Drawing New MUDders

[valeria]

This is a baby thread off of some concepts recently raised over here.  I agree that we should be trying to take advantage of the current tabletop/podcast boom that's introduced a lot of younger folks to roleplaying.  However, someone noted that the game currently doesn't have the infrastructure to support new players, and by new players I mean people actually new to MUDding.  I really strongly agree.

One of the issues I see with advertising for new players is that it'll probably be like me trying to get my friends to play these days.  On seeing that they're expected to read the manual to play the game, and then need to get their character approved to actually play the game, they've lost interest.  If we advertise for new players, we're not advertising for players in the '90s.  People who are bored and looking for a new game want to play that game now.  People don't read instruction books for games anymore.

First point.  "Are you a new player?" should be the first option in the first list when you first log into the game, and that option should circumvent character preapproval. 

But what about keeping people on-theme?

Background.  We could use a very generic character creation option, like how Mount & Blade: Bannerlord opens, giving you choices about who your character is and what they'd like to do, then having some very generic character backgrounds generated based on that.  We have the wonder of databases now.

Descriptions.  Again, with things in databases, it would be pretty easy to ask if new players want to scroll through random, auto-generate sdescs and mdesc.  You could crowdsource mdesc lines, have an sdesc trait associated with each, sort them by category to prevent doubling (i.e., face, eyes, hair, torso, limbs, misc),and then randomly pick two of those associated sdesc traits to create the very typical 'a _, _ _' sdesc line.  Or of you wanted new characters to be more subtly visible?  Have it be 'a _ _' sdesc line.  Very few established players use that formula.  Suddenly, people have selected a character that makes sense with the theme.

If you want to cut down on staff load here, you could have existing players be able to submit these zombie parts and zombie backgrounds in a web form, and just have those just need to be y/n approved.

Want to make sure they read it?  End off with "Do you like this character or do you want to start over?"  People will read it to make sure they like the character.

Second point.  Get rid of poor and below average as things.  Nobody wants to start a game for the first time and see that their character is poor of below average at a basic D&Desque state like 'wisdom' when they haven't deliberately done that through point buy.  If this means either lowering the min cutoff for characters (which would be super nice), or extending the average range, so be it.

Third point.  Once we have that new, generic character established, we should drop them into a newbie area that illustrates to new players how to use basic commands.  Walking, looking, emotes, combat, crafting (everyone at least gets cooking!), everything else.  The area could integrate enough of the world lore to get someone familiar with the general concepts of Allanak, Luirs, roleplay expectations, and everything else.  It would also cut down on the frustration and learning curve of basic commands.

Fourth point.  This would also allow Armageddon to create and release a lets play without getting into any current and specific IC information.

Fifth point.  It would be stupid to advertise in existing MUD spaces.  The point should be to get new people playing MUDs period.  We should look into some paid, targeted advertising.  Who is going to pay for it?  Well, I'd certainly chip in.

That's all the points I've got.

[hyzhenhok]

Advertising? All we need to do is get a Twitch streamer with a large audience to play and show off the game. Should be easy.

Edit: A "quick character" option using randomization from databases for newbies is a very good idea.

One thought is that the guild/subguild system also presents an overwhelming amount of options. Maybe reduce is to 9 options with a questionnaire:

• Your character is most at home: (1) in the wide open wilderness, (2) in the busy streets or dark alleys of the city, or (3) both areas equally.
• Your is most talented in: (1) combat, (2) trade and crafting, or (3) a little bit of everything

Then assign them the Heavy Combat, Heavy Mercantile, or Utility class of their chosen sphere. And probably slap on a subguild based on whatever stock "Background" they choose.

[Dresan]

The only idea I have to help newbies is perhaps someone do a youtube  video going through character creation and discussing a few other key points and highlights that can help a newbie succeed.(ex.joining certain newbie friendly clans, water, etc,etc)

The video should be energetic and upbeat while being able to express the dark adult theme of the game. The presenter does not have to show themselves but my recommendation is that they should be female. We want to attract people, especially people that might not consider this game at first and its my humble opinion that this game has always had a larger number of female players in comparison to other muds, something we should be proud about and should try to capitalize on.

I really agree we should invest in advertisement in places that might not consider a mud. For example many have described Arm to feel like being in an interactive novel and we should definitely reach out to people who might enjoy experiencing a novel. Popular book review sites for example would probably attract a number of people, for comicon and tabletop conventions we should consider seeing if its possible to get a billboard in that town around the time people will be heading there or some other advertisement in the area. Some creative people might come up with more ideas here.

Expensive? Maybe. The game should send an email to existing and former players what is going on within the game with events and let them know we are starting a gofundme or some other donation page to begin paying for this type of advertisement. A lot of people can't play but they invested years in the game so they might be willing to help. Depending on contributions decisions can be made on what advertisement to invest in first.   

[Narf]

I am strongly in favor of all of Delirium's suggestions. The initial attention cost to buy in is a tremendous hurdle to getting new players, particularly those that haven't played text based games. Reducing that by creating an option system to use pregenerated bits for characters could help tremendously. Pregenerated characters are almost a uniform feature in most RPG game systems with any complexity to them these days, and for computer games, having a tutorial to learn basic keyboard commands is likewise nearly universal in all games that have keyboard commands.

I would add on that a basic introduction to the culture of the game added as a part of the tutorial would be wise. One thing to remember when setting this up, avoid text walls. The templar section could probably just be "Magical enforcers of a fascist god king" and be left at that for instance. Go for single sentences that get across what a player /needs/ to know to interact with something, and then refer them to the help file if they want to learn more.

Addendum: I would also add that this is something we could start collaboratively almost immediately with virtually no short-term staff workload. Just do a call for submissions from players for the pieces that'll be used to put the system together so you have them on hand when you're ready to use them. Pre generated backgrounds, pregenerated character description bits, summarized cultural documentation, and even ad ideas are all something that the playerbase could start cobbling together now.

[Delirium]

Valeria is not me. They are far more eloquent for one thing...

I agree with all of their suggestions though!

[Barsook]

I dig these ideas!

[The7DeadlyVenomz]

Oh, let me hop in here and add my backing. I support everything except the second point, unless the second point only refers to newb characters. I don't have a problem with below avg scores. But I won't shed tears if they go away, either.

I fully agree with a newbie area. How that's structured is the real query. Is it an IC-veiled locale? I've heard Newbs called farmers before. Can we newb school them in a farm? There are farms both north and south, so it would be a relevant thing to say IC in either locale. Is it a completely OOC construct? If so, you'd want to toss in echoes reminding them over and over this is an OOC location.

I prefer the farm, with multiple quests inside to teach them the basic mechanics of the game, such as forage, kill, eat and drink, along with social graces for the locale they are in, such as bowing and talking at tables, etc. Heavy scripting, of course, but I think it would work out great.

As for the Twitch streamer ... I don't know. That one worries me a bit, but at the same time, I'd be alright if it were a one time thing. The idea that people could glean IC secrets from watching a stream is real, but I don't think it's a concern that I would care about if it's just one stream, one time.

I'm down with the Youtube video on character creation.

Add a bow social, too.

The pregen characters is a good idea as well.

[Maso]

You guys know there is a newb tutorial area already, right?

*absolutely did not need to go through it when she returned... honest*

That said, I super fully support all ideation around the subject of attracting AND RETAINING (!!) new players. And think these are all cool ideas.

One thing discussed briefly on Discord was the possibility of 'audio stories'.. e.g. tweak some awesome logs to give them a short story-ish vibe and have someone record them, these could be downloadable from the website or.. streamable and also shared on Youtube etc. Possibly a touch more engaging than watching people play a text-based game. IsFriday did a cool recording when we were talking about this.. and honestly it was so freaking cool.

[triste]

Make sure maps exist for all starting areas and the directions command actually works for all starting areas.

Just making sure this thing we obviously need to fix is fixed, and not lost in the noise.

[The7DeadlyVenomz]

I ... forgot about that. I've never been in it, so I didn't even remember that, Maso. Hrmmm.

Audio stories - not bad.

Yeah, good call, Triste.

[slipshod]

I feel like this has been discussed before, but have we considered a listing on STEAM?  There are other MUDs listed there, and we could show up in some searches by genre tag.
  If every one of us active players seeded the listing with positive ratings, it could help us get off to a good start.

[The7DeadlyVenomz]

Steam? Really?

I don't remember discussing that.

[Akaramu]

What drew me to Arm aaaages ago was one simple thing: the stories. I've always supported the idea of presenting some of the many stories from Arm's long history in a way that is easily digestible for those unfamiliar with MUDs - the stories will keep players' curiosity aflame and help them overcome the hurdle of navigating a text only roleplaying game. Because for the majority of players, even roleplayers, the switch from tabletop and graphics to text is a huge undertaking.

So focus on the stories, I say. We need to get players motivated first before they're willing to scale that learning cliff and stick with it.

[The7DeadlyVenomz]

I sure don't disagree with that.

[meep79a]

Good ideas, but I think the biggest way to draw people into the game is to somehow showcase the best parts of ARM as in: the the stories you make by playing. I will always remember the stories I was able to make while playing, the drama and excitement was like no other game has ever given to me. If your going to advertise the game, I would think videos of people's old characters with some art telling the stories of their lives would peak peoples curiosity much more than a let's play, because in my experience ARM is lots of normal, lots of normal, then BAM something awesome happens.

100% agree with the ez character maker. DND dose this pretty well, and it works.

something like this but for ARM:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wkWDlIULvvU&ab_channel=PuffinForest

Ahh, a world with even 100 people on at all hours, would be just so fun.. I can just imagine..

*edit grammar.

[Barsook]

In a world where most don't read directions, I think the best is to do is do videos of the "Chronology of the Known World" page along with "What You Know" of the regions along with videos about the races. Animation would be a plus.

As for story videos, they would be also nice but not a top item on the list.

[Veselka]

Why not animate or re-tell some of the stories on original submissions? Or do a 'Behind the Scenes' with a few of them.

[Halcyon]

If there is a listing on Steam, I think it should come with a phone client and a software client option, both of which preconfigured with color, prompts, aliases, and a link to Mansa's newb help doc.

Whether in a newb area or new html character generator, I think classes, subguilds, races, and stat ranges could combine to generate a list of tags or a paragraph description.    I find character classes with outdoor forage, or one of the better craft skills or outdoor quit, to be inherently easier.    A pc who takes a city elf with no outdoor forage for food, no direction sense, and no stealth really ought to know they are choosing a harder mode of play.

Another mud I played in did a weekly rpt that could only be attended by players under some specific amount of time.  A real year might work.   Staff would do some artificial targeting of new pcs and let information, events and such flow out to the more experienced players.   This could be a great opportunity to get more focus on non magical, social, or criminal plotlines.   It could shift the focus of minor plots around from clan to clan.   It could give staff an opportunity to watch some of the newer players for particularly egregious behavior that needs to be curtailed.

I love the twitch idea.    I think it would have to be editted down to some of the more pivotal moments in a pcs life, and if it has to respect the one IC year thing... well, we should get on it.   I think its probably possible to follow more than one character, who are not central to the "secrit stuff".   One traveling trader, one Byn trooper and one half giant careening around the world, in turn, might be far enough removed from critical information to be presented with a shorter time lag.

[Halcyon]

Who is spearheading recruitment?

[Barsook]

Are there any RPI's or at least any MUDs that do have a web-based character gen? And video tutorials?

I for sure can name one with a web based client.

[Sephiroto]

I posted this brainstorming exercise to Discord a while back. It covers a potential way to route new players (or veterans optionally) through a funnel to help them survive and stay engaged long enough for the game to stick: https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1AXtzLLg64QiHsZdyaOx8OicIRsKcRuGh-qPBghKK_Aw/edit?usp=sharing

I don't expect something as code intensive to be implemented, but it is important to break down the pain points for new players and what keeps the game from being "sticky." The better we understand those factors, the more thoughtfully they can be addressed in some meaningful way, with or without code.

[oggotale]

When I was new to Arm and new to MUDs there was a 90% chance I'd quit Arm because of the maps.

This is the hardest part of Arm imho, I just had no clue what was where.

The default maps in the helpfile are, tbh, kinda bad at helping new players.

Two solutions are :

1) Modify and advertise moonlit sky, which is a client with an in built mapping feature
2) OR/AND upload some basic excel maps for use by new players - the colours these have make them much easier to read and they could also give the new player some idea of how the game is "structured".
They could be limited to maybe like 5 rooms outside nak but the basic templates would be there to fill out if required.
There could also be these maps for every major outpost that is accessible as a starting location so new players are not totally lost.

[triste]

1) Modify and advertise moonlit sky, which is a client with an in built mapping feature
2) OR/AND upload some basic excel maps for use by new players - the colours these have make them much easier to read and they could also give the new player some idea of how the game is "structured".
They could be limited to maybe like 5 rooms outside nak but the basic templates would be there to fill out if required.
There could also be these maps for every major outpost that is accessible as a starting location so new players are not totally lost.

#1 intriguing, if it workw cross platform this is great.
#2 Love it (Sadly this forum doesn't have a like button, so just gonna say, love it). I would try to help make that on a website if given permission.

[oggotale]

1) Modify and advertise moonlit sky, which is a client with an in built mapping feature
2) OR/AND upload some basic excel maps for use by new players - the colours these have make them much easier to read and they could also give the new player some idea of how the game is "structured".
They could be limited to maybe like 5 rooms outside nak but the basic templates would be there to fill out if required.
There could also be these maps for every major outpost that is accessible as a starting location so new players are not totally lost.

#1 intriguing, if it workw cross platform this is great.
#2 Love it (Sadly this forum doesn't have a like button, so just gonna say, love it). I would try to help make that on a website if given permission.

Moonlit sky j beleive is just for PC

I would say it's a must have to grip players who are newly jumping into MUDs

There was a time when I couldn't imagine playing without the mapping tool automatically telling me where I was.

Ofc now I'm used to it but when I began it seemed impossible


I also wonder of there's anyway to create some mapping script server side?

Like something which, if you're in Nam, puts an X where you are on a server generated map.
If you're outdoors it puts an X in your approx location, something like that.
Maybe even have the accuracy of X contingent on your direction sense skill.

Ofc that seems too ambitious

[Sephiroto]

Okay, just streaming ideas here in response to the "we need a map" feedback and not being too serious about this actually being done:

• One issue with building a mapping tool is that players will be cross-platform
• You'll want one mapping/positioning pipeline regardless of player platform/client
• An event driven system using webhooks could accommodate any platform and stream events to consumers viewing maps with very low overhead. E.g., playerID1234 enters roomID5678. WHILE myPlayerID = playerID1234 THEN positionOnMap(playerID1234); this is updated by a push from the server each time playerID1234 changes room.
• As a proof of concept, if a full map of the game was built (excluding certain indoor/underground/secret areas), webhooks could feed player coordinates to the map off an event pipeline.
• Naturally it'd make sense to start with a small area to play test, get feedback, and iterate.
• Such a map could be visible on the website when logged into your account and show your position, if available. While not ideal, this would be an interim solution for the cross-platform problem.
• An event pipeline could tally player location by region/city and be useful for staff monitoring, events, general statistics, etc.
• It's important that a solution like this uses a secure contract so that users couldn't spoof requests to request for positions of other players, or get other player IDs