Alley-safe Equipment

[gotdamnmiracle]

I don't know about ya'll, but my favorite type of aesthetic in the game is the rinthwear. I love that a sharpened chair leg can be a weapon and the discarded linen drapes of some Fale Aide become your robes. I know that people tend to be creative with what's available and use what already exists to great extent.

One problem I DO have however is the apparent lack of alley safe shields. In a world where weapons are cheaper than water, armor is some plentiful and discarded that not wearing any is a sign of status, then why not have some scraped up shields and hunks of carapace, etc. I'm aware these exist, but the number is so low you get one of three different flavors. I'd just like to point this out to those builders or crafters interested in such things.

[650Booger]

what does alley safe mean

[MeTekillot]

Under a certain value as to not trigger it being sometin wurt' takin'

[Cind]

>The rinthi dwarf says, in rinthi-accented sirihish,
     "that is a nice cross-etched, ivory-linked chain, I sure would like me a cross-etched, ivory-linked chain"

>You think:
     "Fuck Jon!"
>Your vision goes black.

[Inks]

There are plenty imo. Also 2 in rinth starter shops and 1 in Nakki starter shops. Also you should mc some because rinth best.

[Hauwke]

I dont think I have ever used the optimal weapons aside from for aesthetic purposes, if skmeone MC's some low quality, cheaper Byn gear I am almost certain that it will see some level of use. There is a weapon IG that a Byn Elf MC'd that still sees frequent use among them.

[gotdamnmiracle]

There are plenty imo. Also 2 in rinth starter shops and 1 in Nakki starter shops. Also you should mc some because rinth best.

Lol.

My last Rinth PC had to hire a merchant house simply to MC a sheath that was alleysafe. The whole situation was completely ridiculous to me, but it was simply the nature of the thing because there were zero other options available. Now with the MC sub guild you can kiss even that goodbye!

[mansa]

There are plenty imo. Also 2 in rinth starter shops and 1 in Nakki starter shops. Also you should mc some because rinth best.

Lol.

My last Rinth PC had to hire a merchant house simply to MC a sheath that was alleysafe. The whole situation was completely ridiculous to me, but it was simply the nature of the thing because there were zero other options available. Now with the MC sub guild you can kiss even that goodbye!

That's not true at all, and you know it.

[gotdamnmiracle]

There are plenty imo. Also 2 in rinth starter shops and 1 in Nakki starter shops. Also you should mc some because rinth best.

Lol.

My last Rinth PC had to hire a merchant house simply to MC a sheath that was alleysafe. The whole situation was completely ridiculous to me, but it was simply the nature of the thing because there were zero other options available. Now with the MC sub guild you can kiss even that goodbye!

That's not true at all, and you know it.

Which part? Am I misunderstanding that the only way to custom craft something now is with the addition of a special sub guild?

Or are you arguing that my PC had other options available? I doubt you would know the circumstances of the situation.

[Armaddict]

Or are you arguing that my PC had other options available? I doubt you would know the circumstances of the situation.

There are other options for sheaths in the alleys.  If the circumstances are special, then you should probably expect special-circumstance-solutions, as well?

[gotdamnmiracle]

Or are you arguing that my PC had other options available? I doubt you would know the circumstances of the situation.

There are other options for sheaths in the alleys.  If the circumstances are special, then you should probably expect special-circumstance-solutions, as well?

Okay. Well why don't you test out that theory and get back to me bacause all of the actual sheaths in game (unless you are counting sheaths in boots for some reason) will get you ganked by the code. Moreover it's a little ridiculous to have rinthers wearing kalich and wormhide because there weren't any usable items made out of materials that are realistic like rags or scraps of leather.

Additionally, you suggest me a solution that doesn't require you to hire a crafter from a House when there are zero indie crafters playing in the Rinth and you want to try to RP atleast a little in an RPI.

It's a symptom of a larger problem that is the Rinth has been neglected badly. A lot of NPCs are dressed nearly identically for how much variety there should be for people who pick through scraps of garbage. I would love to see some of those starting items on some NPCs (specifically shields) and various other things.

A great way to fix the Celf problem would be to start off by breathing some life back into their home.

[Armaddict]

Okay. Well why don't you test out that theory and get back to me bacause all of the actual sheaths in game (unless you are counting sheaths in boots for some reason) will get you ganked by the code.

I've tested out gear in the labyrinth for more than a decade, pretty much since the muggers were put in in the first place.  I'd urge you to investigate items that are freely available in the labyrinth and how some simple swaps in equipment can give you both the utility you need and sheathed weapons in such a way that 'rinthers have their own notable style.

Additionally, you suggest me a solution that doesn't require you to hire a crafter from a House when there are zero indie crafters playing in the Rinth and you want to try to RP atleast a little in an RPI.

See above.

[gotdamnmiracle]

So make allowances for the lack of equipment while every other style has progressed to allow for it? While commoners can wear sheaths my PC can't for no IC reason and I should just deal and try to develop strategies to work around that, huh? Will do.

This is off topic now. My example was used to show how ridiculous it was to get rinthi style equipment.

And while I do appreciate that awesome gatekeeping with the "decade played" if you've got it down to a science then PM me the ones you're thinking of and we can avoid OOCing too much in this setting.

[evilcabbage]

the rinth isn't supposed to have access to everything to begin with.

[Armaddict]

Going back to the original reply...the options are not only available, they're common there, just not in the distinct style that you seem to be attaching some sort of rights to for equality with that statement?

Not a lot of people southside wear the same things as 'rinthers, either.

This is not mean-spirited, I'm not saying don't do what you have to do, but I am saying that maybe if you're stepping out of the norm, then you might expect there to be some out of norm efforts to attain it.  Otherwise...it would probably be the norm there.

[gotdamnmiracle]

the rinth isn't supposed to have access to everything to begin with.

That's not my argument. Why can't they have equivalent items? You realize I could make a sheath out of dirty rags and an old belt right now, right? But since that isn't how crafting works in game you only have a limited number of options, all of which are fancy or at least average things.

Realism falls short due to negligence. It's also why you have elves running around with jewel encrusted swords in the alleys. Because there's no lategame equivalent, so they opt for the super expensive salarri crap and just swat the attackers down like flies. It's hilarious.

In reality they would either be swinging a sharp, but still filth stained sword or those attackers would know they aren't someone to screw with.

[evilcabbage]

because the code is that way, and what lategame equivalent is there for a *shitty* sword? please answer. what *shitty* sword should be lategame equivalent to a jewel encrusted whatever?

[gotdamnmiracle]

This is not mean-spirited, I'm not saying don't do what you have to do, but I am saying that maybe if you're stepping out of the norm, then you might expect there to be some out of norm efforts to attain it.  Otherwise...it would probably be the norm there.

I suppose my point is that while the code progressed in a certain way the Rinth was forgotten. The reason why the sheath is so important is because it can be worn on non-armor locations, not on a belt, and has the sheath/draw code.

Why IC should there be a reason rinth does not have access to their own version of that? So I had one made by hiring a merchant house to do it. I tried to make it as IC as possible, slight threats of going to break knees or kill children if they screwed up, but it hardly felt realistic.

All things equal, it should've never been something that should have to be done. It's a gap in the world. It should be mortared up by staff, helpers, and builders.

[gotdamnmiracle]

because the code is that way, and what lategame equivalent is there for a *shitty* sword? please answer. what *shitty* sword should be lategame equivalent to a jewel encrusted whatever?

Plenty of gith weapons, for one. Which is the alternative they opt for too. Which results in a hilarious import to Nak of weapons that should be left in the pah to rot. As if the gith are some master crafters who have figured out the art of making a 2H weapon under a certain value threshold.

But don't get me wrong, this is Armageddon. In the docs it specifically says that just because it's expensive does not mean it's good. There could be plenty of clubs, axes, and spears made of fairly common goods that could serve as lategame weapons.

Honestly, it just needs to LOOK *shitty*.

[Armaddict]

because the code is that way, and what lategame equivalent is there for a *shitty* sword? please answer. what *shitty* sword should be lategame equivalent to a jewel encrusted whatever?

Plenty of gith weapons, for one. Which is the alternative they opt for too. Which results in a hilarious import to Nak of weapons that should be left in the pah to rot. As if the gith are some master crafters who have figured out the art of making a 2H weapon under a certain value threshold.

Ehhh.  I haven't seen this sort of behavior, but if they're using gith weapons without really emphasizing that the thing is dirty, crude, and actually has a smell to it, then they're not really giving the life it deserves to the thing.  Not to say it's bad to do...

I think the idea of gith weapons being a thing in the 'rinth is actually kinda neat, though I wish it was for an idea other than an arbitrary mug-value.

However.  I do think you've stumbled upon one of the things that has led to anakore claw gloves being removed, and a myriad of other items, which is that the items themselves are not super valuable, but the code utility they have -makes- them valuable, which makes for an odd blend of styles into the game.  As is, wrist-sheathes are seen as a higher-commodity than one on the 'pure realism' scale would assign, and that makes sense given the way the code interacts with the game.

It wouldn't be a big deal if all they did was allow you to hold a weapon in it.  Since it has coded benefits, it has value, and they are, in turn, a more valuable resource in game and uncommon rather than common.

[mansa]

My last Rinth PC had to hire a merchant house simply to MC a sheath that was alleysafe.

There are "sheath" items that are labyrinth safe, some of them have been around for 20 years, and are available in the 'rinth from the clothing shop on occasion.

Now with the MC sub guild you can kiss even that goodbye!

I'm not quite sure what 'that' is, but I have some ideas:
Are you referring to hiring someone in a merchant house, which you said you did?  Why can't you do that now?
Are you referring to "[the ability to] mc some because rinth [is the] best."?  Why can't you do that now?

Am I misunderstanding that the only way to custom craft something now is with the addition of a special sub guild?

Currently, there is one 0 karma subclass and a handful of 1 karma subclasses that allow you to create new items in the game as per the custom craft documentation -> http://armageddon.org/help/view/Custom%20Crafting  There is nothing preventing you from doing that now?


Original post:

One problem I DO have however is the apparent lack of alley safe shields. ... I'm aware these exist, but the number is so low you get one of three different flavors. I'd just like to point this out to those builders or crafters interested in such things.

I agree!   Maybe we can have a thread created in the 'Player Collaboration' thread requesting 'rinth items to be written, and then some enterprising player could use them to put into the game.   Or maybe some staff might do it anyways, because they were bored.

[gotdamnmiracle]

Yes. I agree with that. So it's a shame that in those cases often a request for various alternative items seems to fall on deaf ears and will often see ridiculously slow change when left to the playerbase to custom craft those alternatives (in competition with the things they'd much rather custom craft).

[evilcabbage]

then pay people to craft it in game.

[gotdamnmiracle]

As I understood it you had to have the subclass to custom craft. Period. Those 1 karma ex-classes are moot because you cannot have them and the subclass.

If I'm wrong... then yeah, power to the people. Go forth and custom craft if you agree with me! I'll join you once my current PC eats it.

[evilcabbage]

some extended subguilds, as confirmed by staff elsewhere, can in fact custom craft.