Purple Prose Power

[Tuannon]

Understanding one's place in the virtual world is absolutely a sign you understand what your role entails. But I think it's more valuable when assessing RP quality to not take OOC liberties with certain staff supplied benefits.

[Tailong]

Last time someone used the term 'purple prose' to me it was in the negative connotations, so I am just confused.

[CirclelessBard]

Last time someone used the term 'purple prose' to me it was in the negative connotations, so I am just confused.

'Purple prose' is indeed a term used in literary critique to describe overly flowery language that seems intended to make text hard to read. As a writer I never really liked the terms 'purple prose', its opposite 'beige prose' and similar terms because it always strikes me as a little bit snooty. However I think the OP is well-intended and was simply describing a higher level of detailed writing in emotes.

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Response to the OP:

While I do believe that emote quality is tied partially to roleplaying quality, I don't think the connection is "stronger emotes = better roleplay". I do believe that very brief emotes absolutely have their place in a good roleplayer's repertoire. Many writers use sentence length to denote the pacing of a scene. If you read a lot, you'll notice that action scenes tend to use shorter sentences. Scenes that happen at a normal pace, but have a sudden event interrupt them, are usually capped with a short sentence describing that sudden event. Slower or more intricate (or more intimate!) scenes tend to have longer sentences. Scenes that are dialogue-heavy in fiction are more descriptive of character actions and the situation around them when the conversation is calm, and less descriptive when characters are having an argument or are in the midst of a fight.

So, "em grunts" is potentially good roleplay... in the right context.

MUSHes have a reputation for having players that are very descriptive (often to an excessive degree), but if you actually read MUSH logs you will see the variance I described above. If you're curious, search for Ares MUSH games - the games that use this engine all have websites that post logs of public scenes on their websites. You will often see short (one word to one sentence) poses being used in a fast-paced context.

As a disclaimer, I believe that truly good roleplay comes from a mixture of emote-writing, being in your character's headspace, and avoiding playing self-insert characters. But as far as the emote-writing aspect goes, it's worth it to challenge yourself to write the best thing you can, keeping in mind timing and pacing.

[Kaathe]

*not official staff position, just my own*

I don't care about emotes upfront. It's not your job to entertain.  It's your job to run a realistic character and treat the game world around you as a real one.  Do this and thinks, feels, and emotes will exist in your imagination even when solo, and then you can put some in the game in whatever capacity you desire. 

[Yelinak]

*not official staff position, just my own*

I don't care about emotes upfront. It's not your job to entertain.  It's your job to run a realistic character and treat the game world around you as a real one.  Do this and thinks, feels, and emotes will exist in your imagination even when solo, and then you can put some in the game in whatever capacity you desire. 

Emoting is surely part of playing a realistic character. Emotes are literally the actions of your character. While they aren't coded or interchangable with coded actions, there shouldn't be an inherent distinction between the two. Surely if there's a distinction between the two, this game can't claim to be Roleplay Intensive. If I emote doing something, my character has done it, barring fringe cases like excessive power-posing that nobody would accept.

There's no rule that says you must take the time to emote everything your character might be doing, that's true; but emoting those of one's actions that are not echoed by the game's code is part and parcel of running a realistic character. As a member of staff, I'm sure you'd agree that if you see someone just wantonly slaughtering wildlife without ever putting out a written word to show what they're doing, they'll be pegged as a twink. Meanwhile, if they can show that they're doing it for a valid reason, it's a different story.

Thinks and feels are all well and good from the staff perspective. They mean nothing to other players. In terms of the quality of one's roleplay, they're not a substitute for emoting. For the players themselves, think/feel is an optional tool to aid in immersion. For staff, it's a way to glean a player's motivations. But for any other player in the scene, it doesn't matter two shits if some guy is firing off a barrage of eloquent thinks. If he isn't emoting at all, his character is perceived as a mindless dummy, and if his role in that scene does not correspond to staring witlessly into space, I would opine that it qualifies as bad roleplay.

Let's take an example. I love examples.

#1: Amos is sitting at the bar. Over there at the other end of the bar is Malik. Amos fucking hates Malik and has wanted to murder him for years. Malik killed Amos' parents, siblings, children, friends, and favorite baker. Amos is seething with hatred the moment Malik walks in, and is fully committed to the kill. In fact, it takes all of Amos' self-control to even wait until Malik has sat down before lunging at him. Malik deserves to die so much.

But the player of Amos makes no effort whatsoever to emote any of this. He puts out a flurry of thinks and feels, and unless anyone in the tavern is of a certain redacted character type, none of them have any opportunity to pick up on these. These thinks might tell staff all about what Amos means to do and justify it from start to finish, but at the end of the day, everyone else in the tavern just sees a dude sitting there doing nothing whatsoever until he suddenly does a stand;draw knife;kill malik.

#2: Same thing, except Amos' player starts emoting instead. His features immediately sour upon first sight of Malik. He glowers down the length of the bar, nostrils flaring with temper, clutching the handle of his tankard so hard that his knuckles grow white. Each time Malik speaks, Amos exhales sharply through his teeth. Everyone's got a chance to notice it. Malik might furtively lay a hand on the hilt of his blade, because he's noticing, too.

But Amos doesn't take the trouble to type out a bunch of thinks/feels. It's quite hard to do that and elaborate emotes at the same time, after all. Obviously, any staff member who is actually present in the room will have picked up on the same things as the players have, but the global immortal thinknet might not summon anyone because Amos is busy actually making the scene realistic and interesting for the players who are present.

- end of example -

If I'm asked what I think is the superior case of roleplay, I'm all about #2, especially because we already have semi-official rules that say Amos is expected to wish up before he tries to stab Malik in his murderous face and explain to staff why he's doing it. That covers both bases. In doing only thinks and feels, he's only providing additional enjoyment to any staff who might be watching, and who will be adequately informed by the aforementioned wish anyway, while giving nothing whatsoever to the players.

Why exactly is it more important to cater to staff than to our fellow players? Why do you think players should prioritize characterizing internally, i.e. to you, than externally to the other players? It seems like a strange ideology to have. A player's responsibility is first to their fellow players and then next to the staff who have so many more tools at their disposal to read between the lines and understand what's going on. Players only have each other's characterization, and if there's none of that, the whole game falls apart as a concept.

I have infinitely more respect for players who emote but don't use think than players who think but don't emote, because a character's internal motivations are already covered by the expectation that one wishes up before doing anything serious, by character reports, and by the fact that staff can watch anyone at any time and see everything. Other players can only see what you choose to show them, and if you show them nothing, you have failed them. You were a bad roleplayer.

Your duty is to the game and your fellow players before the staff, as long as you don't break any rules or require their assistance. If there's five players in the room, your obligation is to cater to them first before you consider catering to the potential presence of a staff member. That should just be common sense. Staff members are not privy to some prima-nocte service through your roleplay. There probably isn't even one around, and even if there is, there's almost certainly more players. Your duty is to be a good player for those fellow players before catering to staff's whims and preferences, as long as you've not broken any rules, written or unwritten (i.e. wish up before you kill, famously unwritten and yet routinely punishable, everyone learns this the hard way).

[Usiku]

I was going to write some things, but essentially I agree with everything Yelinak has written across the multiple posts they have contributed to this thread (not inclusive of commentary about staff, which are objectively...incorrect). Up to and including that the game, and the play you put out is for the benefit of yourself and other players and not for staff.

Thinks & feels are helpful to staff, but they are also helpful for character development, using them helps you as a player better empathise with your own PC. There are, of course, also PCs who may benefit from your PCs internal dialogue.

@Yelinak - for someone who is no longer playing the game you take a lot of swipes at staff when you participate in otherwise benign, community discussions and honestly you are reintroducing and maintaining a certain toxicity that we are striving very hard to move away from. I have no idea of your history with the game or staff and no frame of reference for why you feel the way you do, but I would rather you reach out and bury the hatchet than continue to take these pot shots. I can tell you that the individuals on the staffing team we have now are absolutely dedicated to fair treatment of all players and want nothing more than to maintain and improve our amazing game and provide fun and engagement for our players.

[Wday]

Very detailed to even small to the point type emotes. I feel falls on the eyes of the readers to use our imagination and play off it.  Mainly when you know the context of the scene you can read between the lines. So a simple emote (nodding while listening to ~person) in my mind has many facial expression and so on. 
Hardest thing for me to role play off is the type that use the text game and read it like it is fine print.  Give room for error maybe you heard something wrong not read it?  Hard playing at times off those that go pen and paper type styles.  NOT saying that is bad role play!  Just saying that is tougher then following short or lengthy emotes.

[Lizzie]

I think we all have our preferences for what we prefer to read and how we want to express ourselves through our characters. When I first came to Arm I was in awe of the rich, detailed emotes of certain players. But after awhile, I noticed they never switched it up. A nod was never "just a nod." It was always accompanied with a strand of hair falling toward their well-described nose while their head tilts at this or that degree.  Eventually I started wondering if the player was actually trying to play the role, or if they were just trying to impress everyone with how well they write.

It started looking like a show of arrogance, to me. And it eventually turned me off.  Then I found out MUSHes exist, and realized oh - these might just be MUSH players, it's not arrogance, it's just what they're used to doing.  So I tried to enjoy it again. But then I was reminded - I don't play MUSHes. I prefer the faster "live-action" of a MUD.  If I want to read paragraphs of text, I'll read a book. We have room and combat brief settings here for a reason.  Some people just don't have the patience to pore through every word, every nuance of every paragraph, to figure out what the character is doing.

You can use my post as an example of that. Who read the whole thing? Probably many of you didn't. Now imagine my character explaining something more in-game-thematic in the same way to your character, while a scene is happening in the game.  Are you going to say "oh wow, what great emotes!" or are you going to say "shut up and skin the damned chalton FFS, the gate's closing in 3 minutes?"

So - tl;dr: sometimes a nod is just a nod. And that's okay. There's a time for flowery emotes. There's a time to just nod, or nod cordially, or nod and wave, or nod and turn to leave. You don't have to impress anyone with every line you type into the game. And sometimes - going overboard in making that effort just causes scenes to not progress. Mix it up, maybe your entrance is a big to-do. Maybe you're about to set the scene for something. That's when you go nuts with the flowery emotes. But once the conversation/interaction begins, pare it down a bit so everyone else has a chance to do something before it's time to log out for the night.

[dumbstruck]

Whenever I first came to play arm, I had never played a MUSH. I would not go on to discover MUSHES existed for 9 years. I had only played dungeons and dragons. I was one of those people who would never 'just nod'. And it felt like it pissed some people off. Their characters got terse with mine even when mine had done nothing to deserve it, because they would take a few moments longer to show up as nodding than someone who would just use the nod social.

Some would seek out mine for mudsex more. Some still do. I don't care for either of those odd phenomena. I learned over the years while roleplaying here, just here, really, that if you give long, flowery emotes, that people will be more likely to get frustrated with you if they're remotely rushed. They will be more likely to try and fuck your characters, even if there is no in game reason for it, and I stopped doing it. Not entirely. But a lot of the time.

When I'm stoned, or when I'm feeling inspired, or (yes, it's the culture, after 15 years) when one of my characters is around another character they see as having potential for a romantic interest in, the emote game is slowed down and stepped up. This happens when I'm alone too, again, more when I'm feeling inspired. It's not something that was necessarily intentional as a change. But something that I noticed after discovering MUSHes, when coming back here, and switching between the two.

It makes me a bit sad honestly. I don't know what to do about it. Just as when I started playing, it's not an intentional choice I made, but instead a drift in writing style that happened as a result in response to the roleplay of the people around me. I think the idea of calling a mush something other than live action isn't really fair (yes, there is now a type of mush, ARES, that has options for scenes done that way but it's an incredibly new codebase and only a drop in the bucket of those types of games), just because it's not happening with tersely short writing at break neck speeds. The type of roleplay you're looking to compare it to is forum post by post. That is not live action. MUSHes are live action.

[Riev]

In general, those who "take the time to put in a quality emote" TEND to be the type who will follow the scene and end up in mudsex positions. It is very rare that I see the grunt-nodder in full scale romantic mudsex relationships.

Basically, social players tend to lean towards mudsex relationships and once you (as a player) are known to do it, you're sought after for it. Sometimes by the same other players because they know you're down.

Maybe we need more awesome emoters to say that their sexual desires are satisfied when they're logged off.

[strangerdanger]

Maybe we need more awesome emoters to say that their sexual desires are satisfied when they're logged off.

Buddy I'm trying to butter my toast on both sides.

Sometimes I emote like crazy around other players. Sometimes I emote like crazy when I'm solo. I always emote around other players and sometimes I don't emote at all when solo. There's a whole spectrum of what I feel like doing at any given moment and I'd say when I'm solo I'm more likely to have my imagination fill in the gaps for the sake of quicker gameplay. When I'm around other people I like to slow down and think through/act out (emote) what's going on for my mans; it's more reactionary and adaptive than like the millionth time I've typed 'skin corpse'.

I'm not sure what point I'm trying to make. I guess for me emoting feels like an expressive thing that I sometimes have more energy for than others. For the sake of the ease of my play and the direction of a scene I'll either lengthen or shorten my emotes or try to add extra details. I used to get geeked out around super emoters or annoyed by non emoters, but more and more often I just play my game and work with what I've got in front of me. Some people are easier to work with than others, but I'm not trying to discount anyone just because they have a challenging style (for me).

[Riev]

Tone is hard to convey over text.
It was tongue in cheek, after my post saying that flowery emoters tend to be sexual players.

Deal with whats in front of you is a solid point. This whole thread's point was just "I'm going to try and do better."

[Windstorm]

Even small reactions, facial cues, tone changes, I think, can add a lot to how a PC is reacting, saying, or looking when they do things.

Certain habits of a given PC can tell you a lot about them. At least by me. I try to have a few things that each PC personally does. Blinking. Squinting. Touching her face. Scowling. The way they walk, even the general reaction vNPCs might have around them. It helps me define them better to myself and form more of a full picture with which to express them better outwardly.

Also, everything dumbstruck said! Sometimes I'm high or feeling creative, evocative, and my emotes/feels go wild. If I'm around a PC I know is going to have a high standard of expression I'll be very glad to put more effort in myself. I'm rarely short of things to write but it's an effort thing.

[digitaleak]

I've always preferred to just lead by example. I've noticed when I really engage other players, they usually match my energy in their own way over time. And on that note I try to adapt in my own way to the other people in the room. it doesn't happen over night, it's like building a culture. It takes time and love to craft and cultivate.

I also try to have grace because I know there are a lot of people who may just not really have much experience taking on a character or even expressing themselves IRL. Other's might be too intimidated or scared to mess up (that was me for my first 4 characters). Other's might just be exhausted/drained/burnt out and don't want to always be 'on' - especially leadership roles (that's not to excuse poor leadership or laziness, but sometimes leaders did a lot of behind the scenes work and just want to log out once they made it through an event).

[Kaathe]

Yelinak, I think you missed the point of my post or I didn't explain it well. Leading with thinks and feels isn't for staff's benefit. Thinks and feels are for you, the player, to get into the character itself and enjoy yourself. Emotes will flow from it. Perceiving your character and the world around them realistically is where one starts, not worrying about if your emoting well enough to make other players (or staff) happy.

*again not official staff position*

[dumbstruck]

Yelinak, I think you missed the point of my post or I didn't explain it well. Leading with thinks and feels isn't for staff's benefit. Thinks and feels are for you, the player, to get into the character itself and enjoy yourself. Emotes will flow from it. Perceiving your character and the world around them realistically is where one starts, not worrying about if your emoting well enough to make other players (or staff) happy.

I like to think it's a mix of the two. Same as emotes are for you but also for the other player which is why when another player isn't around I tend to default more to thinks and feels than emotes. Why both? Because if it's just for me, there's no reason for me to input it at all. I already know what they're doing. I already know what they're thinking and feeling. If that makes sense. I don't mean to derail you though, but instead I feel like I get both you and Yelinak here, because I feel like I get how it's both?

[Jimpka_Moss]

Just popping in to say I love you all, you're amazing, and every single one of you have contributed to a big, important, living breathing thing in my life.

Also to complain a little. Since I immerse myself in the way that I'm looking forward through my chars eyes, trying to feel what they're wearing, and their senses are my own, I'm saddened by how few voices I've heard. It's hard for me to properly gauge so many char's voices, but a few I've actually been able to clearly hear through descriptions. Thank you for those, bards, mudsexers, and purple proses.

[Fredd]

This went okay for me. The challenge was harder then I expected but I think I stepped it up a bit. Now to try again this month, until i have be bestest prose ever!

Seriously though, all of ya'll rock. Over the past month i've noticed more people branching out their emoting too.