Rpt always 8-10 pm server time.

[Razzbane]

Hi folks, i'm playing already over 2 months in arma but haven't been on single event because it is always between 8-10 pm server time. Its too late for me, i understand its peak time but other timezones suffer from it. I bet arma lost dozens of players because of that. No events makes this game boring for longer period of time.

Please consider making events earlier or even later. Not always 8-10 pm all year.

[MarshallDFX]

A common refrain in the last player staff meeting was to target a squad of leaders from off-peak timezones .

[Lizzie]

Having sponsored role leaders available off-peak doesn't help at all, when the OTHER people needed to be there, are not available. Promoted leaders (as opposed to sponsored role leaders) are available when they're available. And then there's the whole coordination thing. If only a single person who's available at 6PM server time is needed to run the entire event, that's great. But when was the last time you ever saw that?

I've missed plenty because I know something that starts at 9, isn't something I'd be able to do much with. I might get to see the start of it but when stuff gets REALLY interesting an hour later? That's when I have to log out.

My only suggestion is to create an RPT, and lead it at your own convenience. Maybe join the Byn, get promoted to Sergeant, and run scheduled practice patrols. Just don't get too upset when most people can't attend. It's called peak time because that's when MOST people can attend. Not because it's a specific time of day.

If most people could attend at 4 in the morning, then peak time would be 4 in the morning.

Doesn't make it any more convenient, knowing all of this but - players schedule things when they think the "people who probably should be there most" will actually be able to be there.

[Riev]

As Lizzie said, it is just an unfortunate sense of timing. There is only so much to be done when you have an RPT that involves 4-5 key people who only have 11pm Server as their overlap.

I primarily play from 10am server time when people are in the single digits. It is an adjustment, but you find that anything you see another player, its an impromptu RPT.

[Nao]

What sort of RPT absolutely requires 4 to 5 key people, though? When I have been able to attend, I have seen at most one or two that are irreplaceable. I honestly don't get it. Would the thing get canceled if one or two suddenly got sick, ICly?

The 'whenever most people can attend' paradigm honestly sucks. Because it ends up with peak players getting it all, every single time, and everyone else being left out, every single time. What is the problem with tossing us a bone and doing this at 2 PM or so on a weekend every once in a while?

Re: Do it yourself - this is a bit of a chicken-egg problem. Players who don't attend key events are less likely to get promoted, and far less likely to have the leadership and politics experience that's required for most sponsored roles.

[Hauwke]

A spider nest clearing RPT needs way more than 4 or 5 guys. 4 or 5 guys is usually the losses on such a trip.

The plays that were held IG a little bit ago required 4 or 5 people to do it, so that everything made sense.

An arena RPT needs 4 or 5 people to go ahead, the guy doing the calling, and a couple fighters to make things interesting.

Conversely, there are plenty of things that only need a pair of or three people to be fun, but they are often improved for all with more people. Parties for example, sure, you only need the one guy organizing the party to be there, but show of hands: Who wants to throw a party, spending a good chunk of energy on it, for just yourself?

[Nao]

A spider nest clearing RPT needs way more than 4 or 5 guys. 4 or 5 guys is usually the losses on such a trip.

Alright, but I don't think every single Byn or combat RPT needs to be a spider nest clearing.

An arena RPT needs 4 or 5 people to go ahead, the guy doing the calling, and a couple fighters to make things interesting.

That makes for one caller that's essential, but the fighters? You don't need those specific players, they're replaceable. You'd probably run into the chicken-egg problem again, because - people don't app gladiators if they can't be online at the RPT times. Absolutely fixable, though.

Conversely, there are plenty of things that only need a pair of or three people to be fun, but they are often improved for all with more people. Parties for example, sure, you only need the one guy organizing the party to be there, but show of hands: Who wants to throw a party, spending a good chunk of energy on it, for just yourself?

Earlier in the day, there are usually 20 to 30 people online. For a party RPT, you'd probably get some logging on that wouldn't normally be there. There's just no way you'd be all alone for a party RPT.

[Lizzie]

Earlier in the day, there are usually 20 to 30 people online. For a party RPT, you'd probably get some logging on that wouldn't normally be there. There's just no way you'd be all alone for a party RPT.

Then organize one when you're around. There's no rule stating that only clan leaders are allowed to organize RPTs. You don't have to be in a clan at all. There've been plenty of RPTs organized by non-clan-leaders in the past, some went well, some not so well.

Put it on the tavern board, send a note to the independent staff that you're planning it, and enjoy the results of your hard work at 2 in the afternoon when most people in the USA are at work and can't play, but most everyone else is available.

I've run card games, impromptu drinking parties, arranged sales for rich people, had an auction, all off-peak. Not at 2 in the morning, but certainly mid-day. There's no reason why you can't do the same.

I think this is where "be the change" is most appropriate.

[Razzbane]

Guys with this attitude armageddon never will have healthy non-US amount of players. It seems arma is struggling with disease called "we don't play on off-peak hours" - thats probably one of reasons why arma playerbase is quite low. Even on peak time.

[Delirium]

I'm not sure what you expect peak players to do.

This sounds like an opportunity for off-peak players to take initiative and start organizing some Rpts.

[Riev]

First, can we stop this "us vs them" mentality? We're all playing the same fucking game, and the peak players aren't some elite 1% to rail against.

Second, I play while at work and VERY RARELY can I get on later or on weekends. Often when I do, I find I don't recognize half the people because we just don't play at the same times.

Third, off-peak newbies don't really have the ability to throw their own RPT because they don't often see them to know what they CAN do or what is EXPECTED. It is a little like saying "Well I rebuilt the engine block of my car, you can just do that too!" Sure, but you can't expect them to have any of the pre-req knowledge.

Fourth, plenty happens before and after peak hours, but the entire game is in a very "cooperative, behind clan doors" phase right now. Tight knit groups of people play together, and its not that they aren't OPEN to more people, but they have their "DnD Group" and they're out doing things, while some of us are waiting to be invited. Find other people waiting around, figure out what they're about, and see if they're someone you'd want to hang around with. Honestly? The movers are shakers are often too busy moving and shaking to be around to notice you're waiting to join.

Fifth, being alone in a clan is the WORST. FEELING. EVER. PERIOD. Whether you're a schedule-person or not, there is nothing more boring than doing what you're supposed to do, but nobody else is around and you can't codedly advance (a year as a Bynner should see SOME advancement). And then when you fuck off and go DO something fun, you're punished ICly because suddenly the "world came alive". Staff can support this, partially, but you know whats worse than being alone in your clan? Being alone in you clan, with a staffer who is not able to be active when you are. As I understand it, there is currently no OFFICIAL way to say "Hey, I know Brokkr can't be around when I play, and he's my staffer, so can I switch to Seidhr instead?" because Seidhr still needs to pass everything through Brokkr so he is updated.

Sixth, I just wanted to go past five.

[nauta]

Sixth, I just wanted to go past five.

First, I couldn't disagree more about six, but you know my views on numbers above five by now, so I'll pass it over it in silence (darüber muss man schweigen).

Second, I wrote this up a bit ago and I'm still thinking about how to present it, and it is only slightly related, but it might be good to have a HOWTO guide about RPTs: what are they? what kinds of them are there? how do I join them? how are staff involved or not involved in them? how can I host my own?

http://gdb.armageddon.org/index.php/topic,53552.0.html

Otherwise, a lot of good food for thought up above about the issue of peak vs. off-peak, although in my view the question should be: granted I'm an off-peaker, how do I have or make fun?  (How do I find other people?  What sorts of plots could I realistically pursue? etc.)

[Delirium]

Yes, but we can't very well start playing at 3am in the morning when we have work in 5 hours.

I like the idea of having a helpfile or some documentation as Nauta describes above.

[stoicreader]

I'm an off peek player mostly, occasional prime time. Very rare.

I've never played an RPT. I don't know what the big deal is. Seems like your screen would just be spammed with words and quotes.

But also, I rarely see players let alone clans. I see this game as a solo game with occasional player interaction to drive motivations.

[Eyeball]

Why not some on Saturday or Sunday afternoons (server time)?

Pacific would be late morning.

Eastern would be early afternoon.

Europe would be early to mid evening.

Seems to work for all.

[Riev]

I will say that on my last Byn Sergeant, because of my playtimes, I often tried to run RPTs at 2pm-3pm Server Time, but I also had a few people who played during that playtime to come with me. We never got the "EXTERMINATE A HUNDRED SPIDERS!!!!" RPTs, but we had a few interesting outings that got people together, killed, or otherwise.

Sometimes it just takes a leader, but having a Jal Noble on early in the week doesn't necessarily mean Jal Parties in the Sewers all day, either. Byn is easy because "everyone wants to join the Byn". Sometimes, you just need to forestall belief for a moment and get together with people you might not NORMALLY play with, and set up a card game, or negotiate a trade of a bunch of rocks you don't REALLY ned.

[Razzbane]

I've never played an RPT. I don't know what the big deal is. Seems like your screen would just be spammed with words and quotes.

But also, I rarely see players let alone clans. I see this game as a solo game with occasional player interaction to drive motivations.

Thats it. We heard legends about Rpt every weekend, but we never been on any.

I saw this game as solo game too, because there are not too many off-peak players online and if there happens someone then he/she isn't too actively rping. Luckily i joined my clan in right time and we have clan peak time muchly earlier than rest of server.

[Delirium]

When I tried to run RPTs at midday during weekends it was touch and go how many people would attend. I'm all for trying that more consistently but on the flip side you really can't blame people for staging RPTs at the times when they are most able to run them and can expect the most reliable turnout. You cannot expect people to bend over backwards to stage RPTs at times that are not convenient to them on a regular basis.

If you do, check your expectations at the door. This is a game.

I have sympathy for off-peak players but I don't have sympathy for expecting peak players to become offpeak players because off-peak players feel lonely. Vote. Recruit your friends. Be interesting. Deal with it in a way that makes sense rather than clamoring for others to inconvenience themselves for your sake.

[Nao]

Put it on the tavern board, send a note to the independent staff that you're planning it, and enjoy the results of your hard work at 2 in the afternoon when most people in the USA are at work and can't play, but most everyone else is available.

Thus the "on the weekend" part of the 2PM suggestion. Some people need to work on weekends, but I don't think that's the majority and plenty of US players (maybe even most of them) would be able to make it.

Nobody is asking to move the new default time for RPTs to some off-peak timeslot. It would just be nice if the movers and shakers (who are in clanned leadership positions for 95% of RPTs...) would at least consider moving them to another timeslot on occasion. There are reasonable options outside of US work hours or the middle of the night.

Just do it yourself.

Organizing pretty much anything without a clan, or as a grunt? Gets inifintely more complicated. Outside of a clan, you have no clan boards, no ooc way to coordinate playtimes. Want two other players to get involved in the play? You have to catch them both at the same time, or pass messages back and forth, and by the time you're done, one of your unclanned buddies has probably died.

The stuff you can do without clan support and access to the clan's resources (storage space and whatnot) is also pretty limited.

As a grunt inside of a clan? You have to clear absolutely everything with your clan leaders, probably have rules against going places by yourself, and very limited options to make money.

The reason this is not happening right now is not "there's nobody online or willing to log on for an RPT".

[Riev]

Your opinion is woefully misinformed.

[Riev]

Ok buddy.

Not only have there been RPTs in this time slot before, but "all the important stuff that has happened in Zalanthas happened between 9pm-12am" is pure hyperbole.

It doesn't happen often, no. You might see 30 players, but 5 are in allanak, 3 are in Red Storm, 9 are desert elves, another 5 are traveling, 6 are AFK behind their compound gates...

There have been RPTs in off-peak times. It isn't a culture thing, they are just rare. Its not that we aren't "used to it", but OFTEN it requires a sponsored role/leadership position to be available and those are OFTEN more available during peak play times.

Find a staff interested in your plot. Talk with them about it, and tell them how you plan to involve other players. Pray three times to the east and hope they're not going to go AFK on you for 3 weeks. Then make an RPT. Its not hard, its JUST. RARE.

[Rahnevyn]

Please stay positive in this thread. I'd generally like to see suggestions about how to throw RPTs or coordinate players at off-peak times. Let's avoid telling other people they are wrong and instead focus on ways to make things better.

[Rahnevyn]

On topic, this may sound overly simple, but to get more stuff happening outside peak, there are a few things we can do more of.

1. Throw more offpeak events (if you can, don't feel obligated)

2. Attend more offpeak events (if you can, don't feel obligated)

Not all events need to be Big Major Things or require you to be a clan leader. You can be an indie merchant displaying your crafts, or a miner who wants to go out in a group for a larger haul, or a gambler throwing a card game, etc. Don't be shy to start small, just get something started. There are the in city rumor boards and the Player Announcements forum to help with promotion. Even if you have no ideas, see point 2.

I was sad to see the sentiment that Armageddon feels like a solo game. Armageddon is an RPI. Our key focus is roleplaying and immersive storytelling. We do sort of okay as a single player roguelike, but honestly that's not our thing and other games do it a lot better. If there are ways anyone can think of to improve interaction off peak, I'd love to hear them, but again, please try to steer the conversation away from telling other players to play differently or at different times.

[Rahnevyn]

I think the problem is that those parts of the day are really unsupported, yet staff support is needed for most things that matter. If you're in a clan, odds are pretty high that your clan staffer is American. I don't know how many staffers are off-peak themselves, but maybe the ones that are there need more leeway to cover more ground, like standing in as clan staff even if they aren't assigned to that clan.

There are staff available to support at all times of the day. If you need support from a specific clan, and that clan's staff member can't play at your times, we will find another staff member to cover for us. This is best organized through the request took and it is true whether you play on or off peak.

[Veselka]

I think there's typically been an incredible effort, especially for long festival events, to throw a few Off-Peak events into the mix. Staff have been great about recruiting a leader into a 1-3 Leadership PC clan that hits Off Peak (The Byn, for example). In an ideal world, yes, we would have the playerbase to support having peak through off-peak activity, but that just isn't the case these days. There's generally more of a spread out playerbase -- Peak has moved to be much more off-peak than it was 6 or 10 years ago. It's more even throughout, and I rarely see the numbers dip to below 20 throughout the day, even in the early morning PST.

Yes -- I think we could do better to accommodate  people who are GMT and off peak. But it's been an American-Centric Population since inception, and that's where the major part of the playerbase is. So that's when the RPTs will typically be scheduled to accommodate.

Speaking as a 'Peak Player' who's been in leadership roles -- I will usually inquire with other parties when it would be best to schedule, and I try to include people who are off-peak and may be able to make it if it were a little earlier, or a little later. But at the end of the day, I also have a life to live -- So if I have to stay up till 2AM to make it happen for someone else, I have to weigh what is going on in my life and if I can compromise in that manner. I have to weigh all of the other Players who might be involved, and if it will put them out more than it will put out this off-peak person less. It isn't a simple equation, it requires nuance and careful consideration.

What i've done before is (when possible) have 2 RPTs, where one is geared more towards peak, and the other, more off-peak, if I have the schedule to swing it, and it ICly makes sense. For example, having a long Byn Patrol for Peak, and one for Off Peak. Another thing I might do is extended to be a RL week long, so we 'station' in a certain part of the world, so when off-peak log in, they will have the interaction focused there.

Again -- Festivals (especially the long ones) have all had at least 1, if not 2 or 3, events designed to allow off-peak players to participate. I don't find this to be an endemic problem of the game, if anything, our playerbase and Staff address it far more than most other games i've participated in.