The Allanak Problem

[triste]

The inference I get from some of these posts is 'I should only be PK'd or Killed in the fashion I find desirable', and that cannot and should not be the case 100% of the time. Or even 50% of the time.

Correct, this is mentioned in the video Lotion shared and I mentioned it as well, that everyone wants to "win" more than half of the time, but by definition cannot because the average win rate across a pool of all contenders is 50% [in a two player binary outcome game].

What I don't understand is why everyone keeps giving the same "What's the problem," argument complacently without showing an ounce of sympathy for people who are, in fact, "losing" more than 80%, 90% of the time. The problem is the skew: some players have posted about how they've gotten more 20 sponsored roles in their time playing, while other players quit lamenting that they haven't been given a single sponsored role in 10 years of playing.

Yes, this game isn't supposed to be fair, the setting isn't supposed to be fair. But if we continue to be hardheaded and gloss over the experience actually being had by players like Tapas and dozens of others, well, we'll validate so many Reddit posts that have characterized our community in an unkind way.

We need to show some empathy; your experience might have been good, and mixed. My experience with this game has mixed highs and lows. But for a lot of people it's loss after loss until they give up.

[tapas]

The inference I get from some of these posts is 'I should only be PK'd or Killed in the fashion I find desirable', and that cannot and should not be the case 100% of the time. Or even 50% of the time.

It's really just a handful of ways. Whiran summons have been fixed. Shitmugging has been fixed (to my knowledge). Arrow spam is still deadly but has been seriously reduced in it's effectiveness.

The ole' allanakki high five (half-giant subdue) is a concern but that varies with the maturity of the templar player. There are plenty that will use it for an ez pk. There are others that might just use it as a scare tactic.

It's really just apartments and estates.

[LindseyBalboa]

how many people objecting to mass amounts of murders inside apartments have actually been murdered in apartments?
of those, how many people have been murdered so many times in an apartment they consider it a problem because it keeps happening?

[Obeliskocism]

I'm having deja vu all over again

Locked Apartments - 2016

[Aruven]

Really well written post Armaddict.

I think some recent IC events make me believe the Main Street is alive and well.  The Senate comes to mind as an especially awesome thing - I really hope this becomes a frequent event, perhaps annually so players can count on it!  But with all that said, I hope we continue to lean in on that.  It's important that the side streets remain open... we don't want people who are trying to escape main street have no where to go, but main street is more critical for the health the game when it comes to staff and player focus in my humble opinion.

Here's my take on what should be the "main street" of Armageddon:

• The Arm of the Dragon and the Templarate
• The Allanaki noble houses
• The Greater and Minor Merchant Houses
• [Insert current antagonist clans] (maybe they change over time due to IC events)

Anything not on that list should still exist, still potentially influence main street in interesting ways, but should come with the understanding that support is more likely to be limited.  That's just my two cents.

It's so funny reading this. Not being sarcastic, this was always the exact opposite for me. When I started playing Allanak was a famine infested shit hole where you hadn't heard shit from Tektolnes and then they lost a Copper War. The Sun-King was awakening from his conflict with the Dragon and Allanak was feeling bristly about the shifting of power northwards. -- There was no stability in Allanak in leadership (See guild running shit era) and the big dicks in the game were Lirathans and long lived Jihaens.

One of my first Allanaki characters was a borsail Wyvern (My avatar name) and my second and third were Tor scorpions. Then I played in the Oashi guard and I loved it. (Notice my beef here?)

I'll still play in Allanak. As I read this further it is just a note for me and perhaps other older players that things are simply different. In my own case, none of those houses are open in that form anymore. The flavor of Allanak i became accustomed to for a decade and a half just changed enough that it seems unfamiliar to me in some ways and super cool in others.

[triste]

Borsail Wyvern, Tor Scorpion, Oashi Guard... these are all positions people have also expressed interest in reopening, along with GMH House Hunters this thread.

The key to "main street" is you need jobs for the people on main street. Not just 14 nobles and their aides, which has dominated the conversation. And Aides/Templar dominating a conversation about "The Allanak Problem" is completely appropriate because it's a huge part of the problem, but let's talk solutions. Allanak has hosted a lot of great roles like the Tor Scorpions and it's worth looking into opening more of these so we can stop whining about being an Aide and/or getting killed by Templars. Plots like "We need an unit of Tor Scorpions to assist the Borsail Wyverns in capturing a Mekillot for use in conquest," by definition, engages and interests more players than "Oh my aide Talia has kanked a half-elf and I am kanking her as well, now I need to kill Talia and get my pecker blessed by a Vivaduan." The first plot involves 30 people from main street while the second plot involves three. More plots like the former and less like the latter, please.

[Tuannon]

The Tor Scorpions
The Borsail Wyverns (not Amber)
The Oashi Elites

All point of the spear units within their house militaries. The Scorpions doubly so because they are responsible for training the OTHER elite military units to be better at what they do.

These are not units that need huge PC populations, I think Allanak needs more plebian soldiers and maybe 10% or less of the 'soldier population' could be elite people.

While I agree that there are too many neo-silk commoners about, I think the solution is not do the same thing but with bone swords. Make more shit tier rank and file people and allow a small percentage to be elites. I think the solution is the same on both the bone sword and silk braies sides of the coin.

[roughneck]

There's something to this.

When you could be a Salarri hunter, Kadian hunter, Byn, Oashi elite, Tor scorpion, or whatever else, you had more options for your next PC after you died. Sometimes a clan would be empty, sometimes full, but you had options for your next PC after you died. Change of scenery goes a long way. It also gives more reason to go to a tavern when all available PC's of similar social class aren't already in your clan.

It also meant more competition for PC's which can result in engaged leadership, tavern vitality, and conflict.

[triste]

While I agree that there are too many neo-silk commoners about,

I just want to say I love "neo-silk commoners." When you visit Armageddon Dot Org you don't see a neo-silk commoner, that's all I am saying.

Point taken on needing more grunt troops, not elite troops. I think roughneck and I are fond of all the old groups and divisions because it offered separation/variety. But I agree you need balance, and these elite units were often too anemic to support the training of entry level grunts -- they would go to the Byn first for basic training, then become a Wyvern, etc.

So is the answer just to expand the Byn and Militia? I've seen, more than once, and more often than not, that a dual Sergeant situation in the Byn results in comi-tragic in-fighting. This is not the fault of the players, but because of what it's like leading in those circumstances: you constantly have the other Sergeant pulling your troops away to a different location. You are left, by design, in a rival-like situation. Maybe the solution to offer the clear separation with a new Hunting / Scouting / Traveling specialized unit, and a Guarding / Assassination / Warfare specialized unit, that can come together and use each other's troops only for large, meaningful RPTs. This would open up roles for grunts, the grunts can all still train together daily and get together on RPTs, but it allows Sergeants to not compete and rather cooperate and offer a very different experience for players who like variety.

[Barsook]

There's something to this.

When you could be a Salarri hunter, Kadian hunter, Byn, Oashi elite, Tor scorpion, or whatever else, you had more options for your next PC after you died. Sometimes a clan would be empty, sometimes full, but you had options for your next PC after you died. Change of scenery goes a long way. It also gives more reason to go to a tavern when all available PC's of similar social class aren't already in your clan.

It also meant more competition for PC's which can result in engaged leadership, tavern vitality, and conflict.

Can we say this cut of elite groups be a "let go" of a cursed problem along with staff not railroading plots? I don't want to repeat ourselves from earlier in the thread and maybe we need to see each of the problems in the way that the speaker's thoughts in terms of cursed problems. We are getting the point where we going in circles.

[Armaddict]

The PCs who did the killing, though? They had nothing to do with that, and gave me the best ending they possibly could in that situation. I vastly prefer this over a backstab or an arrow out of nowhere, with no explanation or without even knowing who killed my PC.

So please, as far as I'm concerned? Lure me into a locked room anytime, it's much better than seeing a random mantishead out of nowhere. I really, really don't understand where the hate for that sort of kill is coming from, or why I shouldn't be doing it.

Continue to do it insofar as you aren't receiving a warning from staff about it being done poorly or improperly.  Even then...sometimes staff make some assumptions of their own and even go full-on ahead with that assumption, and you're still fine even if they wag their finger at you (as long as their assumption is wrong).  What you describe is exactly what I've been talking about, where 'choosing the manner of death', if you will, on an ooc level, is just setting yourself up for disappointment.  We all die jarring, unsatisfying deaths, and that's kinda the way it's gotta be or else we're ruining the gameworld we play in.

Sentences that make sense, 2020.

It makes sense.  You basically just reduced a comment down to exactly what I'd spent a lot of time describing beforehand.  Showed it pretty spectacularly, really, or at least I thought so at the time.  Something something bottom line game has to be the way I want it or you suck something something.  Paraphrasing clear.

[LindseyBalboa]

so... back to the topic of Allanak being the main hub of the game but not always having the largest PC population representing that...

honestly, I think it'll just cycle around as people die and make new characters, new sponsored roles come into Allanak, new stuff happens in Allanak. Over my time here, the happening spot tends to move around.

[The7DeadlyVenomz]

We all die jarring, unsatisfying deaths, and that's kinda the way it's gotta be or else we're ruining the gameworld we play in.

Preach.

[triste]

We all die jarring, unsatisfying deaths, and that's kinda the way it's gotta be or else we're ruining the gameworld we play in.

Preach.

Preach as long as the "We all" part holds true, and some people aren't getting disappointing deaths 10 times more often than others. Because this is a game, and it's nice in games if the enjoyment is as evenly distributed as possible.

[roughneck]

We all die jarring, unsatisfying deaths, and that's kinda the way it's gotta be or else we're ruining the gameworld we play in.

Preach.

Preach as long as the "We all" part holds true, and some people aren't getting disappointing deaths 10 times more often than others. Because this is a game, and it's nice in games if the enjoyment is as evenly distributed as possible.

Your PC death will often be congruent with your playstyle. Don't like your deaths? Play differently. When I fight nasty NPC's, one might get me, if dying that way sucks to me, then I shouldn't play that way. When I scheme against templars, my PC might get thrown in a dungeon and killed that way, my choice got us there. If I play conservative, my pc's life may be boring, and the death may also be boring. Its not the game's fault and it's not favoritism. Choose your destiny.

[tapas]

Sentences that make sense, 2020.

It makes sense.  You basically just reduced a comment down to exactly what I'd spent a lot of time describing beforehand.  Showed it pretty spectacularly, really, or at least I thought so at the time.  Something something bottom line game has to be the way I want it or you suck something something.  Paraphrasing clear.

Either I'm retarded or you're having trouble communicating without impenetrable innuendo. Either way I cannot grasp whatever nuance you are trying to portray. I mean other than that you don't dig what I'm putting out.

[tapas]

I do agree with Triste that leader players who tend lean on cheap estate kills etc. tend not to understand what the big deal is because A. It probably won't happen to them as a leader or through a string of leader characters. And B. It's a considerable source of coded power for leader PC's.

But then if you're not playing a leader and that bullshit gets sprung on you two or three times in a row, it becomes infuriating.

[Kryos]

I'd like to put forth the following idea:  the onus of exposition is not on the weapon that kills a player, but the hand that wields it.

The assassin is not responsible for anything other than carrying out the assassination.

The person that hired them better DAMN WELL be pounding out the conflict with the person to be assassinated. 

The onus, and it is a great one, is on them.

When the two roles are wrapped into one, such as when you get 'estate ganked' is a reflection of the fact that person is trusted to do such things in a manner that is good for the game and the players.  If you feel that isn't the case, you should probably take a day off, then come back and reflect.  Was it really a bad scene and conclusion or are your emotions (and this game's RPI/Perma death/competitive nature's all evoke emotion in the player) clouding your judgement?  If its the former, toss in a complaint.  They deserve to know they fucked up.  The latter?  Roll another and take to heart the lessons offered.

Second, a short story.

I played a templar once, it was an interesting experience.  Relevant to this thread is that there was a certain PC I found in jail.  First time?  No problem.  look <criminal>.  Doesn't look too wealthy. Crime:  attacking NPCS.  OK:  give me 200 sid and get out of my sight, I don't want to see you again, understand? I took down a note this is a new player, and if they get caught again I should spice things up with opportunity if I could.  They got caught again.

The next RL day they are back in jail, for the same crime.  'Remember how I told you I don't want to see you again?  You've got a new punishment now.  Get out of Allanak, go spy on <x> and report back to me.  Do a good job and your banishment is over.'  Escorted them to the gates, banished, and walked home.  My character felt he had created an asset out of a liability, I as a player knew I did more to enhance the game experience than detract for a newbie:  all is well.  Right?

Wrong.  The same RL day that player is back in jail and refused to do the task I asked of them.  So I areaned them to death.  At least they got to die gloriously right?

Wrong.  That player wrote a post on the GDB calling me all sorts of pejoratives for how I acted and that this game was bad, this game's mom was bad, etc.  I felt bad for about a minute.  Then I looked back and said:  nope, fuck it I did a great job.

Could I have done more?  Maybe. The moral of the story is you can't win them all, and the good players on both sides take a moment to consider.

Makes you wonder just how many 'nooblars' 'estate killers' and such are actually good players getting a bad wrap from people who got what they deserved,  and how many deserve that epithet.  At least I hope it does. 

[triste]

I do agree with Triste that leader players who tend lean on cheap estate kills etc. tend not to understand what the big deal is because A. It probably won't happen to them as a leader or through a string of leader characters. And B. It's a considerable source of coded power for leader PC's.

But then if you're not playing a leader and that bullshit gets sprung on you two or three times in a row, it becomes infuriating.

Basically this.

Your PC death will often be congruent with your playstyle. Don't like your deaths? Play differently.

Totally moot point. Some people are never allowed to play leaders due to undocumented rules around minimum play times. So when I whine about someone killing me by abusing code like guard summoning and clan dumping it's literally something I am never going to be allowed to experience other than experiencing it as a victim. So sorry, due to arbitrary rules like needing to sacrifice 10 hours a week to be a leader, this isn't just a "If you don't like it, play something different" scenario.

It's like we're playing a game of cops and robbers and I keep getting my ass arrested and I have one kid saying, "If you don't like being arrested, stop playing a robber," and another kid saying, "Sorry you are only allowed to play a role where you get arrested, we're never giving you power or authority here!" Ooooookay. The answer then becomes if you don't like being arrested, quit playing the game entirely.

When it comes to using NPC guards to arrest people, and using leader only commands to kill people, there is a huge imbalance of power that makes the answer to "Why did this PC die in a jail cell?" extremely fucking obvious. Literally stop blaming the victim, particularly when you stonewall some players out of leadership for arbitrary reasons.

To go with the cops and robbers metaphor, as a kid I was often forced to play villains because I was one of four latin kids in a predominantly asian school. Was me being type cast and forced to be beat up by the "good" kids right or fair? Hell fucking no. Is it ever right to force people into certain roles and out of certain roles for arbitrary and undocumented reasons? Hell no. Is it alright to kick someone on the ground and say, "Hahah if you don't like the pain of getting kicked, lick my boots instead?" Yes, if it's consensual, but if it's not and you are being forced to lick boots and you are being forced to be kicked for years without consent or hope for reversal then it sucks.

Again, it's easy for people who have been given privledge to forget empathy or even the logic and parameters of the game they are playing. The game isn't fair, which is fine, but there is only so much abuse people can endure and I am explaining what causes a lot of people to give up.

I will try to give up the point but my alignment is hella true neutral and the imbalance and blithe abuse of suffering people makes me go bonkers and spout quotes about restoring balance like Jahiera from Baldur's Gate. Probably why I play so many gicks and outdoorsy types: if you operate in a society that has given you a slave like status, you need to figure out how to break your chains somehow.

[tapas]

I'd like to put forth the following idea:  the onus of exposition is not on the weapon that kills a player, but the hand that wields it.

The assassin is not responsible for anything other than carrying out the assassination.

The person that hired them better DAMN WELL be pounding out the conflict with the person to be assassinated. 

The onus, and it is a great one, is on them.

When the two roles are wrapped into one, such as when you get 'estate ganked' is a reflection of the fact that person is trusted to do such things in a manner that is good for the game and the players.  If you feel that isn't the case, you should probably take a day off, then come back and reflect.  Was it really a bad scene and conclusion or are your emotions (and this game's RPI/Perma death/competitive nature's all evoke emotion in the player) clouding your judgement?  If its the former, toss in a complaint.  They deserve to know they fucked up.  The latter?  Roll another and take to heart the lessons offered.

Second, a short story.

I played a templar once, it was an interesting experience.  Relevant to this thread is that there was a certain PC I found in jail.  First time?  No problem.  look <criminal>.  Doesn't look too wealthy. Crime:  attacking NPCS.  OK:  give me 200 sid and get out of my sight, I don't want to see you again, understand? I took down a note this is a new player, and if they get caught again I should spice things up with opportunity if I could.  They got caught again.

The next RL day they are back in jail, for the same crime.  'Remember how I told you I don't want to see you again?  You've got a new punishment now.  Get out of Allanak, go spy on <x> and report back to me.  Do a good job and your banishment is over.'  Escorted them to the gates, banished, and walked home.  My character felt he had created an asset out of a liability, I as a player knew I did more to enhance the game experience than detract for a newbie:  all is well.  Right?

Wrong.  The same RL day that player is back in jail and refused to do the task I asked of them.  So I areaned them to death.  At least they got to die gloriously right?

Wrong.  That player wrote a post on the GDB calling me all sorts of pejoratives for how I acted and that this game was bad, this game's mom was bad, etc.  I felt bad for about a minute.  Then I looked back and said:  nope, fuck it I did a great job.

Could I have done more?  Maybe. The moral of the story is you can't win them all, and the good players on both sides take a moment to consider.

Makes you wonder just how many 'nooblars' 'estate killers' and such are actually good players getting a bad wrap from people who got what they deserved,  and how many deserve that epithet.  At least I hope it does.

I recognize the above happens and I've actually been in that position before as a militia sergeant.

But I've also been nailed by a templar who wouldn't take bribes, couldn't be negotiated with and made a judgement based on false accusations that could have easily been cross checked.

[triste]

But I've also been nailed by a templar who wouldn't take bribes, couldn't be negotiated with and made a judgement based on false accusations that could have easily been cross checked.

Redacted reply; accidentally posted about an incident that occurred 359 days ago, have to wait longer.

I have to explain the case without a poetic anecdote, then. Locked room, false accusation deaths are the epitome of sub-par politics and we can all do better. I think anyone able to see both sides gets this point. The more we talk about this, the more it becomes obvious that Staff should examine some code mechanisms at play here. It is possible to kill people inescapably and without their agency very easily if you [1] convince the leader of that person's clan to clan dump them while they are inside the compound, thus trapping them inescapably and [2] Simply don't listen to the person as you kill them, with whatever justification you manufacture. It's code abuse at point 1, and just someone being a jerk (ICly or not) at point 2. PKs motivated by or coordinated by metagaming are also shitty and a problem the game has but less specific to Allanak than the code abuse utilized by leadership PCs in Allanak.

Many people posting here romance the just-world fallacy and think people killed in backrooms are like moths who flew to the flame and deserved it. But no, there are clear cut cases of people being killed without "provoking" or "earning" their death and without agency such as in the clan-dump kill on false pretense scenario. How shocking that Tapas and I both experienced this. It's almost like moths aren't flying to flames, but that someone is walking around with a blowtorch killing moths while they just flutter around minding their own business. How shocking that a lot of players who have been killed in this way mention avoiding Allanak. It's almost like Allanak is full of so many blowtorch happy people that moths -- or anyone who doesn't like being burned -- shouldn't visit at all.

Staff, please let us know if clan-dump kills like what I describe are against the rules and I will pull my complaint from the GDB here and put it in a player complaint, but according to posters on the GDB misusing code that way is A-OK.

[Shabago]

So sorry, due to arbitrary rules like needing to sacrifice 10 hours a week to be a leader, this isn't just a "If you don't like it, play something different" scenario.

As far as clans that I'm overseeing go, this isn't going to change. Sorry. Expecting what basically works out to an hour a night is not a big ask. This is in place because one does not out weight the enjoyment of 10-15 or more, pending leader life-time. Even with that min requirement, I can go back through the GDB and no doubt find a hundred smacks at leaders / clans for 'Never being around' and a ton more IC complaints on the same grounds with (potentially) meta bleed in of frustration. That single hour a night is going to attempt to entertain/engage X direct clannies, generate plots, run an hour long RPT to Y and allow Z for actual personal downtime fun and character growth RP. Meeting even /half/ of the metrics above would require that min 10 hours. These roles exist to generate fun for others. If others can never find you due to play times, the clan dies. PCs store from boredom, lack of direction, and the would be plots/stories have no means of being executed.

Is it 'fair' to the one? No. Is it fair to the ten others actively trying to move things to give that one the slot? No. Lesser of two evils.

Staff, please let us know if clan-dump kills like what I describe are against the rules and I will pull my complaint from the GDB here and put it in a player complaint, but according to posters on the GDB misusing code that way is A-OK.

Impossible to give a concrete 100% answer here. 9/10, absolutely ridiculous and staff will come down on (and have) leaders that pull this nonsense. It's lame. The only time it isn't lame, and thus the inability to say 100% is when players pull (and have) equally ridiculous behaviour inside of a clan/estate/tribe camp that would most certainly generate a frenzy smack down.

In short terms, leaders:

Unless players are pulling grievous offences inside the clan/House, don't pull the clan dump meta.

In short terms, clannies:

If you're CLEARLY cornered, RP it rather than the twink 'hide in plain sight' or 'flee rush the gates' past 20 people who WOULD try to stop you if a Sergeant/Noble yelled after your fleeing self. Try realism.

[triste]

Thanks for the clear feedback on clan dump killing and leadership playtime requirements.

I keep playing this game with the hope that Staff do care (they do) and are trying to address some of the gameplay issues such as with the karma system. I still play this game because there are tolerable niches for you if you are an adequate roleplayer but can't play more than 10 hours a week, like being a tribal. Per the thread I miss niches that used to exist in the city like that, like city elf tribal or GMH hunter. I'll stop crying because staff mentioned maybe even working on city elves for instance.

[Dar]

The few times I was in position when the npcs would assist me and I could use that to kill my enemies, staffer 'always' told me not to use them for PK.

Ive been present in situation like that 4 times.


Once, I originated it. I lured one of my unofficial spies into my camp with 4 other of my tribe mates, and when he told me he will not work for my tribe anymore, I had 4 other PCs jump him. There were 3 NPCs in there and they helped too.

I can't say I got too much flack from staff that day. The PCs would be more then enough to kill the guy. But I was most definitely delivered the point that tribe tents weren't ment for executions.

I also saw a guildie straight out use NPCs to murder a dude. I also saw that NPC get animated and ask for payment from the guildie.     Though I'm sure not every time this gets noticed by staff in real time.


Interesting thing about that spy that goes along the pk or not pk thing.


I was a young dealer of Akai sjir and only getting into the swing of things. The tribe had a weakish network of spies and one of those spies got seen being recruited by a Lirathans master assassin underworld enforcer.

I couldn't stop it. Didn't have the power, or the influence to outmatch a Lirathans operative, and nothing yet to really offer for the spy to choose not to disclose things he learned during work for my predecessor.

So about an hour after the spy got turned, I had him come to my tents, had a conversation, confirmed the spy is lost to us, had him die, then dumped him on the street with head smashed to look like he fell from a rooftop and watched the assassin who turned him find the body.

None of my other spies got turned and they all told me when they got approached by her.


The spy in question though? I bet he was wtfed. His murder was near instant and orchestrated by a PC 6 hours out of chargen.  I could understand he'd be salty and think his death was unfair and uncalled for. But ... I'm sorry. This game is not about being fair. It's about stories of betrayal, corruption, and murder.

[Obeliskocism]

I think we all know it, but right now, Allanak has barely a population of players.

Why? What can we do to bring people to this 'RP Hub'? And honestly, is it worth pushing any RP into it?

Restating the OP in an attempt to re-rail a thread that has crisscrossed some interesting terrain.
I think apartments and apartment kills are not unique to Allanak.
Clan compound kills will happen wherever clans have compounds.
Templars are a staple of city-states and and have a godking given duty to squash criminal plots.
We might be able to get innovative with how we advertise job/RP openings in the city.
More locations and role-types is a double edged sword: more chemical reagents for conflict, dispersed playerbase.

I identified an issue back on like the second page of this thread that I thought addressed the OP, which others have stated and restated as well. 
Allanak has always had a dominant position on the global stage - a Zalanthas superpower - but that the scales had tipped too far with Allanak the only player left on the stage, and that meant a lack of meaningful conflict to generate juicy storylines.

In the meantime since this thread started we've seen more activity on the Allanak rumor boards and with the Senate, and in the wake of those events Allanak and Allanakis will have more to do.

Gentleboy's original question had a couple parts.  Why is Allanak kinda stagnant, and what can we do to breathe life into it (if it's worth breathing life into).

When answering the first part - Why? - let's try to make those observations specific to Allanak in this thread.

I think we're mostly agreed that Allanak is worth saving.
And maybe with the Senate and ensuing plotlines we have done/are doing it.
And unless and until Tuluk reopens we shall make the best of what resources and stories we have at our disposal to keep things interesting.