Versatile subguild

[MeTekillot]

A subguild choice that would let you elect to forget current subguild skills to receive different subguild skills at 'novice' throughout your character's life. Could cap at 2-4 skills at journeyman-advanced depending on the skills and which in what number, possibly with a CGP cost to select higher-abuzability skills in higher numbers. Could also be a Versatile Elementalist that lets you switch between the different paths of magick at the cost of needing to forsake all your current magickal knowledge in that subset of the Element.

EDIT: Early-branched skills would not be kept on skill switching unless you had already had appropriate skill levels to branch it.

EDIT:EDIT: Benefits are that it lets people constantly have the option of doing something new with their character without offering them insane coded power without the grind everyone else needs to be competent in whatever thing they do.

[650Booger]

I don't like it, for realisms sake.

"I used to be great at lockpicking, but now I've completely forgotten everything I ever knew.  The good news is I learned how to make swords instead!"

[MeTekillot]

The slight bent of being unrealistic is bent towards balance and fun's sake. Represents you totally turning your efforts toward learning a new skill at the cost of keeping practiced at something else.

[Brokkr]

The entire way that skills work currently is not versatile enough to support this.

[MeTekillot]

The entire way that skills work currently
is not versatile enough to support this.

Please. If there is support for it and a budger of coding resources. Thank you have a nice day

[crymerci]

How about a way to postpone subguild choice?

[MeTekillot]

No, that's a different thing from what I want here, which is a lifetime of (limited) versatility at the cost of middling to high competence without reaching absolute expertise.

[Inks]

This makes no sense. I can't suddenly forget all my skills and re-skill after making all my coin craft length into few. How would this make sense ic? Is your pc that guy from Momento? (The magick thing could happen because magick.)

I might be reading it wrong though, sorry if so!

[Cind]

I really like being able to postpone choosing your subguild. I think I'd rather have that, more often than not, and after spending a few RL days sinking my boots into the mud, I can get to choose how I cry for help then.

[Heade]

Yeah, postponing subguild choice seems more realistic than an ever-changing subguild.

[MeTekillot]

Realistic would be being able to learn any skill at all if you just kept trying, which we don't have.

[Heade]

Realistic would be being able to learn any skill at all if you just kept trying, which we don't have.

But the whole idea of a skill list is representative of the idea that, IRL, people must dedicate themselves to a particular set of skills to eventually become world-class in those skills, excluding others. Depending on the skill, that can take a lifetime, or can peak at athletic fitness in their 20's or 30's, but regardless, people don't generally learn -everything- about everything after being a professional basketball player.

This limitation is in place so that we get to interact with realistic characters who aren't masters-of-all-trades.

Moving forward with this conversation, bearing that in mind, it is a perfectly reasonable statement, then to say:

"Yeah, postponing subguild choice seems more realistic than an ever-changing subguild."

Because, yeah, sometimes pro basketball players later become sports commentators, which would explain a delayed subguild choice. But they're never as good as commentators who have always been professional commentators, and even a laymen with no sports knowledge can look at a panel of commentators and guess with reasonable accuracy which one is there because they were a famous player, and which ones are there because that's what they've focused their career on.

Of course, there are exceptions like John Madden and Tektolnes, but players don't generally get to play those incredible exceptions. I -do- encourage you to spec app being able to play Tek, though.

EDIT: I would be OK opening up consideration for the idea of every character getting or branching just about every mundane skill up to low novice, though. That would allow at least -attempts- to do things that don't really make a lot of sense for your class.

[Marc]

Except that subguilds usually represent a characters background; what they have been before chargen.  Subguilds are also where magick is distributed.

Delaying picking class until 1d played would be sweet in certain situations, but you'd have to police it heavily.  Is it worth it?

[MeTekillot]

Christ, no, why would you need to police it? I don't even fucking know why we have karma requirements for extended subguilds.

[Brytta Léofa]

Except that subguilds usually represent a characters background; what they have been before chargen.

I think that's less the case today than historically, with the new classes getting somewhat higher starting levels in their core skills.

Subguilds are also where magick is distributed.

Right now, the is_magicker flag (so to speak) is set from chargen regardless of whether your character has ever used magick or knows he can. I don't think there's any lore reason this must be so. The idea of an elementalist's ability "manifesting" at some point (prior to which nobody, including himself, knew he was a stinkin' wiggler) is pretty well established, as is the idea that sorcery is something learned rather than inborn.

Having potential magick users being completely undetectable until they select a magick subguild post-chargen (or cast their first spell / gather mana, or whatever) seems viable.

Delaying picking class until 1d played would be sweet in certain situations, but you'd have to police it heavily.  Is it worth it?

I think you're talking about karma cost, and that can be done in a completely straightforward way: subguild karma available = current max karma - racial karma cost - main guild karma cost (if any)

Maybe this leads to two-karma people creating a desert elf when they've got only one karma available and then delaying subguild selection until they regenerate a karma so they can choose a one-karma subguild. But that...really seems okay to me.

[Heade]

I think you're talking about karma cost, and that can be done in a completely straightforward way: subguild karma available = current max karma - racial karma cost - main guild karma cost (if any)

From what I understand, this isn't how karma currently works. If you have, say 2 karma, you can currently select ALL 2 karma options on a single character. So, if you picked a 2 karma race, plus 2 karma guild, plus 2 karma subguild, it wouldn't cost 6 karma. It would cost 2.

So, in keeping it uniform with that, I'd suggest that karma options for sub simply be "unlocked" at chargen at whatever karma you had when you made that character, if they implemented this change. Honestly, due to the karma system though, the more I think about it, the less it sounds like something that would be worth the effort to code.

I think I'd rather just have a custom guild option. That seems like a more worthwhile effort, and something that could actually be implemented with relative ease.