Lack of Character Development?

[Gentleboy]

Hey all, I've talked about this before in the past, but I think it's important to talk about as a group.

Do you all feel that character development is null due to the environment, lack of knowledge of in-game history, and starting a character with such a firm idea that they become nearly a parody?

I know I'm guilty of this. There's an attitude in game where people are reluctant to admit they were wrong, change their opinions, and change their overall demeanor. And I'm not talking about towards mutants, breeds, other races.

Instead of genuinely liking or hating people, that goes to the backburner if someone is useful. This makes things feel a bit...flat. It also conflicts with the game world.

Anyhow, what do you all think? I haven't been playing a year so I can't give examples, but I will be watching the chat and excited to hear if my point of view is wrong!

This post was written while eating a bowl of cereal.

[cnemus]

I do not think character development is null.

I personally step into a new character with a few defining character traits that I feel strongly about and wait for IC events to shape the rest. I may tick off a few checkmarks on a spectrum as well such as "how much do they despise elves?" 1 = loathe them in private 10 = kill on sight.

I see lots of development and changes in characters, growing, maturing, perspectives changing and try to express those myself, but not all development is public. You may only get to see the inner workings of characters you personally know well.

I try to give players the benefit of the doubt. I assume that even if I don't know the reason for a behavior, there is one.

As to admitting they were wrong... that often is a political/power nuance. Someone in a position of power doesn't have to admit fault to a lesser. There is no human resources that will slap them on the wrist. The only factor in those interactions is "What do I get from admitting I was wrong?" If the answer is one politically and violently irrelevant person feeling better, that's not worth the loss of projected infallibility. Apologies in Zalanthas are often to prevent retaliation from an organization, not an individual, regardless of fault. Amos apologizes to Templar Smiteface for breathing in the same city as them, not because Amos did anything wrong but because Templar will SMITEFACE. Sergeant Getslost doesn't ever admit they don't know where they are going because the runners opinions do not matter... only their bosses and contract makers. You better believe they grovel to Lady Kasix for the mistake.

Lastly... development usually happens over IG years. You may only see it when you come around and meet the person from 6 RL months ago again on another character, or when you have survived for a bit longer. If a character is having personality defining changes every RL month...IG they are probably going to be treated as insane. That said, if I'm not enjoying a character, the solution is usually a personality change. I look for what isn't working for me, pick a direction, then actively look for IG opportunities to make that shift. I like crazy.

Sometimes people value utility over prejudice, sometimes they do not. That is one of the spectrums. I have played people who would never work with *insert race* under any circumstances and others who *play nice in public but secretly arrange to have them murdered*. The public perception is not always the private reality. There should be some genuine fear when people *are nice*. That is usually a red flag that someone is lying and about to get murdered.

If someone gives you something for free the first question should be "How is this going to kill me?" Is it expensive and assassin bait? Is it stolen? Is it clan restricted? Usually... all of the above.

[Decameron]

I do not think character development is null.

Just as Cnemus mentioned, I believe we can start with a base-line with our characters, but ultimately it should be IC experiences and time which help guide that character in a particular direction.

These changes should stem from IC events, but true change should be be internal. By internal, I don't mean you as a player deciding that your character hates aide tressy now, because they laughed at you for your new (and arguably fucking awesome) tregil mask. Bring this change into the world. Use thinks, feels, bios, and actually give yourself an opportunity to have an internal dialogue. Have them reflect on events, and you might find something more meaningful from it. Your character's development is your responsibility. No one else can do it for you.

The more time that passes the more of these experiences you'll cross, some may contradict one another, or further lean them to one side or the other. That's all good. It leads to a more believable character.

Zalanthas is a very harsh place. It's not a game of who can get make enough friends. If you feel that being 'flat' with your interactions has been a problem in the past, then I encourage you to try and change things up. Let something slip. Make a mistake. Get drunk and tell aide tressy that if they put in as much effort as you in on your tregil mask, maybe their noble would actually like them. Don't be afraid to make enemies. No one is going to look back fondly on your character and say 'Man, they really sat the shit outta that bar.'

Admitting Wrong

Let other people RP and develop how they are going to. Self justification is a thing, even IC. Samos, Gin, and whoever else didn't wake up, stare at themselves in the mirror and say 'Whelp, time to ruin some lives today.' They had people very important to them, and things they were fighting for. Everyone's the hero in their own mind.  Maybe they did take whatever facts you were handing to them and did develop internally from it, maybe this did inspire change, and this sort of change wasn't expressed to you. Maybe there were IC reasons as to why they didn't just admit you were right, despite the player full-well knowing they were in the wrong. Maybe there wasn't any change at all, because they didn't care. Kind of sounds like real life.

[tiny rainbow]

Only +1-10 oh NO there's a whole fun spectrum of this which can develop, even people in high society can fall to temptation and ruin, that's where the money is <3 (maybe especially so it's a bigger drop, more forbidden and terrifying and exciting) This is all supported by the messages in the world!

-1 "Pretends to hate elves, viciously in public, contrasted with obsessive desires that shame and plague them."

-2 makes special trips to visit the Luir's pleasure dens. Watches those "entertainers" dance.

-3 downwards to to depravity - Enjoys those elves in the pleasure dens room emotes that occasionally sliiide off the walls towards "victims".

-4 Regularly visits behind the western curtains for where those echoing whipping noises and worse come from. Enjoys being told what a weak human they are. Gets taken for all the coin they have. LIKES IT.

-5 smuggling alley elves into silken luxury, water, fruits, oils, giving them baths and playing dress up

-6 tattoos in forbidden languages proclaiming exciting blasphemies, starts building a secret altar underground worshipping Sun Runners (they can keep going forever, right?)

-7 incognito as commoner (this was a thing in Victorian times too), pays multiple elves for debased debauchery

-8 actually goes insane and starts trying to build a revolution based around making elves the new rulers

-9 ?? PROFIT ??

--10dooooom - Perverse fascination to wonder what happens if stop taking the mul mix.. Great one for a noble if try hide and protect, so much drama

[valeria]

I would be bored to death without character development. 

For me, it helps to deliberately create a character.  I like to think up their strengths, weaknesses, major and minor flaws, and mannerisms before hand, and then I try to imagine how they would react in scenarios that make them happy, sad, angry, frightened, and others.  And then I let my character's strengths and weaknesses develop and change as the events and people in their story have an impact on them.

And I always leave them open to change to fit their situation.  I've painted myself into an unhappy character corner way too many times to make that mistake again.  If I'm not having fun playing my character, I'll invent an excuse to get them out of the situation or to give them a new perspective on the situation.  Because feeling trapped sucks.

[Inks]

Character development is great, although I try to lesson it personality wise on my dwarves.

[worldofsand]

Do you all feel that character development is null due to the environment, lack of knowledge of in-game history, and starting a character with such a firm idea that they become nearly a parody?

To me it's more the fact that impactful things so rarely happen to my characters that there's not much cause for development. This MUD is played very low to the ground, and you can go a month without experiencing anything memorable if you weren't in the right room at the right time. I like Armageddon for its realism, for its heavy-handed code and the interesting balance between roleplay and RPG, as opposed to a MUSH where there isn't even a game to play when you aren't actively participating in a scene; but it's not a game that inspires much of a character arc unless you force it upon yourself. I might have my characters turn more jaded or more idealistic or something, but usually it's just because I feel like that's suitable, not so much because of some genuinely life-changing experience. Armageddon seldom hands those out, you tend to have to invent them for yourself.

There's an attitude in game where people are reluctant to admit they were wrong, change their opinions, and change their overall demeanor. And I'm not talking about towards mutants, breeds, other races.

This is really just a human thing, and an internet thing. The same can be said of any gaming community or discussion forum. People sitting behind computer screens are less likely to admit a wrong or change an opinion based on something said or done by a total stranger. Maybe it's stronger here because there are players who have been around for decades, but otherwise I don't think it's an Armageddon thing. When you have no idea who someone is, what their motivations are, how their experiences match up with yours and so on, it's just against human nature to respect their views if they conflict with yours. We're conditioned through evolution to trust those we're familiar with and distrust those with whom we have nothing in common.

This is also why games like these are so prone to OOC cliques. When there's such a hard wall between IC and OOC, the people you do become familiar with end up feeling so much more trustworthy compared to anoymous players you only meet through your characters. That's the really big difference between an RPI and any other kind of game where you can freely interact with all the players around you and get to know them or at least understand their intentions. And then there's the nature of Zalanthas as a setting, which amplifies all of that.

[RogueGunslinger]

It's a product of the medium. In TV, Books, Movies the characters all have a singular narrative that is guiding the audience through the arc of different characters. Armageddon isn't like that at all. Everyone is writing their own story, so unless a player is being incredibly apparent about their own growth then you aren't likely to see much.

Also there's often just not enough time for a character to grow. Also, sometimes a players goes in with a character idea because it sounds fun and interesting. Changing away from that may make the person uninterested in playing.