- dangerous, I'd never take a pc out alone. Now, pssshhh...ain't worried about it.

[Maybe42or54]

If I am in the south, then being out in the wild doesn't scare me. Because, chances are, I wont see anything.

In the north, most of the time, if I go out, chances are, I wont see anything.

[Arabian Nights]

Yeah. Even thought I'd like to see more non-npc dangers when in the wilds, I'd rather have the npc ones like it used to be instead of hardly anything.
It seems like the npc dangers were toned down without any other dangers replacing them.

[Fragmented]

I voted very little. In fact, I'm not scared of the wilds at all. Not that I'm bragging, but it just isn't very dangerous out there. Especially up North. I'd love to see -more- aggressive beasties, making it to the point where you go out in pairs, or trios, unless you're a real badass. I'd like to see real badasses sometimes get a little nervous, too. Right now, there's one place that terrifies me, and that's the Grey Forest.

[amoeba]

Right now, there's one place that terrifies me, and that's the Grey Forest.

I agree, for the most commonly traved places. The grey forest has creeped out even my delfs.  There are other scary lands as well, such as the mantis lands, but these are much less traveled for obvious reasons.

[FiveDisgruntledMonkeysWit]

The wilds still scare the crap out of me. Everything kills you. Everything. Unless you happen to be a 20-day ranger or warrior or something. Anyone else, though, is royally boned. Doubly so if a storm starts up. Triply so if you get caught out in the dark, or during high sun when you're low on water. 800x so if a hooded figure appears on the horizon and takes a keen interest in you...
It takes an enormous pantload of OOC knowledge to survive as a new, unskilled character in the wilds. Don't let anyone tell you otherwise.

[Angela Christine]

I am cautious about leaving the cities.  I've lost literally dozens of PCs in the wilderness, so clearly I'm not quite cautious enough, but it isn't something I take lightly.  Oddly enough, my PCs seem to be more likely to die with a group then when I travel alone.  Travelling alone I am cautious, with a group I am nervous, and with a group that includes a Templar I might as well start writing up my next character app in another window.   :wink:


I like the balance now.  There are huge stretches of land where the most dangerous thing you are likely to encounter is dehydration -- there are a few dangerous beasties, but you aren't likely to encounter them too often.  I think that is completely appropriate.  There isn't enough water and vegetation to support large populations of animals in some places, so those places don't have many animals.  I suppose they could stick in some sand-eating monsters, but why would sand-eating monsters bother to attack PCs who are not made of sand?  The most dangerous thing in the desert is the desert itself, which is as it should be.

The relatively lush areas support much more life.  An area with a lot of water and vegetation will attract competition, and even the herbivores on Zalanthas are pretty mean.


Angela Christine

[Dalmeth]

I personally don't like heading out into these thornbushes far east of Tuluk, but that's because one of the common creatures there is poisonous, and I haven't been able to find anyone that sells treatments on any of my characters.

Yeah, the Grey Forest scares me.  So does the Red Desert.  I personally like the idea that the areas around the roads and the cities are relatively safe for a lone person.  It lets independent, semi-intelligent characters survive.  Though, I think I wouldn't mind so much if the animals that sold for a fair amount of coin were located in more dangerous areas.  Just keep enough out for the weaker among the population to survive.

[elvenchipmunk]

I fear almost every part of the wild, because there always seems to be something there that will kill me faster than I can flee and run or whatever.

There's also an ooc reason, and I don't know if anyone else finds this, but whenever an aggressive animal comes from whatever room, there seems to be an unusually long delay before my command has any affect, and by this time, the animal has already attacked. Probably just me being paranoid, but that second part is one of the main reasons I fear the wild, whether that's good or bad.

Something I'd like to see more of, though, is raptors travelling in packs, as well as bahamets moving and attacking slower, and more NPC aggro humanoids!

All IMHO, of course

[Ghost]

Wilds do not scare me.  For a time I have been thinking of what it would be like a "scary" outside world.  The answer is satisfying to me, but I would guess the newbies would get zorched pretty bad, they would not like it, nor the mud as a result.  So... I agree it should stay like this, but this way, it is not even close to being scary.
I have noted, one of the most scary things in the wilderness is a concious being.  So, most people are afraid to see PCs in the wilderness, or, imm animated beasties. People do not get scared to see a couple of uber gith warriors in the horizons, but seeing a "figure" in cloak searching for tracks make them all scared to death.

And..

Oddly enough, my PCs seem to be more likely to die with a group then when I travel alone. Travelling alone I am cautious, with a group I am nervous, and with a group that includes a Templar I might as well start writing up my next character app in another window. Wink

HAHA!  This made me laugh.

[Ktavialt]

Something I'd like to see more of, though, is raptors travelling in packs, as well as bahamets moving and attacking slower, and more NPC aggro humanoids!

All IMHO, of course

I'm with you on that one. Over the last few RL days I've had a couple
situations where immortals animated NPC creatures and gave them a
lot more intelligence (which is good especially regarding humanoid
ones). I'd like to see them capitalize on assumptions PC's make that
the NPC's are just going to sit there, doing nothing. Keep us on our
toes. Let me just rattle off a list of things that would be neat, whether
through code or immortal animation (they're going to oddly mostly center
around gith, but):
- NPC's with minor psionic abilities. How about that shield wall tarantula
that can use the way to confuse your mount, having him turn west and
fall off the cliff instead of head down the road?
- NPC's that occasionally look farther than one space away. "Oh crap,
look at that tembo far to the west. Shhh... let's try to sneak around it."
s s w w w w n n
- Like you said, raptors that hunt in packs. I liked Jurassic park too.
- Gith acting as bait, to get a PC to follow it around a corner where five
other gith are waiting.
- Hidden Gith (and maybe raptors too. How smart are they?) that act as
scouts to gith NPCs down the road. "*bzzzt* this is red-beast one to
Ogg, we have a group of three... I repeat, three well-armed mercenaries
heading down the road on kank-back. If you plan on engaging them I
suggest you gather a lot of backup, otherwise I'd hightail it out. Over."
- Halflings that use poison darts.
- Gith that try to pick up disarmed weapons, and that flee when hurt!


Anyways, I see new features all the time from the staff that are sorta
going in this direction, and I'm happy the staff took the time to animate
the NPC's I did fight. Just throwing out suggestions.

Thanks for reading,
- Ktavialt

[IntuitiveApathy]

- NPC's with minor psionic abilities. How about that shield wall tarantula
that can use the way to confuse your mount, having him turn west and
fall off the cliff instead of head down the road?
- NPC's that occasionally look farther than one space away. "Oh crap,
look at that tembo far to the west. Shhh... let's try to sneak around it."
s s w w w w n n
- Like you said, raptors that hunt in packs. I liked Jurassic park too.
- Gith acting as bait, to get a PC to follow it around a corner where five
other gith are waiting.
- Hidden Gith (and maybe raptors too. How smart are they?) that act as
scouts to gith NPCs down the road. "*bzzzt* this is red-beast one to
Ogg, we have a group of three... I repeat, three well-armed mercenaries
heading down the road on kank-back. If you plan on engaging them I
suggest you gather a lot of backup, otherwise I'd hightail it out. Over."
- Halflings that use poison darts.
- Gith that try to pick up disarmed weapons, and that flee when hurt!

You'd be surprised at how much of these have been in the game in the past and taken out later.  Most of them resulted in major death and destruction, and not even the fun kind.  (ie. pack of rolling death walks in from the east.. 1/10 second passes by with your screen scrolling madly.. <ding> Welcome to Armageddon! .. and our lovely mantis friend)

What I'd really like to see is more scripting, to make the behaviours of the critters and nasties out there more alive, more than just a walking, murderous automaton..

[Ktavialt]

You'd be surprised at how much of these have been in the game in the past and taken out later.  Most of them resulted in major death and destruction, and not even the fun kind.  (ie. pack of rolling death walks in from the east.. 1/10 second passes by with your screen scrolling madly.. <ding> Welcome to Armageddon! .. and our lovely mantis friend)

What I'd really like to see is more scripting, to make the behaviours of the critters and nasties out there more alive, more than just a walking, murderous automaton..

Actually, I do remember that. I've probably had four or five PCs killed
by the roving four-gith party just outside Allanak. I don't recall ever
seeing any of the other things mentioned, if they were, I suppose I did
not get first-hand experience as to why they were bad.

As far as the roving gith parties...
Part of the reason they were bad is that they entered the room and the
others that followed immediately attacked without any lag. If that could
be removed, then having a gith group that big near where they camp
out wouldn't seem bad to me. You should kinda expect it. Otherwise,
groups of two every so often in other areas isn't much of an overkill.
What I don't like to see is PC's fighting a gith, where another is standing
in sight, two rooms away, waiting his turn to die.

As far as the rest of the ideas....
- The psionic abilities one, if in moderation, would also be neat.
- Weak animals (goudra, vestric) trying to run away and hide would be
cool. Would make hunting and ranger scanning very useful to catch up
to them. The animals should have a destination plotted to run to. In fact,
anything -running away- won't be severe.
- The seeing two/three spaces away NPC's doesn't seem too severe.
- The gith picking up disarmed weapons -from time to time- wouldn't
be too severe.
- The halflings using poison woul... ah well maybe that could be severe .

Yawn. I'm tired. Thanks for responding.

- Ktavialt

[Anael]

Halflings are overpowered twinks. :wink:

[Gaare]

Travelling alone I am cautious, with a group I am nervous, and with a group that includes a Templar I might as well start writing up my next character app in another window.

Very well said! I lost some PCs in the wild, but as an rather experienced player I do not find wild -that- dangerous. It is simply dangerous enough. On the other hand, I do not like roaming in wild alone with my PC unless there is a cool concept of loneliness which makes me attach the character. I sometimes miss my first days of the mud, where stepping outside of the city is adventure itself... but now I think I feel like as my poor hunter PC and leaving the city alone is just too dangerous, too tiredsome and too boring work to be profitable.

[Manhattan]

ahhhh back in my newbie days... I was afraid of even leaving the Gaj !!!

That's because the whole idea of quit-safe rooms was new to me, since I came from quit-anywhere H&S muds. I never went far from the Gaj with my newbie PC's....

[SewerRat_inTheOpen]

I'll have to admit, once you get to know the way of the wilds, it isn't that bad. It is experience.

For a newbie/semi-newbie/veteran who doesn't go out to the wilds that much, it could be death the very next step [like off the walls] while they are running from their newly found gith friend.

You will realise, it's not the world that has become less harsh, but rather you have become experienced. And though OOC knowledge should not be linked, you will realise that more oft than not, you will not walk into that cave where that crazy npc anti-social mage is camping and just die.

When I was new, if I did not read the forums that much, I would not be afraid of bahamets or silt monsters or that sea of silt. But I read, and became slightly experienced in the world, and the world for that, slightly less harsh. The world was still deadly to me when I was new to it.

I fear the unknown.... and sandstorms that come up gradually.

[start]Suggestions that just came up out of nowhere:

Maybe the area that aggro mobs tracked to when encountered, needs to be larger or they need better tracking. And they should be able to go back to their general area when they lose their prey... not stay on the roads.

There needs to be more aggro mobs/npcs people spread out. Places where easy mobs hang out, there should be predator mobs as well. It may not always be true.

Maybe what we need is to make the world equally harsh for the veteran player. But I know not how.

[/end suggestions]

[moab]

I'm sure it's because as a player my combat skills blow - but nearly all of my characters have died in the wilderness.

This tends to make me very serious when I'm outisde and avoid taking my characters there without appropriate backup.

[Kennath]

Halflings are overpowered twinks. :wink:

And all other NPCs are just twinks

[jmordetsky]

What I'd really like to see is more scripting, to make the behaviours of the critters and nasties out there more alive, more than just a walking, murderous automaton..

Seconded. There are some cool scripts out there though. One of my recent character deaths was a result of an awesome script that blew my mind.

That said, I'm not very afraid of the wilds. Though, 8 rl days is usually my max life span. Maybe I should be.

[bloodfromstone]

I haven't played any outside-the-walls character yet, so I have no idea. I intend to once my current bites it, but I have a feeling that the next in line will die pretty fast. Like a few people have said, it's the OOC experience that makes the wilds easier. It's a shame, but there's no way around it. And I'm not saying it's bad play on anyone's part. It's just how things go.

[ale six]

I haven't had much experience, but I'm very very scared of the wilds.  It could just be because my PCs that have ventured out have been very weak, but there are mean things out there!!